Cubs vs Cards 6/26-6/28

[Shawon0Meter]

making this thread just in time for a Cardinal walk off in all likelihood

 

[chibears55]

Left 12 men on base.. that the sad story of this soon to be lost

 

[Diehardfan]

Games like this when you miss Ramierez....on the other when hand you get 12 hits and score only 2 runs, you pretty much have beaten yourself.

 

[chibears55]

Week started out great beating Kershaw and Greinke, 3 losses later
and a rookie making his debut tomorrow. . not a good ending

Desperately need Soler back in lineup and Olt bat on the bench

 

[Diehardfan]

I'm so sick of the damn Cardinals....the only good thing about St. Louis is the Blues. You can always count on them to choke in the playoffs.

 

[TL1961]

HR to a guy who didn't even have one in AAA. Double to Bourjous who stinks as a hitter. Get the ground ball we need, and Baxter can't throw a ball 75 feet!

We have added some real talent, but we still have far too many guys who have no place on a real contender.

Hererra and Baxter? Gone!

And frankly Fowler can go too. Striking out at lead off and playing bad D in CF doesn't work for me. (And YES, his D in CF is BAD)

 

[TL1961]

The game was lost when Joe pulled Jake an inning too early.

 

[CSF77]

Meh. This usually happens when a starter just shuts down at team. They get a new life vs the easier arm and it pays off. More of a mental thing.

The real issue was the O.

Hate to say it but it seems like it is either Rizzo hitting or Bryant hitting on any given day. It is very rare when both are on a tear together. The rest of the line up is marginal.

Lead off: .237
#4: .249#5: .248, #6: .260, #7: .293...Ya Baxter jumped up after a 3 hit game. Russell .251

So the rest of the line up has put out a avg of between .248-.260. That is really not that good.

So in reality the O lacks depth. It falls off after Bryant and Rizzo. Makes me question the wisdom of keeping Schwarber in AAA when he could be active in LF.

 

[SilenceS]

Cardinals are a much better team then us. I watch them a lot. They are extremely fundamental and get big hits. Cubs are talented but shit the bed a good bit. This will not be the Cubs two or three years from now but right now very much so. Cards are hanging by a string though. Their pitching is everything. They have little offense and superb defense. You get 4 runs on them then you can beat them. You don't then you are going to lose. They don't make mistakes. Cubs are coming but it isn't this year.

 

[chibears55]

Yes the lack of offense hurt but if Arrieta doesn't go the 9th on Sunday and throw the extra 20 pitches, is he then able to pitch the 8th in a 1 run game against the Cardinals. ...

This is why i said Sunday he shouldn't of pitched the 9th cause it may have cost him and team in a meaningful game. .

 

[TC in Mississippi]

Cardinals are a much better team then us. I watch them a lot. They are extremely fundamental and get big hits. Cubs are talented but shit the bed a good bit. This will not be the Cubs two or three years from now but right now very much so. Cards are hanging by a string though. Their pitching is everything. They have little offense and superb defense. You get 4 runs on them then you can beat them. You don't then you are going to lose. They don't make mistakes. Cubs are coming but it isn't this year.

I could not agree more. Enjoy the ups and don't worry to much about the downs. If this team makes the Wild Card it should be considered a bonus and a learning experience, not an expectation or a path to the World Series.

 

[TC in Mississippi]

Yes the lack of offense hurt but if Arrieta doesn't go the 9th on Sunday and throw the extra 20 pitches, is he then able to pitch the 8th in a 1 run game against the Cardinals. ...

This is why i said Sunday he shouldn't of pitched the 9th cause it may have cost him and team in a meaningful game. .

I agreed with you then and now but how do you tell Arietta, in that game, to go sit down? Sometimes you have to let the guys have one.

 

[Parade_Rain]

I could not agree more. Enjoy the ups and don't worry to much about the downs. If this team makes the Wild Card it should be considered a bonus and a learning experience, not an expectation or a path to the World Series.

I expect them to make the wildcard. That's the spot they've played themselves into. I expect the $155 mil pitcher who was signed on the off season to pitch like something other than a rookie. I expect the team to do better as pieces like Soler get healthy.

 

[CSF77]

Yes the lack of offense hurt but if Arrieta doesn't go the 9th on Sunday and throw the extra 20 pitches, is he then able to pitch the 8th in a 1 run game against the Cardinals. ...

This is why i said Sunday he shouldn't of pitched the 9th cause it may have cost him and team in a meaningful game. .

His PC was 102. It is not like they pulled him after 80. You are making a issue out of a non issue. What do you want? Him to go another 120 pitches just to bypass Strop?

Stop has days like this. Gets wrecked. But the fact Jake was so dominate I'll bet any pitcher who comes in after would have gotten tagged.

