Cubs Farm System And Prospects Discussion Thread

TC in Mississippi · Aug 2, 2015

Boobaby1 said:
Not moving him to CF.

Moved in a trade, or moved to LF.

We don't know what the catcher position does next year, and we know Ross is not the answer. Anything can happen to Montero, but we have to find out if Schwarber can stick behind the plate. I don't think he can, but they may try him and see.

This would leave LF open.

And yes, personally, I would rather have Jason Heyward in RF than Soler. He has the proven OBP. is young, and a damn good defender and we could use that out there.

I would like to see Soler packaged for something else of need.

I just feel he is going to be a detriment to the team as far as injuries. Nothing for sure, just a gut feeling.

I think Soler is going to be a better player than you do. He has all the tools to be a very good player in RF but hasn't put them together yet. I feel similarly about him at the plate. It's going to take some time. That said they may move him in the winter. Castro's value will be a bit better in the offseason because he'll be valued on body of work, but it's not going to skyrocket either. For the pieces they need they're going to need to add value in a trade whether that's a young starting pitcher or something else and they're going to need other pieces as well. The infield is likely to be Rizzo, Baez, Russell and Bryant especially if Baez shows anything at all in his call up sometime in the next few weeks. Schwarber is likely to play 4-5 days a week in LF and at C the rest of the time. They could roll the dice on him as a full time C paired with Ross and deal Montero but that's a big risk and I'm not sure they'll take it. It's more likely Montero, Scwarber and Ross all stay. They're going to have to find a CF to replace Fowler and if they did move Soler a RF as well. I think Coghlan becomes the super sub they wanted Alcantara to be. So SP, CF and bullpen depth are must haves. 2B could be an issue if Baez busts in MLB again (personally I don't think he will). A nice to have is a lock down closer but Rondon may suffice. Those are the needs.

Aside from needs the other thing that this FO will need to address is the overall mix of the team. It's unlikely that they can have four startes with 25% + K rates in the everyday lineup in Soler, Bryant, Russell and Baez. You might be able to live with three but either someone improves or that mix won't work. So even if Baez does look good this fall you may see him moved so they could get a better fit at 2B. If not Baez then Soler as I can't see Russell or Bryant going anywhere.

As far as acquisitions, Heyward isn't going to be cheap and if they do go after a TOR starter I don't see them doing something like that. Of course they may get their starter in trade and not spend as the deadline hunt for guys like Tyson Ross, Carlos Carrasco and Julio Teheran suggests. If that's the case signing a RF isn't so crazy but at that point who knows what they need to trade to do that. This team will be better next year but there are more moving parts than it looks like at first glance. Defense up the middle needs to improve, defense if RF needs to improve, they need to upgrade starting pitching either with a TOR or a middle of rotation guy with potential, they need bullpen help and they need to cut down on K's in that lineup. Lots of work to do.

CSF77 · Aug 2, 2015

Let's look at this logically.

Who do they have signed next year.

SP: They have 4. No legit talent. This is a need to add 1.

OF:

Fowler will be a FA. Almora is in AA. He is not ready yet. So CF is a need.

LF: They have been putting Schwarber out there and I believe they should keep it like that.

RF: Soler. Still a rookie. He is not a finished product.

C: MLBNW has done bits on Schwarber's catching. He has the longest hand to glove times in the majors. Also he is in a bad habit of sitting on his left knee to catch low pitches vs squatting. That makes it awkward to get into a throwing transfer.

He is too raw to be considered any option at this point. Nothing wrong with him taking a few years of practice on the side while we depend on a real catcher in Montero. He was the best trade they made in a long time.

IF: I would be surprised if they do not test Castro in wavers. That said the next week or so if he doesn't start to show some stability they will make a change. Baez is rocking AAA right now and that is needed power right now with Bryant slumping.

CSF77 · Aug 2, 2015

Baez: 3 for 6. 5 RBI's. Only 1 2B rest singles. So he was getting the clutch hits vs depending on the HR. I really believe they need to pull the trigger.

CSF77 · Aug 2, 2015

We don't know what the catcher position does next year, and we know Ross is not the answer. Anything can happen to Montero, but we have to find out if Schwarber can stick behind the plate. I don't think he can, but they may try him and see.

You should see what Willson Contreras is doing in AA at catcher. leading the team with 105 hits. RH hitter. 23 yo so still young. Should be 25 when ready. I could see another year of Ross then transitioning over to Conteras as the back up to Montero. .322/.405/.479 I have a better feeling with him and he really is under the radar in the system.

TC in Mississippi · Aug 2, 2015

CSF77 said:
Baez: 3 for 6. 5 RBI's. Only 1 2B rest singles. So he was getting the clutch hits vs depending on the HR. I really believe they need to pull the trigger.

His K's are still an issue. I'm not sure they won't wait until September unless that changes quickly.

TC in Mississippi · Aug 2, 2015

CSF77 said:
You should see what Willson Contreras is doing in AA at catcher. leading the team with 105 hits. RH hitter. 23 yo so still young. Should be 25 when ready. I could see another year of Ross then transitioning over to Conteras as the back up to Montero. .322/.405/.479 I have a better feeling with him and he really is under the radar in the system.

