Bulls or Cavs?

RamiTheBullsFan · Jul 13, 2014

Where it stands right now, it is hard to imagine the Bulls or Cavs winning a championship next season. I'd take about 5-6 teams in the Western Conference over either of them, easily (SAS, OKC, LAC, GSW, POR, HOU). If the Bulls/Cavs were in the West, they would be battling for a low playoff seed with the Mavs.

I think one of them will win the East, and I am leaning towards the Bulls. 3-4 years down the line, the Cavs should grow into legitimate contenders. The Bulls are at least 1 great move away from being a right favorite to win a title. And that is assuming Rose's health.

sicko · Jul 13, 2014

Depends on how good Wiggins is to be honest. Not sure how that will work with LeBron I guess he would play Shooting Guard. If he Lives up to expectations then Cavs will be very good even with the Roster they have now. That Supporting cast is already better than what he had before he left Cleveland

RamiTheBullsFan · Jul 13, 2014

sicko said:
Depends on how good Wiggins is to be honest. Not sure how that will work with LeBron I guess he would play Shooting Guard. If he Lives up to expectations then Cavs will be very good even with the Roster they have now. That Supporting cast is already better than what he had before he left Cleveland

If it was up to me, I'd play LeBron, Wiggins, Waiters, and Irving at the same time more often than not. And put Tristan Thompson at the 5 gives you tons of versatility and athleticism from 1-to-5. That team could run anybody out of the gym or shoot anybody out of the gym.

RoseMVP1 · Jul 13, 2014

The Bulls are going to be the favorites in the east and the Pacers will follow. Kyrie Irving is one of my favorite players but you can't rely on him. #1 he plays ZERO defense and he is always injured. He is the definition of injury prone.

payton 34ever · Jul 13, 2014

JimJohnson said:
I'll take the Cavs easily.

Why? Please explain. Outside of LeBron and Kyrie (who still have to learn to play together), who strikes fear in your heart on that team? They also have a rookie coach from overseas who has to get everyone to buy into his system. If Rose is remotely healthy, it's Bulls/Pacers in the Eastern Finals.

payton 34ever · Jul 13, 2014

sicko said:
Depends on how good Wiggins is to be honest. Not sure how that will work with LeBron I guess he would play Shooting Guard. If he Lives up to expectations then Cavs will be very good even with the Roster they have now. That Supporting cast is already better than what he had before he left Cleveland

Watched a lot of KU basketball this year, and I'm not sold yet on Wiggins. Appears to have all the athleticism and potential you could ever want, then he would just flat out DISAPPEAR at times. I typed that in all caps because that's how bad it was when it happened. People have questioned LeBron's heart and intensity in the past, but that's only because they hadn't seen someone like Wiggins yet.

2323 · Jul 13, 2014

RamiTheBullsFan said:
Where it stands right now, it is hard to imagine the Bulls or Cavs winning a championship next season. I'd take about 5-6 teams in the Western Conference over either of them, easily (SAS, OKC, LAC, GSW, POR, HOU). If the Bulls/Cavs were in the West, they would be battling for a low playoff seed with the Mavs.

I think one of them will win the East, and I am leaning towards the Bulls. 3-4 years down the line, the Cavs should grow into legitimate contenders. The Bulls are at least 1 great move away from being a right favorite to win a title. And that is assuming Rose's health.

Even though the West is a stronger conference, it's also about match ups. And the Bulls aren't always the easiest team for opponents to play against.

clonetrooper264 · Jul 13, 2014

If the Cavs wings end up being unable to make shots (except Kyrie...we know he's going to be money) then it becomes a lot easier to play them. If guys like Waiters start becoming knock down shooters, we're probably screwed. We'll see how our frontcourt guys end up doing. Ideally, we should be able to bully them inside and not rely on Rose's penetration for points. If McDermott, Butler, and Mirotic (possibly even Snell if his confidence from summer league carries over) can all knock down 3s at 37+% we're in a good position to beat theam imo.

Anytime23 · Jul 13, 2014

Its really hard to project. All of the teams in the East have a lot of questions. I guess you have to give it to the Pacers right now, right? Theyre the most intact team and they finished first in the East last regular season.

clonetrooper264 · Jul 13, 2014

Anytime23 said:
Its really hard to project. All of the teams in the East have a lot of questions. I guess you have to give it to the Pacers right now, right? Theyre the most intact team and they finished first in the East last regular season.

Even the Pacers though...if they don't keep Lance I'm not sure how much better they'll be next year, if at all. Stephenson was a huge part of what they did last year...they ran a lot of offense through him. They're still pretty darn good with PG, West, and Hibbert, but I'm not sure who they have filling that SG spot now.

