2015 Spring Training Thread

Bear Pride

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Yea.. looking forward to weds or thurs. when Maddon puts his lineup together for a couple games to get ready for opening day

Me too!!! EJ has got to be pitching the worst looking 1 hitter I've seen in a while. Man, the guy has no movement on his ball at all. It's like a "right in your wheelhouse' floater. He's thrown a couple good sliders, but his curve overall just sucks, imo. Also made an error throwing to 1st. I just don't like the guy at all. Overall, a pretty boring game so far.
 

chibears55

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Me too!!! EJ has got to be pitching the worst looking 1 hitter I've seen in a while. Man, the guy has no movement on his ball at all. It's like a "right in your wheelhouse' floater. He's thrown a couple good sliders, but his curve overall just sucks, imo. Also made an error throwing to 1st. I just don't like the guy at all.
Overall, a pretty boring game so far.


That what i was saying yesterday. ..
Just seems we have been unlucky for most of these televised games this spring with watching boring games on the offense side. . Yesterday they go nuts, today nothing
 

Bear Pride

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Well, we got Bryant coming up with the bases loaded, and Patterson coming in from the pen..... the most excitement all day. :yep:
 

Bear Pride

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.... and the backwords K .... kinda day it's been. :nope:
 

chibears55

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So they have a future game tomorrow night against the Rangers and no one can watch unless your in AZ and can go to game..
 

Bear Pride

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Grimm comes in for the Cubs and has a 1-2-3, and is clocked at 97. Cubs do have some hard throwing pitchers. I can't wait for the Cards to start with their beanball shit again. :yep:
 

TL1961

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The Cards and their beanball shit pisses me off.

They always innocently, by complete accident, hit the opponent's best hitter twice.

As the Cards would put it "It all started when the other guy retaliated."
 

Bear Pride

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The Cards and their beanball shit pisses me off.

They always innocently, by complete accident, hit the opponent's best hitter twice.

As the Cards would put it "It all started when the other guy retaliated."

That's what I'm saying, the Cubs will bring some heat with their retaliation (not that they'll start it like you say) this year. It'll happen as soon as the Cards realize the Cubs are for real, imo.
 

Bear Pride

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Lake and Szczur YEP

Yeah, Lake did a pretty good Soler imitation there, that swing looked good. Cubs pour it on in the 9th against Greg Holland .... 7-0. This will be the Cubs 1st shutout of ST if they can close this out in the 9th.

Cubs with another 4 HR's today. Bring on the real games. :elephant:
 

Bear Pride

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:elephant:

[video=youtube;Ko58baUVstE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ko58baUVstE[/video]
 

chibears55

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Im trying to figure out if their gonna bring up 11 or 12 pitchers. .

If they carry 3 catchers, a couple of those OFers won't make it north...

C. Ross
C. Castillo
Ut. Alcantara
Ut. LaStella

1 or 2 spots for OFer..
Donorfio, Sweeney, Lake, Szczur

Then wheather bryant starts opening day or in 3 weeks, they will have an extra player then ( bryant / Olt )...

Have to think they either drop Ross or move Castillo in next 2 weeks...
 

Bear Pride

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Im trying to figure out if their gonna bring up 11 or 12 pitchers. .

If they carry 3 catchers, a couple of those OFers won't make it north...

C. Ross
C. Castillo
Ut. Alcantara
Ut. LaStella

1 or 2 spots for OFer..
Donorfio, Sweeney, Lake, Szczur

Then wheather bryant starts opening day or in 3 weeks, they will have an extra player then ( bryant / Olt )...

Have to think they either drop Ross or move Castillo in next 2 weeks...

With Wada and Turner banged up, and Bryant goin down, it gives Maddon some time to juggle things. :dunno:
 

Boobaby1

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He has shown up every morning at 5:45 in the AM to work in the cage. Maddon loves his work ethic.

If he shows up at 4:45 in the AM, will that reduce his strikeouts and raise his contact rate even more? :pray:
 

TL1961

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That's what I'm saying, the Cubs will bring some heat with their retaliation (not that they'll start it like you say) this year. It'll happen as soon as the Cards realize the Cubs are for real, imo.

No, no! I am saying the Cards always start it, but when the other guy retaliates, the Cards act like the other guy started it.
 

TL1961

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If he shows up at 4:45 in the AM, will that reduce his strikeouts and raise his contact rate even more? :pray:

With no pitchers there at 4:45, there is nobody to strike him out. (Though he did K against the pitching machine twice the other day.) :)
 

Bear Pride

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No, no! I am saying the Cards always start it, but when the other guy retaliates, the Cards act like the other guy started it.