At some point they will deal Montero and let Schwarber sink or swim at C. I do like Contreras though. Just have to see if his rapid rise this year Is sustainable.

Boobaby1 · Aug 2, 2015

TC in Mississippi said:
I think Soler is going to be a better player than you do. He has all the tools to be a very good player in RF but hasn't put them together yet. I feel similarly about him at the plate. It's going to take some time. That said they may move him in the winter. Castro's value will be a bit better in the offseason because he'll be valued on body of work, but it's not going to skyrocket either. For the pieces they need they're going to need to add value in a trade whether that's a young starting pitcher or something else and they're going to need other pieces as well. The infield is likely to be Rizzo, Baez, Russell and Bryant especially if Baez shows anything at all in his call up sometime in the next few weeks. Schwarber is likely to play 4-5 days a week in LF and at C the rest of the time. They could roll the dice on him as a full time C paired with Ross and deal Montero but that's a big risk and I'm not sure they'll take it. It's more likely Montero, Scwarber and Ross all stay. They're going to have to find a CF to replace Fowler and if they did move Soler a RF as well. I think Coghlan becomes the super sub they wanted Alcantara to be. So SP, CF and bullpen depth are must haves. 2B could be an issue if Baez busts in MLB again (personally I don't think he will). A nice to have is a lock down closer but Rondon may suffice. Those are the needs.

Aside from needs the other thing that this FO will need to address is the overall mix of the team. It's unlikely that they can have four startes with 25% + K rates in the everyday lineup in Soler, Bryant, Russell and Baez. You might be able to live with three but either someone improves or that mix won't work. So even if Baez does look good this fall you may see him moved so they could get a better fit at 2B. If not Baez then Soler as I can't see Russell or Bryant going anywhere.

As far as acquisitions, Heyward isn't going to be cheap and if they do go after a TOR starter I don't see them doing something like that. Of course they may get their starter in trade and not spend as the deadline hunt for guys like Tyson Ross, Carlos Carrasco and Julio Teheran suggests. If that's the case signing a RF isn't so crazy but at that point who knows what they need to trade to do that. This team will be better next year but there are more moving parts than it looks like at first glance. Defense up the middle needs to improve, defense if RF needs to improve, they need to upgrade starting pitching either with a TOR or a middle of rotation guy with potential, they need bullpen help and they need to cut down on K's in that lineup. Lots of work to do.

No, I don't think Soler is a bust. In fact, I thought he might be one of the stronger prospects.

That said, I think he might be the most expendable and most valuable (not named Schwarber, Russell, and Bryant) in a trade to get something of need since he is so young and has not busted.

RF is where I want GREAT defense.

Lets not act as if the Cubs are not going to have the money to afford a RF and a pitcher even if they don't trade anybody.

Denard Span won't cost a whole hell of a lot less than Heyward, and frankly, I would rather have the 25 year old between the two, and then maybe trade out for a CF'er.

I have already said that they have 16 million easily coming off of the books if they choose to, and E-Jax will be in his last year.

Even if they extend Arrieta, they will be looking at windows about the time of the new TV contract.

Plus, you still have Wood and Castro that could be moved.

To have Hendricks, Grimm, Ramirez, Bryant, Schwarber, Russell, Soler (3M) and possibly Baez making the league minimum, they should have ample amounts of money to get the couple of big guns that they need.

BTW, Heyward has really improved on his strikeout totals which you speak of, and the Cubs need a guy that gets on base, which he does.

You start to score more when you have high OBP guys in the line-up.

Rizzo, Bryant, Schwarber and HEYWARD would be a good start to scoring a lot more runs and take some of the pressure off of the pitching.

TC in Mississippi · Aug 2, 2015

TC in Mississippi said:
His K's are still an issue. I'm not sure they won't wait until September unless that changes quickly.

Actually I stand corrected, I was just going by anecdotal evidence. His K rate is at about 19%. That's much better.

FrankieLyrical · Aug 2, 2015

I agree that Soler is the most expendable. I like him, but he is the most replaceable of our core pieces and would be a great chip in a trade

Parade_Rain · Aug 2, 2015

What would they trade him for? They will be signing a FA TOR this off season. He has a rocket arm.

CSF77 · Aug 2, 2015

CF is a greater need next year vs RF. the guy from the Nats would be ideal.

That is a legit argument and he plays as a lead off

Boobaby1 · Aug 3, 2015

Parade_Rain said:
What would they trade him for? They will be signing a FA TOR this off season. He has a rocket arm.

He has a rocket arm. So does Heyward. A corner outfielder is easier to replace to me. Centerfield is a big hole for us, and so is the lead-off position.

Couldn't Soler be used in a package to get a CF'er?

I don't know what it would take to get Blackmon or Pollock, but I hope Theo is looking into it.

Soler's contract is enticing I am sure to someone, and Theo knows he is eventually going to have to trade out to get what he needs.