Anyways the real issue is the lack of run support. Cubs need to be able to put up 4 runs in a game more often. Getting Soler back should help. With him back they can make the line up Fowler, Bryant, Rizzo, Soler, Montero, Castro, Coghlan, Pitcher, Russell. That is a huge improvement.

 

[SilenceS]

I expect them to make the wildcard. That's the spot they've played themselves into. I expect the $155 mil pitcher who was signed on the off season to pitch like something other than a rookie. I expect the team to do better as pieces like Soler get healthy.

Eh, on the same token do you expect Hammel to keep a sub 2 era? I don't. It's baseball. Shit balances out. Some of these kids are going to get tired wen the season becomes grueling. I'm not saying they won't be a wild card team but it wouldn't surprise me if they miss it by a couple of games


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[Parade_Rain]

Eh, on the same token do you expect Hammel to keep a sub 2 era? I don't. It's baseball. Shit balances out. Some of these kids are going to get tired wen the season becomes grueling. I'm not saying they won't be a wild card team but it wouldn't surprise me if they miss it by a couple of games


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I expect Hammel to have a couple of bad outings. Otherwise I expect him to continue doing what he is doing. For whatever reason he is a much better Cub than he is elsewhere. He has had a year to fail as a Cub and revert to something else.

If they miss the WC by 2 games, they miss the WC by 2 games. It isn't going g to change my expectation based upon where they are now and I doubt the locker room has lowered their expectation to be 2 games out of the WC.

 

[CSF77]

Fowler: .237/.315/.391
Rizzo: .307/.417/.577
Bryant: .277/.379/.471
Montero: .249/.360/.424
Castro: .260/.293/.337
Coghlan: .248/.337/.430
Baxter: Not bothering. not enough AB's
......
Russell: .251/.315/.399

One of the problems with the line up is they are using Russell and Fowler to feed their 2 top RBI guys. Both are at .315 OBA. The best 2 options to feed those 2 are Denorfia at a .375 OBA and Coghlan with a .337 OBA.

So thinking like that tweaking the line up to:
Denorfia .375 OBA
Rizzo .417 OBA
Bryant .379 OBA
Montero: .360 OBA
Russell .315 OBA
Fowler: .315 OBA
Castro .293 OBA
Pitcher
Coghlan .337 OBA

I would try that to feed Rizzo and Bryant more. Castro's OBA is just bad right now. Fowler is making a case why he should not be retained. But his HR power would be useful lower in the line up.

 

[SilenceS]

Fowler: .237/.315/.391
Rizzo: .307/.417/.577
Bryant: .277/.379/.471
Montero: .249/.360/.424
Castro: .260/.293/.337
Coghlan: .248/.337/.430
Baxter: Not bothering. not enough AB's
......
Russell: .251/.315/.399

One of the problems with the line up is they are using Russell and Fowler to feed their 2 top RBI guys. Both are at .315 OBA. The best 2 options to feed those 2 are Denorfia at a .375 OBA and Coghlan with a .337 OBA.

So thinking like that tweaking the line up to:
Denorfia .375 OBA
Rizzo .417 OBA
Bryant .379 OBA
Montero: .360 OBA
Russell .315 OBA
Fowler: .315 OBA
Castro .293 OBA
Pitcher
Coghlan .337 OBA

I would try that to feed Rizzo and Bryant more. Castro's OBA is just bad right now. Fowler is making a case why he should not be retained. But his HR power would be useful lower in the line up.

I wish Castro bat would miss more balls. He seems always able to make contact and keep it fair. Thats not a good thing when its a pitchers pitch. I know he said earlier this month he was looking breaking ball to much and was late on fastballs. He did this when he had his bad year. I don't know if its people giving him advice or he is doing it on his own but he just needs to go out there and play. He is not a thinker so don't over think it.

 

[CSF77]

I wish Castro bat would miss more balls. He seems always able to make contact and keep it fair. Thats not a good thing when its a pitchers pitch. I know he said earlier this month he was looking breaking ball to much and was late on fastballs. He did this when he had his bad year. I don't know if its people giving him advice or he is doing it on his own but he just needs to go out there and play. He is not a thinker so don't over think it.

11 BB and 49 SO's. You look at Russell he is at 70 SO's in 203 AB's. Soler 67 in 189. So these 2 are showing their rookie struggles.

Fowler: 69 SO and 30 BB. It is pretty good ratio but his BA is just killing him. I personally would like to see if his power would play up more hitting in the middle.

Denorfia is just hitting in general. .338 BA. You have to ride that more until it putters out. Lead off with him and see if he can spark the line up more.

 

[CSF77]

Well at least we can see what Donn Roach does against major league hitting. He should hold the advantage as there is not much info on him yet.