I understood what you meant, I guess I didn't word it well, but yes, I hate that attitude from the Cards. The Cubs are gonna hit some HR's and the Cards don't like it when teams do that to them, so in my opinion, it won't be long before the Cards pull that shit. And I'm gonna like bringing some heat back their way. :yep:
 

beckdawg

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Alcantara has struck out 15 times in 40 at bats. Baez has struck out 17 times in 48 at bats. Alcantara has 4 walks. Baez has 3. Baez has shown he is an all around ball player. From his base running to his fielding. Alcantara has the same problems as Baez but perception outweighs the reality. Now, Olt has struck out 15 times in 40 at bats but has walked 8 times. They both have a higher strikeout rate but people ignore it and focus on Baez. BA means nothing right now in the small sample size. Baez goes 4 for 4 in a game. His BA goes up to .250. ITs why almost no one cares about BA during this time. Baez has looked foolish in some at bats. He has hit the ball hard in a good number for outs. That will even out. If Maddon wants him on the team, who are any of us to question him? He has a pretty extensive track record of knowing how to nurture the young kids. If he feels it is best for Baez, I am more inclined to believe him. Make no mistake about it. Maddon is the one who wants Baez as his opening day starter. Its not Theo and them. Its Maddon.

I feel like this an argument where you say spring training doesn't matter then you use stats from spring training as if they matter in this case K's and walks. You really can't have it both ways. Regardless, this really isn't a case of my distaste for Baez. It's pretty clear that as hitters both Olt and Alcantara have done better since their struggles than Baez. Like I said, ultimately that might be meaningless in the grand scheme as they were throw away innings at the end of the season and essentially practice. However, I do have a problem if they go out there and say Baez is ready. If Rizzo bats .150 in spring training then fine, it's meaningless because he's already proved what he can do last season. But keep in mind he didn't bat .150 in ST to earn his way onto the major league team initially. After his struggle with the Padres in 2011 where he hit .141/.281/.242 in roughly similar sample size as Baez he went back down after being traded to AAA. He proceeded to hit .342/.405/.696 before his ultimate call up with the cubs. This is what I'm talking about when I feel like players need to earn their way rather than being handed a position. If Baez goes down hits something resembling Rizzo's 284 PA 2013 AAA then despite all I've said about him and his future I'm entirely on board with him earning his shot at the majors again. It's frankly what I wanted to see before being called up last year but he really never reach that level of domination.

Also, I'd like to point out that you bring up hustle, base running and fielding as though it's not something Alcantara has been doing. At the end of the day you carry 25 players. They presently have 7 OFs(Denorfria possibly starts on the DL), 6 IF(cubs.com has Alcantara listed here), and 3 catchers. They have 17 pitchers though they list Turner and Wada who probably start on the DL. It's worth noting if Wada does start on the DL that probably means Zac Rosscup or Drake Britton makes the team as unless they start Wood in the bullpen they have no other lefties. You typically carry 12 pitchers and 13 positional players. So, you're looking at cutting probably 3 pitchers(my money is on Beeler, Schlitter, and one of Britton/Rosscup). They also need to cut 3 positional players. If we assume long term Denofria is on the team you basically have to decide which 2 of the 3 OFs you cut in Lake, Szczur and Sweeney. If you then keep 3 catchers you have to decide on one infielder. That's just the math of things. While it's possible you could cut all 3 of the OF I listed above that then means you're making Alcantara your 5th OF. Your 5th OF sees basically no at bats. For example, Scott Van Slyke last season as the dodgers 5th saw 246 PAs. If that's what you're wanting to do with Alcantara you're entirely wasting him.

In a hypothetical world where Baez is guaranteed to make the team you'd be far better of sending Alcantara to AAA where he plays every day or close to it. There in lies the problem as I see it. Both Alcantara and Baez are good enough prospects that they need every day status. The idea of both works in a world where Olt sucked and didn't play 3B but that seems out now. Baez isn't going to play SS with Castro here. Alcantara isn't going to play CF with Fowler here. So realistically if we assume Soler is an every day guy as well in RF the only possible position for Alcantara to play with Baez is LF but that idea is pretty hamfisted especially with Bryant looming. Playing Alcantara as a back up IF has the same problem as him being the 5th OF. Some sort of 2B platoon gimps both Baez/Alcantara's PAs. La Stella makes perfect sense as a bench guy. He's decent, hits left handed off the bench and he's not someone you're worried about missing a bunch of PAs.