Boobaby1 · Aug 3, 2015

Baez goes 3-6 with 3 RBI's and a SO.

Also, they didn't win, but the boys in Tennessee had a good night too.

Contreras was 2-4, LaStella 2-2, McKinney 1-4, and Jeimer Candelario is having a good year and went 2-4 and is batting .340.

Of note, Almora (sigh) went 0-5, and Montero went 0-4 and DH'd.

Contreras got the start. If he can get his defense up a little, he might be the future Cubs backstop. Or at least the back-up.

I hope he keeps improving since he is only 23.

SilenceS · Aug 3, 2015

Hate to burst bubbles. But, I think the Cubs are going to live or die by their young sticks for the forseeable future. They have shown no problem putting people in different positions. I doubt the Cubs do much besides in house for the sticks. May sign a CF on a 1 or 2 year deal but nothing more. Lineups are completely unconventional now. The need for a lead off hitter and others is not in most teams minds. Blue Jays, Astros, and others. The Cubs big hitters are OBP guys to begin with. They don't necessarily need a Ben Revere type considering Bryant, Rizzo, and Schwarber most likely will have plus OBP.

I see the Cubs signing pitching, pitching, and more pitching to they see who flames out. You don't gut the team to not see what you got now.

Boobaby1 · Aug 4, 2015

I see CF and RF as areas of concern, and the lead-off position, and lets face it, they are still going to be short one decent bat.

Two of the three can be handled with one person, and that's where I think they will target someone.

You know damn well a trade is coming in the off-season, and if it is not for a pitcher, it will be for probably a RF'er, CF'er, or lead-off man.

If they trade out for pitching, they will sign a free agent for one of those positions.

SilenceS · Aug 4, 2015

Boobaby1 said:
I see CF and RF as areas of concern, and the lead-off position, and lets face it, they are still going to be short one decent bat.

Two of the three can be handled with one person, and that's where I think they will target someone.

You know damn well a trade is coming in the off-season, and if it is not for a pitcher, it will be for probably a RF'er, CF'er, or lead-off man.

If they trade out for pitching, they will sign a free agent for one of those positions.

I don't see a trade as imminent. I see the Cubs holding a certain value on players and won't back down. Someone meets it then yes, it could happen. A lot of rumors were overblown. They may have traded Castro or Baez but it was for a price. They weren't given away any player.

TL1961 · Aug 4, 2015

TC in Mississippi said:
At some point they will deal Montero and let Schwarber sink or swim at C. I do like Contreras though. Just have to see if his rapid rise this year Is sustainable.

Montero went out w injury, and the pitching got worse. No rush to get rid of a real catcher.

TC in Mississippi · Aug 4, 2015

TL1961 said:
Montero went out w injury, and the pitching got worse. No rush to get rid of a real catcher.

I agree with you but the FO office seems bound and determined to have Schwarber be the everyday catcher. I'm not saying what they should do but what I think they will do. I just hope they don't get rid of Montero over the winter and instead keep him for a while at least and use Schwarber as a more or less full timer in LF and catching a couple of days a week and yes I want Ross around as well.

CSF77 · Aug 4, 2015

TC in Mississippi said:
I agree with you but the FO office seems bound and determined to have Schwarber be the everyday catcher. I'm not saying what they should do but what I think they will do. I just hope they don't get rid of Montero over the winter and instead keep him for a while at least and use Schwarber as a more or less full timer in LF and catching a couple of days a week and yes I want Ross around as well.

Dude he is still too raw out there. If he was solid as a catcher they would have traded Montero earlier pre injury. The best solution is to let Schwarber take a year on the side to learn the craft from Montero and Ross. (2016) while in LF. If he looks ready then trade Montero.

But there is no glaring need going on. Him in LF and Montero at C is not a bad thing. That gives 3 LH hitters that can hit it out of the park. 2 that will hit for avg. All 3 should have solid OBA skills. That is not a bad thing at all.

My opinion is Schwarber at Catcher right now makes the team worse over all. In LF better over all.

TC in Mississippi · Aug 4, 2015

CSF77 said:
Dude he is still too raw out there. If he was solid as a catcher they would have traded Montero earlier pre injury. The best solution is to let Schwarber take a year on the side to learn the craft from Montero and Ross. (2016) while in LF. If he looks ready then trade Montero.

But there is no glaring need going on. Him in LF and Montero at C is not a bad thing. That gives 3 LH hitters that can hit it out of the park. 2 that will hit for avg. All 3 should have solid OBA skills. That is not a bad thing at all.

My opinion is Schwarber at Catcher right now makes the team worse over all. In LF better over all.

Again, as I said, I agree with that but with everything that I read or hear from the team I think they will force him in there in 2016 if not out of ST then sometime during the year. I hope I'm wrong and they give him part time experience for all of 2016 with Montero and Ross and he plays primarily in LF. You're talking to a guy who doesn't believe this kid is a catcher at all so personally I think they should give up the ghost and make him a full time OF. The team, on the other hand, seems to believe that if he's average or slightly below average at C that's going to be ok and will allow them the luxury of production from that position.

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