OT: McNabb "I am a HOF'er"

[Warrior Spirit]

Mcnabb wasnt a mobile QB and most QB's under Reid have "wins" but not the big one

C'mon, PIB, wasn't mobile? Came out of college with ~ 4.6 40 and specifically remember an NFL game in which he had the most QB rushing yards in that game since a game in which Bobby Douglas had just a couple more yards. Did more running in his early NFL years but was one of those who often used his mobility to just buy himself more time looking for receivers.

And since Reid NEVER won the big one, I'd say ALL QBs that have been with him have been held short of winning the big one.

 

[bearmick]

I don't think of McNabb as a HOF QB, but he will eventually get in. There aren't many worthy QBs waiting to be voted in. Manning and probably Romo will get in, but then all the remaining future HOF QBs won't retire (Brady, Big Ben, Brees, probably Rivers)..

If McNabb and Romo get in by their numbers then Rivers should be a no brainer.

 

[greg23]

Comparing numbers across eras is a joke
It's a completely different game.

Maybe I have a super high standard for the of fame but I never considered donovan McNabb one of the preeminent qb of his time.

Hall of very good not fame.

 

[Toast88]

If McNabb and Romo get in by their numbers then Rivers should be a no brainer.

Rivers *is* a no-brainer.

He’s easily going to finish top 5 in passing yards and touchdowns.

McNabb and Romo are not top 20 in either.

 

[Alpha Male]

If McNabb and Romo get in by their numbers then Rivers should be a no brainer.

Rivers is a hall of famer.

 

[Leomaz]

He is in the hall of very good quarterbacks.

 

[Warrior Spirit]

Rivers *is* a no-brainer.

But....................he never won the big one. I don't think you can look at just SB wins or just the numbers. How valuable was that QB to his team? Look at Joe Montana and Brett Favre. There was another QB right behind them who could do more of the same with that same team and put up even bigger numbers. You'd have to say the system and players within it had more to do with their success.

There will always be other variables that cause both fans and the so called experts to have a greater or lesser opinion of the player. Whether it's an extremely athletically gifted player like Romo being remembered more by some for the Romo follies, those plays that just went horribly wrong for him and, being so funny, were recalled often by media and fans or just the fact that a QB, albeit saddled with a lesser team throughout his career, never won the big one...or even not enough of the big ones.

Is Eli, who got 2 SB wins before his brother, actually as good or better than his bro? Hell no. He was a wave rider those couple years wherein the entire team lifted him rather than vice versa. Peyton, on the other hand, carried a slightly better than mediocre franchise for what seemed like forever. There will always be debate about who's the best ever and with all those SB championships w/Belichick, Brady likely to be on the winning side of the majority of those debates. We'll never know or be able to surmise how much of a role HGH, spygate, deflategate or any other gates or drugs unbeknownst to us actually factored in to it all. What I think is fair is to just look at how valuable that QB, himself, was to his team. When you look how much better some of the best QBs made their teams for long stretches of time, you see they made those lesser franchises far better than they would have been without them and are worthy of more recognition than others because of it, even if they lack the SB rings.

There's no doubt Marino was a generational QB even sans the SB jewelry. No doubt Peyton Manning was the most cerebral QB ever. I think that's why his head is so big. No doubt others like Fouts, Moon, Tarkenton, Kelly, Brees and Rivers made their teams vastly better than if those teams had had even just average QBs. Some of the very best QBs to ever play the game never won any or quite enough SB titles but should be held in as high regard as those who have won many with better teams. Their effort and play, over the bulk of their careers, was often even more impressive.

 

[fenderpfunk]

There really should be a bust for Cutler's hair in Canton. If you disagree you're lying to yourself.

 

[PrideisBears]

C'mon, PIB, wasn't mobile? Came out of college with ~ 4.6 40 and specifically remember an NFL game in which he had the most QB rushing yards in that game since a game in which Bobby Douglas had just a couple more yards. Did more running in his early NFL years but was one of those who often used his mobility to just buy himself more time looking for receivers.

And since Reid NEVER won the big one, I'd say ALL QBs that have been with him have been held short of winning the big one.

