Just a fact...

The Bandit

The Bandit

vick27m
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diavolos said:
i agree with this to an extent. what the cubs needs is the location and the features. but as far as the actual field, it's a dump and should be demolished, in my opinion. they could easily build a new ballpark with the same features in the same location: open outfield, stand configuration roughly the same, proximity of seats to the field, charming architecture, ivy. but make the facilities better, get more bathrooms, vendors, etc. in there. i think if you build a new wrigley or a new camden yards for instance, and put it out in the suburbs, the cubs will actually lose a huge percentage of their fanbase. let's face it, people like the urban location and all that entails.

not for nothing, wrigley is one of the two biggest destination ballparks for visiting fans. if you lose the location, reds fans aren't necessarily going to drive out to lombard (i'm just picking burbs) to see a game.

maybe there's a case that if they built something new even with the same features, the charm won't be there anymore? maybe? i'm on the fence here a bit. i've seen tons of cubs game there, and it's a dump. sure, it's our dump, but it is still a dump. the concrete is failing down, there's posts, seats are uncomfortable, facilities for both men and women stink. undeniable charm though!
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I don't like Wrigley too much personally... Either scrap it or vast repairs are needed that I don't see why you would do. The place is so rich on history... But so was Busch, original Yankee stadium, etc. Etc. Teams can move on from a stadium but the Cubs unfortunately won't until there is either an accident or we win a World Series... I actually feel like that's the only aura that keeps the place up is that it never saw a winning team personally.

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The Bandit

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vick27m
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brett05 said:
so 6-8 years in total since this is year #3?
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They have two more before I'm as pissed as many here, however, I'm incredibly frustrated and tired of all of it already. Since I was born I've had two years of actual playoff baseball. 03 I didn't really follow baseball yet so I can't speak for it.

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diavolos

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it's a lot clearer now. you haven't had the decades of "wait until next year", then a round of "we've got a plan, wait until 2016" to put a chill through your veins.

at least there was the pretense for winning, even when the team was terrible. take 1993 for instance. cubs came to play even though they only won 84. or 77, sure they finished 81-81, but you know what, they came out swinging for herman franks.

i've had a close friend who's a sox fan come up to me and tell me he's insulted for me. a sox fan. you know it's bad.
 
chibears55

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brett05 said:
so 6-8 years in total since this is year #3?
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Depends on how quickly some of these kids excell and who they add around them via trade/FA..

Besides pitching , If were looking at baez and bryant in 2015 being added to castillo rizzo and castro to go along with a good FA sign , trade, etc.
Its gonna all depend on how well they play fron the start...


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The Bandit

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diavolos said:
it's a lot clearer now. you haven't had the decades of "wait until next year", then a round of "we've got a plan, wait until 2016" to put a chill through your veins.

at least there was the pretense for winning, even when the team was terrible. take 1993 for instance. cubs came to play even though they only won 84. or 77, sure they finished 81-81, but you know what, they came out swinging for herman franks.

i've had a close friend who's a sox fan come up to me and tell me he's insulted for me. a sox fan. you know it's bad.
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I can't comment on 93 I would've been barely 1. From what I've watched (06-present) lot of mix bag.

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diavolos

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the current regime actually makes me look back to the riggleman era with nostalgia. oh jim. him of the "let me do a double-switch every game". seriously, if that's a stat that is tracked, he'd be the all-time leader.

it was during the franks years that i became a fan. ivan dejesus was my favorite. they were middling, but played hard for franks. in the summer of '77, there was a time that both chicago teams were making a case for a division. but it all fell apart as the season wore on.
 

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brett05 said:
For those that support the "stay the course" how long should that be?
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Think you have to at least have the minimum at when Bryant and Baez hit the majors. I wont speak for all hold the course people but I don't think anyone is saying they can't add pieces just that they don't have to add David Price level pieces trading away a lot of the picks they have been bad enough to acquire. I'd like to see them acquire more mid level guys like Hammel. I'd like to see them trade for guys who are young enough to be around for 4-5 years and give them a ok starter for awhile.
 

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chibears55 said:
Depends on how quickly some of these kids excell and who they add around them via trade/FA..

Besides pitching , If were looking at baez and bryant in 2015 being added to castillo rizzo and castro to go along with a good FA sign , trade, etc.
Its gonna all depend on how well they play fron the start...


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I appreciate the reply but it doesn't answer how long you accept status quo

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beckdawg said:
Think you have to at least have the minimum at when Bryant and Baez hit the majors. I wont speak for all hold the course people but I don't think anyone is saying they can't add pieces just that they don't have to add David Price level pieces trading away a lot of the picks they have been bad enough to acquire. I'd like to see them acquire more mid level guys like Hammel. I'd like to see them trade for guys who are young enough to be around for 4-5 years and give them a ok starter for awhile.
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So that's what they are doing, right? At what point do you say they've failed?

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brett05 said:
So that's what they are doing, right? At what point do you say they've failed?