ChettheJet · Jul 14, 2014

James might be able to take over 3-4 games in a series but the rest of his current supporting cast is completely void of playoff experience. It's a different and much more intense game in the playoffs and all of the Bulls moving parts have gone through tough series'. The Bulls have 2 defenders in Gibson and Butler who aren't afraid to get in Lebron's face and take him on. That would mean some of his untested teammates would have to step up.

Scoot26 · Jul 14, 2014

clonetrooper264 said:
Even the Pacers though...if they don't keep Lance I'm not sure how much better they'll be next year, if at all. Stephenson was a huge part of what they did last year...they ran a lot of offense through him. They're still pretty darn good with PG, West, and Hibbert, but I'm not sure who they have filling that SG spot now.

Well, Hibbert will depend on how much his head is still affected ... by whatever it is thats affecting him.

To me it pretty much is a 3 team race between Bulls,Cavs and Pacers for #1 seed. I feel like the Cavs will take it though. As far as winning the East, who the hell knows really? Its up for grabs IMO. It'll depend on if Rose plays the whole season and if he can play at an All-Star level or not and then depends on how LeBron and his teammates all mesh. If the Pacers can re-sign Lance and their guys get over their head games, then they can compete as well.

Anytime23 · Jul 14, 2014

ChettheJet said:
James might be able to take over 3-4 games in a series but the rest of his current supporting cast is completely void of playoff experience. It's a different and much more intense game in the playoffs and all of the Bulls moving parts have gone through tough series'. The Bulls have 2 defenders in Gibson and Butler who aren't afraid to get in Lebron's face and take him on. That would mean some of his untested teammates would have to step up.

I'm sure the Cavs would be more than happy for LeBron to take over 3-4 games in a series.

czman · Jul 14, 2014

clonetrooper264 said:
If the Cavs wings end up being unable to make shots (except Kyrie...we know he's going to be money) then it becomes a lot easier to play them. If guys like Waiters start becoming knock down shooters, we're probably screwed. We'll see how our frontcourt guys end up doing. Ideally, we should be able to bully them inside and not rely on Rose's penetration for points. If McDermott, Butler, and Mirotic (possibly even Snell if his confidence from summer league carries over) can all knock down 3s at 37+% we're in a good position to beat theam imo.

I think the people are overstating their lack of shooting. Lebron shot very well from 3. Irving can shoot a bit. If they bring in Miller or Allen they will have enough shooting for the East. When Lebron and Wiggins defend on the perimeter the Cavs are going to be damn tough to score on. Can you imagine Butler/Snell/McD/Dunleavy trying to do something on those guys. Plus who is going to defend Lebron. If Butler is on Lebron then Irving guards Butler and Rose gets a huge athletic defender on him.

Right now the Cavs have multiple 2 way players on the wings. The Bulls do not. I think outside of Rose (who knows about him) this is the worst Bulls team they have had in the last 3 years at the start of the season.

I really hope Butler does not suck again and that Euro kid can score.

clonetrooper264 · Jul 14, 2014

czman said:
I think the people are overstating their lack of shooting. Lebron shot very well from 3. Irving can shoot a bit. If they bring in Miller or Allen they will have enough shooting for the East. When Lebron and Wiggins defend on the perimeter the Cavs are going to be damn tough to score on. Can you imagine Butler/Snell/McD/Dunleavy trying to do something on those guys. Plus who is going to defend Lebron. If Butler is on Lebron then Irving guards Butler and Rose gets a huge athletic defender on him.

Right now the Cavs have multiple 2 way players on the wings. The Bulls do not. I think outside of Rose (who knows about him) this is the worst Bulls team they have had in the last 3 years at the start of the season.

I really hope Butler does not suck again and that Euro kid can score.

Yeah I'm guessing the Cavs will sign a shooter or two as well, but if someone Mike Miller is getting minutes over Thompson or Waiters or even Wiggins, I'll take that. Also if Lebron is just taking 3s all day, I'll take that over him bulldozing everyone in the paint. And again, we don't need to completely rely on Rose's ability to go one on one because we have a huge advantage inside. If they collapse in the post, that only helps us because actually have shooters this year.

I'm not sure how you can say this team is any worse than the one we had last year to start. We added Pau, Mirotic, and McD and don't have Deng and Boozer. I would think that given the shooting we've added with Mirotic and McDermott over Deng we're probably a better offensive team, and that's assuming Pau does the exact same stuff as Boozer. I guess if you have no confidence in either of those guys I can see where you're coming from, but I think that's a bit overly pessimistic.

czman · Jul 14, 2014

clonetrooper264 said:
I'm not sure how you can say this team is any worse than the one we had last year to start. We added Pau, Mirotic, and McD and don't have Deng and Boozer. I would think that given the shooting we've added with Mirotic and McDermott over Deng we're probably a better offensive team, and that's assuming Pau does the exact same stuff as Boozer. I guess if you have no confidence in either of those guys I can see where you're coming from, but I think that's a bit overly pessimistic.