C'mon, PIB, wasn't mobile? Came out of college with ~ 4.6 40 and specifically remember an NFL game in which he had the most QB rushing yards in that game since a game in which Bobby Douglas had just a couple more yards. Did more running in his early NFL years but was one of those who often used his mobility to just buy himself more time looking for receivers.

And since Reid NEVER won the big one, I'd say ALL QBs that have been with him have been held short of winning the big one.

Then you and I have a different definition of what a Mobile QB is. Mcnabb didnt run that often but as you say he moved around in the pocket a lot. I throw Trubisky,Vick, Jackson, Tebow as "mobile" QB's

 

[Warrior Spirit]

Then you and I have a different definition of what a Mobile QB is. Mcnabb didnt run that often but as you say he moved around in the pocket a lot. I throw Trubisky,Vick, Jackson, Tebow as "mobile" QB's

I would say those 4 have to run more cause they lack passing skills. McNabb's 40 time, coming out of college, was faster than all but Vick. In his first 2 years, Trubisky has run for less yardage than McNabb did in his first 2 so your definition of mobile seems backasswards.

 

[run and shoot]

Spartan said:


He may have a point. I've never been a fan but there's lesser QBs with worse numbers in the Hall. He was fairly durable for a mobile QB and had a lot of wins...a lot of playoff games... a lot of Conference Championship shots. ...very often close but never quite enough. Kinda like Jim Kelly...... who's in the HOF.

If I were to enter a debate on the subject, I could take either side and give an equally good argument either way.
--------

Mcnabb wasnt a mobile QB and most QB's under Reid have "wins" but not the big one

To your "McNabb wasn't a mobile QB " point.

I think early on in his career, McNabb was "mobile ".

However, in a effort to avoid the "stereotypes" McNabb ( to a detriment, IMO) avoided using his mobility and tried to focus more on a 'being viewed as a passer'.

.....most QB's under Reid have "wins" but not the big one

True

 

[run and shoot]

Spartan said:

No doubt Peyton Manning was the most cerebral QB ever.

Unfortunately, he wasn't "the most cerebral QB ever".......when it came to $$ games. ( see his record)

and.....

Why Peyton Manning is the GOAT

Too bad Cutty never worked this hard

www.chicitysports.com

 

[sevvy]

Aikman was a pretty average QB. But he won Super Bowls with Dallas, who had a great oline and Emmit Smith. AMERICA'S TEAM, GUYS!

 

[Warrior Spirit]

Aikman was a pretty average QB. But he won Super Bowls with Dallas, who had a great oline and Emmit Smith. AMERICA'S TEAM, GUYS!

More football stupid shit from this schmuck. Truth is Aikman consistently ranked in the top 5 highest rated passers in an era that boasted many great QBs like Montana, Young, Moon, Marino, Favre, Elway etc.

 

[Warrior Spirit]

Spartan said:



Unfortunately, he wasn't "the most cerebral QB ever".......when it came to $$ games. ( see his record)

and.....

Why Peyton Manning is the GOAT

Too bad Cutty never worked this hard

www.chicitysports.com

His record? Is he a baseball pitcher? The American version of football I've grown accustomed to can be won and lost in a variety of ways. Defense, special teams, a stellar catch, bad officiating call, back breaking turnover, or just a little luck can all make the difference.

I guess you can put full blame of a loss on 1 of 53, if you have an axe to grind, are a bit Special person or are just all kinds of jelly cause you're the fan of a team who never fielded a QB worth a fuck. For the rest of us with fewer issues, it's easy to see what a phenom Peyton was and how much better he made his football team. It's good for fans too cause they know no matter how bad you think your team is gonna be year to year, you have that one phenom who's just gonna keep giving you a fighting chance year after year after year.

 

[TheWinman]

Rivers *is* a no-brainer.

He’s easily going to finish top 5 in passing yards and touchdowns.

McNabb and Romo are not top 20 in either.

So is stafford, but I would not put him in the HOF

 

[Toast88]

So is stafford, but I would not put him in the HOF

Nope, not even close. Stafford isn’t even Top 20 in either category.

 

[run and shoot]

His record? Is he a baseball pitcher? The American version of football I've grown accustomed to can be won and lost in a variety of ways. Defense, special teams, a stellar catch, bad officiating call, back breaking turnover, or just a little luck can all make the difference.