What I see happening is them carrying 3 catchers until they can find someone desperate enough to give good value for Castillo. They leave one of Alcantara/Baez(obviously my money is on Baez) in the minors where they see every day play until that point. At that point, whomever was in the majors will have likely seen enough time to make a judgment call on while whomever was in the minors will have had enough time to show whether they warrant a call up. Though, I should also mention that this roster spot could also go to Bryant.
 

SilenceS

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I feel like this an argument where you say spring training doesn't matter then you use stats from spring training as if they matter in this case K's and walks. You really can't have it both ways. Regardless, this really isn't a case of my distaste for Baez. It's pretty clear that as hitters both Olt and Alcantara have done better since their struggles than Baez. Like I said, ultimately that might be meaningless in the grand scheme as they were throw away innings at the end of the season and essentially practice. However, I do have a problem if they go out there and say Baez is ready. If Rizzo bats .150 in spring training then fine, it's meaningless because he's already proved what he can do last season. But keep in mind he didn't bat .150 in ST to earn his way onto the major league team initially. After his struggle with the Padres in 2011 where he hit .141/.281/.242 in roughly similar sample size as Baez he went back down after being traded to AAA. He proceeded to hit .342/.405/.696 before his ultimate call up with the cubs. This is what I'm talking about when I feel like players need to earn their way rather than being handed a position. If Baez goes down hits something resembling Rizzo's 284 PA 2013 AAA then despite all I've said about him and his future I'm entirely on board with him earning his shot at the majors again. It's frankly what I wanted to see before being called up last year but he really never reach that level of domination.

Also, I'd like to point out that you bring up hustle, base running and fielding as though it's not something Alcantara has been doing. At the end of the day you carry 25 players. They presently have 7 OFs(Denorfria possibly starts on the DL), 6 IF(cubs.com has Alcantara listed here), and 3 catchers. They have 17 pitchers though they list Turner and Wada who probably start on the DL. It's worth noting if Wada does start on the DL that probably means Zac Rosscup or Drake Britton makes the team as unless they start Wood in the bullpen they have no other lefties. You typically carry 12 pitchers and 13 positional players. So, you're looking at cutting probably 3 pitchers(my money is on Beeler, Schlitter, and one of Britton/Rosscup). They also need to cut 3 positional players. If we assume long term Denofria is on the team you basically have to decide which 2 of the 3 OFs you cut in Lake, Szczur and Sweeney. If you then keep 3 catchers you have to decide on one infielder. That's just the math of things. While it's possible you could cut all 3 of the OF I listed above that then means you're making Alcantara your 5th OF. Your 5th OF sees basically no at bats. For example, Scott Van Slyke last season as the dodgers 5th saw 246 PAs. If that's what you're wanting to do with Alcantara you're entirely wasting him.

In a hypothetical world where Baez is guaranteed to make the team you'd be far better of sending Alcantara to AAA where he plays every day or close to it. There in lies the problem as I see it. Both Alcantara and Baez are good enough prospects that they need every day status. The idea of both works in a world where Olt sucked and didn't play 3B but that seems out now. Baez isn't going to play SS with Castro here. Alcantara isn't going to play CF with Fowler here. So realistically if we assume Soler is an every day guy as well in RF the only possible position for Alcantara to play with Baez is LF but that idea is pretty hamfisted especially with Bryant looming. Playing Alcantara as a back up IF has the same problem as him being the 5th OF. Some sort of 2B platoon gimps both Baez/Alcantara's PAs. La Stella makes perfect sense as a bench guy. He's decent, hits left handed off the bench and he's not someone you're worried about missing a bunch of PAs.

What I see happening is them carrying 3 catchers until they can find someone desperate enough to give good value for Castillo. They leave one of Alcantara/Baez(obviously my money is on Baez) in the minors where they see every day play until that point. At that point, whomever was in the majors will have likely seen enough time to make a judgment call on while whomever was in the minors will have had enough time to show whether they warrant a call up. Though, I should also mention that this roster spot could also go to Bryant.

Spring triaining stats are meaningless to a certain degree. I wasnt having it both way. I put it in your perspective. Basically, you say Alcanatara and Olt have done well when they have struck out right around the same rate as Baez. Alcantara has walked 1 more time. You are basically saying Alcantara has fixed himself because a few more balls found hole then Baez. Its a difference of 5 hits in BA btw Alcantara and Baez. If you say Baez hasnt earned it, then you cant say Alcantara has earned it.

Yet again, Joe Maddon is much smarter then us when it comes on how to develop prospects. He thinks Baez should be on the big league club then I trust his decision. He knows a fuck ton more then us.
 

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