To start the season I thought Butler would be better offensively. I thought Rose could stay healthy. I thought Deng would be better offensively. I thought Dunleavy would be on the bench.

Now I don't think Butler can shoot. I don't think Rose can stay healthy. I don't think Dunleavy is a starter quality player. I don't think Gasol will be healthier than Boozer. Mt assumptions last season about the Bulls were wrong. My assumptions this season may be wrong.

I think the NBA has become very perimeter oriented and the Bulls are build like a team from 15 years ago. Wings are more important than Bigs now and the Bulls are very weak on the wing. The game is dominated by 2/3 at the highest level.

In a 7 game series I don't see how the Bulls can adjust enough to win 4 games. Regular season they will probably be fine.

Bear Pride · Jul 14, 2014

czman said:
I think the people are overstating their lack of shooting. Lebron shot very well from 3. Irving can shoot a bit. If they bring in Miller or Allen they will have enough shooting for the East. When Lebron and Wiggins defend on the perimeter the Cavs are going to be damn tough to score on. Can you imagine Butler/Snell/McD/Dunleavy trying to do something on those guys. Plus who is going to defend Lebron. If Butler is on Lebron then Irving guards Butler and Rose gets a huge athletic defender on him.

Right now the Cavs have multiple 2 way players on the wings. The Bulls do not. I think outside of Rose (who knows about him) this is the worst Bulls team they have had in the last 3 years at the start of the season.

I really hope Butler does not suck again and that Euro kid can score.

If Rose is healthy, Irving won't be checking Butler... that's for sure.

Probie2429 · Jul 14, 2014

Pau Gasol is the difference between the Cavs and Bulls, IMO. If healthy, he can dominate the Cavs inside. He is a legit back to the basket post player. That was something the Bulls hoped to get with Boozer, but that didn't work as many easily predicted. Lebron is going to get his, but at least Butler will get in his way. There isn't anybody on the Cavs roster capable of doing so to Gasol.

On paper, the Cavs look awesome, but they have too many young players that need time to grow. Lebron only signing a two year deal there is proof enough that he doesn't trust that the Cavs will take the next step. I know Lebron has stated that he is committed to the Cavs long-term, but that is window dressing. This is Cleveland, and everyone knows that things will fall apart when push comes to shove. I think Lebron is just bidding his time so he can join Melo in NY once Phil Jackson clears cap room.

Scoot26 · Jul 14, 2014

Probie2429 said:
Pau Gasol is the difference between the Cavs and Bulls, IMO. If healthy, he can dominate the Cavs inside. He is a legit back to the basket post player. That was something the Bulls hoped to get with Boozer, but that didn't work as many easily predicted. Lebron is going to get his, but at least Butler will get in his way. There isn't anybody on the Cavs roster capable of doing so to Gasol.

On paper, the Cavs look awesome, but they have too many young players that need time to grow. Lebron only signing a two year deal there is proof enough that he doesn't trust that the Cavs will take the next step. I know Lebron has stated that he is committed to the Cavs long-term, but that is window dressing. This is Cleveland, and everyone knows that things will fall apart when push comes to shove. I think Lebron is just bidding his time so he can join Melo in NY once Phil Jackson clears cap room.

I really really really do not see LeBron doing that to the city twice...especially if they do indeed make NBA Finals and possibly win one.

The Hawk · Jul 14, 2014

ChettheJet said:
James might be able to take over 3-4 games in a series but the rest of his current supporting cast is completely void of playoff experience. It's a different and much more intense game in the playoffs and all of the Bulls moving parts have gone through tough series'. The Bulls have 2 defenders in Gibson and Butler who aren't afraid to get in Lebron's face and take him on. That would mean some of his untested teammates would have to step up.

Both the Bulls and the Cavs will be better next year. The Cavs will be much better than their previous year but have a longer way to go than the Bulls have. Both teamsadded probable impact rookies. Both teams added a super-star(assuming Rose is 100% which is a big if). The Cavs will have a huge advantage in the back court while the Bulls will have a huge advantage on defense, rebounding, and front court scoring. When you take a step back, the Cavs will strongly resemble the Heat while the Bulls will resemble the Spurs in their make-up.

At least immediately, the Bulls should be better than the Cavs because I think that it is easier to blend in new bigs than it is to blend in back court guys and I think that the Bulls will have more depth. But the Bulls sure as shit have to make a trade before this season starts to improve their back court. This was the reason why they wanted Melo after all.

Bulls or Cavs?

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