Most Underrated/Overrated Players in the NBA?

[TheStig]

Originally Posted by houheffna

Your last paragraph, was god awful man...compared to NOBODY is Kobe one dimensional. I brought Kobe up because you used to say that about him as if he can't do anything else well. He is an excellent defender and ball handler. My point is that you stressed Kobe as one dimensional but you don't see it in Ben Gordon?

Well as far as BG goes, Vinny Del Negro and I disagree with you, which is why they sat his ass down in closing minutes of the playoffs. That way, he "really isn't a problem defensively".

Compared to Bron he is.

VDN sat rose for most of the 4th quarter for part of the year too. Do two wrongs now make a right?

[TheStig]

Originally Posted by RamiTheBullsFan

1) Kobe Bryant
2) Dwyane Wade
3) Brandon Roy
4) Manu Ginobili
5) Joe Johnson
6) Tyreke Evans
7) Monta Ellis
8) O.J. Mayo
9) Stephen Jackson
10) Ray Allen
11) Vince Carter
12) Jamal Crawford
13) Eric Gordon
14) Kevin Martin
15) Jason Richardson
16) Jason Terry
17) Ben Gordon
18) Gilbert Arenas (not including Allen Iverson)
19) John Salmons
20) Richard Hamilton
21) Michael Redd
22) J.R. Smith

that's where I'd put him.

Evans and Arenas both play PG. But if BG is healthy and Rip gets traded, he can be up their with Mayo imo.

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Originally Posted by TheStig

Evans and Arenas both play PG. But if BG is healthy and Rip gets traded, he can be up their with Mayo imo.

Tyreke Evans definitely played the majority of his floor time at the 2 last year (with Beno Udrih). He seems more like a D-Wade type of guard to me than a typical 1. Gilbert Arenas has always been a combo-guard, but with Wall and Hinrich on the Wizards next year, I definitely see him as a 2 guy also.

We'll see how Ben Gordon does next year, because 2009-10 was a pretty shitty year for him with the injuries and all. He never seemed to me like a guy who could score at will, and like somebody here said before... he's the type of guy that is a liability on the defensive end. He's a guy who should be defending the Keith Bogans and bruce Bowens of the NBA...

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Originally Posted by TheStig

Compared to Bron he is.

VDN sat rose for most of the 4th quarter for part of the year too. Do two wrongs now make a right?

Kobe Bryant is a much more versatile scorer and has a better skillset than Lebron James.

Both of those guys are extremely versatile players, in general. LeBron obviously has the passing and rebounding over Kobe. But Kobe has the lock-down defense and post-up and dead-eye shooting skills that James does not have perfected.

[TheStig]

Originally Posted by RamiTheBullsFan

Kobe Bryant is a much more versatile scorer and has a better skillset than Lebron James.

Both of those guys are extremely versatile players, in general. LeBron obviously has the passing and rebounding over Kobe. But Kobe has the lock-down defense and post-up and dead-eye shooting skills that James does not have perfected.

I don't know about the defense anymore. Bron finished top 5 in dpoy votes and Kobe didn't even finish in the top 10. I'd hardly call Kobe a dead eye shooter, he shot a worse fg and 3pt% than Bron last year.

[TheStig]

Originally Posted by RamiTheBullsFan

Tyreke Evans definitely played the majority of his floor time at the 2 last year (with Beno Udrih). He seems more like a D-Wade type of guard to me than a typical 1. Gilbert Arenas has always been a combo-guard, but with Wall and Hinrich on the Wizards next year, I definitely see him as a 2 guy also.

We'll see how Ben Gordon does next year, because 2009-10 was a pretty shitty year for him with the injuries and all. He never seemed to me like a guy who could score at will, and like somebody here said before... he's the type of guy that is a liability on the defensive end. He's a guy who should be defending the Keith Bogans and bruce Bowens of the NBA...

Evans played about half and half. Arenas though played all his minutes at pg last year. Obviously with Wall he will play more sg.

I think he will. The only thing that will be holding him back is the cluster fuck roster Detroit has. If he gets the minutes he will produce. But I really think your underrating his D. He wasn't Kirk but he was average on that end. For what he lacked in instinct, he made up by being able to play in the system.

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Originally Posted by TheStig

I don't know about the defense anymore. Bron finished top 5 in dpoy votes and Kobe didn't even finish in the top 10. I'd hardly call Kobe a dead eye shooter, he shot a worse fg and 3pt% than Bron last year.

the DPOY and all-first team votes are pretty much all b.s. Kobe Bryant and LeBron James have no business in the top 5 as defenders. Top 20? Maybe... top 5 (like ESPN would have you believe)... hell no...

LeBron James is definitely the most efficient scorer- no doubt. But the reason is because LeBron James has, by far, the superior physique over Bryant. He gets a lot more easy, fast-break points than Bryant too.

If we are talking about flat-out shooting stroke, Kobe>LeBron in that aspect. He also has the superior high-post game.

[RamiTheBullsFan]

Originally Posted by TheStig

Evans played about half and half. Arenas though played all his minutes at pg last year. Obviously with Wall he will play more sg.

I think he will. The only thing that will be holding him back is the cluster fuck roster Detroit has. If he gets the minutes he will produce. But I really think your underrating his D. He wasn't Kirk but he was average on that end. For what he lacked in instinct, he made up by being able to play in the system.

The main problem with Gordon is that he is impossible to hide... since he has no decent PG skills on offense, it's a given that you cannot have another SG alongside him in the backcourt.

Another PG + Ben Gordon = pretty much always undersized on defense.

It's pretty much pick your poison because BG is too small to defend most SGs and he's too slow to guard most PGs...

If you play Gordon as your PG, at least you won't lack size on defense, but then you are going to have a pretty stalled offense.

[TheStig]

Originally Posted by RamiTheBullsFan

The main problem with Gordon is that he is impossible to hide... since he has no decent PG skills on offense, it's a given that you cannot have another SG alongside him in the backcourt.

Another PG + Ben Gordon = pretty much always undersized on defense.

It's pretty much pick your poison because BG is too small to defend most SGs and he's too slow to guard most PGs...

If you play Gordon as your PG, at least you won't lack size on defense, but then you are going to have a pretty stalled offense.

Again I disagree. He played decent defense his last year here. As I said to xfactor, if he was so bad defensively, it should be easy to find games where he got lit up. It doesn't happen often. So I don't think you can call him a liability. He isn't an asset on that end either.

[TheStig]

Originally Posted by RamiTheBullsFan

the DPOY and all-first team votes are pretty much all b.s. Kobe Bryant and LeBron James have no business in the top 5 as defenders. Top 20? Maybe... top 5 (like ESPN would have you believe)... hell no...

LeBron James is definitely the most efficient scorer- no doubt. But the reason is because LeBron James has, by far, the superior physique over Bryant. He gets a lot more easy, fast-break points than Bryant too.

If we are talking about flat-out shooting stroke, Kobe>LeBron in that aspect. He also has the superior high-post game.

Again, the facts speak for themselves. Those votes might have their flaws here and there but that doesn't explain the wide gap. Bron being more efficent doesn't explain why he shot a better 3pt% something that would help define a shooter.9