I guess you can put full blame of a loss on 1 of 53, if you have an axe to grind, are a bit Special person or are just all kinds of jelly cause you're the fan of a team who never fielded a QB worth a fuck. For the rest of us with fewer issues, it's easy to see what a phenom Peyton was and how much better he made his football team. It's good for fans too cause they know no matter how bad you think your team is gonna be year to year, you have that one phenom who's just gonna keep giving you a fighting chance year after year after year.

.His record? Is he a baseball pitcher?

NO.
However, If ya' can't count on a pitcher to do the same job in post-season as he did in the reg. season, then how can he be "the greatest ever"?
Ya' know why pitchers like Bob Gibson & Sandy Koufax were considered "the greatest ever".....cuz they played at a higher level
in $$$ games.

......if you have an axe to grind, are a bit Special person or are just all kinds of jelly cause you're the fan of a team who never fielded a QB worth a fuck.

LOL.....Special person. Naw....I'm quite sane. No axe to grind. Our Qb situation is irrelevant to P. Manning

I'm just pointing out that P. Manning is not this "super-human Qb" that some make him out to be ( his full body of work says other wise).

If he performed in post season the the way he performed in the reg. season..... we wouldn't be having this discussion, nor would you be mad at me for not being in the "P. Manning is greatest Qb ever camp"

P.S. I wanna go on record as saying....I'll miss they way Manning would call multiple audibles at the LOS and have guys shifting all around. It was very entertaining and in the reg. season, it played havoc with unprepared defenses.
-------

Defense, special teams, a stellar catch, bad officiating call, back breaking turnover, or just a little luck can all make the difference..

Ok......
I see you're stepping away from the "putting the team on his back" statement .
Lets take this over to the other thread click post>>>>>>#71

Sidebar: I just checked his post-season losses and his stats
were nothing to write home about.
In his last SB vs. da Panthers.....the Bronco "D" put P. Manning on their back for the win.

 

[Warrior Spirit]

NO.
However, If ya' can't count on a pitcher to do the same job in post-season as he did in the reg. season, then how can he be "the greatest ever"?
Ya' know why pitchers like Bob Gibson & Sandy Koufax were considered "the greatest ever".....cuz they played at a higher level
in $$$ games.



LOL.....Special person. Naw....I'm quite sane. No axe to grind. Our Qb situation is irrelevant to P. Manning

I'm just pointing out that P. Manning is not this "super-human Qb" that some make him to be ( his full body of work says other wise).
If he performed in post season the the way he performed in the reg. season..... we wouldn't be having this discussion, nor would be mad at me for not being in the "P. Manning is greatest Qb ever camp"
-------




Ok......
I see you're stepping away from the "putting the team on his back" statement.
Lets take this over to the other thread post>>>>>>#71

You're not the brightest. Can't pick up on even the most basic points being made. Hard to explain things to peeps who can't understand anything. There's a lot of stupid in your posts as if it's intended but I don't think it is. I do pity you.

 

[run and shoot]

You're not the brightest. Can't pick up on even the most basic points being made. Hard to explain things to peeps who can't understand anything. There's a lot of stupid in your posts as if it's intended but I don't think it is. I do pity you.

Duh, duh, "not the brightest, stupid in posts"

Truth is.......
I've adequately backed up all my points with facts. Where are your facts???? Where are your facts to prove P. Manning "was a phenom in the post-season" ????

Usually when a person can't stand on or deal with the cold facts, they digress to adolescent name-calling.....like you.

Bottom line....I've addressed all your points intelligently without bitchy, catty, female-like remarks.

But....what ever helps you sleep better tonight. LOL



Spartan said:

(P. Manning ).....Virtually carried the franchise on his back for 11 years.
----------------
Spartan said:
Hard to explain things to peeps who can't understand anything.
---------

Agreed, thats why you need to....
click post>>>>>>#71

Sidebar:

MORE FACTS on the "phenom "......
I just checked his post-season losses and his stats
were nothing to write home about. Same for the Bear SB win .
In his last SB vs. da Panthers.....the Bronco "D" VIRTUALLY
put P. Manning on their back for the win.