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If/when Bryant and Baez fail. I wouldn't say they are doing enough mid tier purchasing though. I think they are more in the bargain bin for most of their signings. They signed Sweeney for $2 mil and a bunch of minor league invites for the OF rather than spending $6+ mil on a Morse, Hart...etc.
 
chibears55

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brett05 said:
I appreciate the reply but it doesn't answer how long you accept status quo

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What status quo ? Making impact moves ?
Their not going to make any major moves until the baezs and bryant are up and they see where they need to fill in..
If that the question then for myself, im hoping to see something done this off season and I expect it by next off season. .

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beckdawg said:
If/when Bryant and Baez fail. I wouldn't say they are doing enough mid tier purchasing though. I think they are more in the bargain bin for most of their signings. They signed Sweeney for $2 mil and a bunch of minor league invites for the OF rather than spending $6+ mil on a Morse, Hart...etc.
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But there's no indication that they will. And how long do you wait to know Baez and Bryant failed? And what is that line between failure and success?

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brett05 said:
But there's no indication that they will. And how long do you wait to know Baez and Bryant failed? And what is that line between failure and success?

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After about 2 years you'll know what Baez and Bryant are. As for no indications, they have to start upgrading sometime. I get that people think "well they haven't yet" but that doesn't really mean they wont ever. SilenceS brought this up some where that soon there will be questions about Theo and company's jobs. And even if you suggest the Ricketts are holding back money, after this season the only "dead weight" type contract seems to be Jackson of which at least he's someone who you can generally rely on to go a full season even if he's shit at doing it. So, they are going to have money to spend. Not to mention they will be getting some TV money from the WGN portion. It's probably not enough to go crazy like the dodgers did but they will have more than they previously have.

Frankly, the ability/motivation to sign FA isn't my worry. My worry is about the quality of players who may be available. If there's very little out there then the costs will be significantly higher and the players who the cubs may be willing to pay for may choose someone closer.
 
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chibears55 said:
What status quo ? Making impact moves ?
Their not going to make any major moves until the baezs and bryant are up and they see where they need to fill in..
If that the question then for myself, im hoping to see something done this off season and I expect it by next off season. .

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Why don't we start focusing on why they don't fill the other roster spots that aren't tied to Castro, Rizzo, Bryant, and Baez? How about the other positions, the bullpen and TOR pitching? Why can't they be addressed?

People act as if they can't make a damn move until Baez and Bryant prove themselves in the majors. It is utter ignorance to hedge this whole re-build on their shoulders, and their future existance should have absolutely nothing to do with improving other roster spots. :yep:
 
chibears55

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Boobaby1 said:
Why don't we start focusing on why they don't fill the other roster spots that aren't tied to Castro, Rizzo, Bryant, and Baez? How about the other positions, the bullpen and TOR pitching? Why can't they be addressed?

People act as if they can't make a damn move until Baez and Bryant prove themselves in the majors. It is utter ignorance to hedge this whole re-build on their shoulders, and their future existance should have absolutely nothing to do with improving other roster spots. :yep:
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Why should they address Toronto pitching ?

Didn't say they cant make moves, just said it doesn't seem like their gonna make long term moves on positional players until they know where baez and bryant fits in...
those two along with castillo castro and rizzo gives them 5 positional players set, im sure as they wait and see how almora and soler progress, they will look to add a player or two on short term deals..

The pitching / bullpen , depends on what happens with samardzija and im sure his return if traded will net at least 1 major league ready starter or close to it.. they have wood and are banking on a couple of kids in system.. If your looking for a big Ace signing that won't come til their closer to competing..

We all wish for and want the quick fix but that not what their going to do. Their set on adding young takent to system and waiting for them to fill in at the major keague level. ..
So, all the wishing. Pissn n moaning is useless
Cause it not gonna change their plan..
All that left for us to do as fans is basically keep watch on the kids and hope they progress faster then expected to be able to enjoy cubs baseball again.

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dabynsky

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chibears55 said:
Why should they address Toronto pitching ?
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I am pretty sure he was using TOR to stand for Top Of the Rotation.

chibears55 said:
Didn't say they cant make moves, just said it doesn't seem like their gonna make long term moves on positional players until they know where baez and bryant fits in...
those two along with castillo castro and rizzo gives them 5 positional players set, im sure as they wait and see how almora and soler progress, they will look to add a player or two on short term deals..

The pitching / bullpen , depends on what happens with samardzija and im sure his return if traded will net at least 1 major league ready starter or close to it.. they have wood and are banking on a couple of kids in system.. If your looking for a big Ace signing that won't come til their closer to competing..

We all wish for and want the quick fix but that not what their going to do. Their set on adding young takent to system and waiting for them to fill in at the major keague level. ..
So, all the wishing. Pissn n moaning is useless
Cause it not gonna change their plan..
All that left for us to do as fans is basically keep watch on the kids and hope they progress faster then expected to be able to enjoy cubs baseball again.

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Click to expand...
Well I hope they add a bat in the offseason. They should have tons of payroll flexibility at this point. The prospects are arriving at this point, and so I am hopeful that we starting building at this point. What I want isn't going to change what they do, but I think the window needs to start opening at this point.
 
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