If the Bulls fire Tom Thibodeau...

RamiTheBullsFan

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...because he plays his key players too many minutes, I am jumping squarely on the "I hate GarPax" bandwagon.

Maybe I haven't been paying close enough attention to the insider grumblings, but after watching a video on ESPN about how the Bulls and Thibodeau are "heading in that directions" it just pisses me off. Not that I necessarily believe the source is credible, but that this is now getting some national spotlight.

If they really are planning on firing one of the best coaches in the league over this... that would be the stupidest thing I've ever see their F.O. do... ever.
 

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...because he plays his key players too many minutes, I am jumping squarely on the "I hate GarPax" bandwagon.

Maybe I haven't been paying close enough attention to the insider grumblings, but after watching a video on ESPN about how the Bulls and Thibodeau are "heading in that directions" it just pisses me off. Not that I necessarily believe the source is credible, but that this is now getting some national spotlight.

If they really are planning on firing one of the best coaches in the league over this... that would be the stupidest thing I've ever see their F.O. do... ever.
They would more so be firing him for irreconcilable differences and the fact he hasn't take the team far in the playoffs.

The front office expected Finals out of one of these teams over the past 5 years... and I think this year may be the ultimatum year.. Injuries won't be an excuse either.

Not that I support firing him, because I don't. But, I won't be surprised nor will it phase me.
 

Gustavus Adolphus

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I don't want Thibs to be fired, but the FO is well within their rights to fire him if they do not make the Finals this year.
 

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I don't want Thibs to be fired, but the FO is well within their rights to fire him if they do not make the Finals this year.
Yep... and I know Rose hasn't played in a playoff game since Game 1 of the 2012 Finals, but this team was then thoroughly embarrassed the rest of that series... barely survied a 1st round in 2012-13 against a very dysfunctional Brooklyn team, and then were annihilated by Miami after stealing Game 1... Last year they were thoroughly embarrassed by Washington.

Even when Rose was lost to his ACL injury in 2012, most of us, most of the media still expected the Bulls to make an ECF run before bowing out to Miami. Last year many people expected us to beat Washington, then play a competitive series against Indiana. We won one lousy game against Washington and only because Mike Dunleavy went three point crazy. Oh and we lost ALL of our home games. Even without Rose, expectations are not being met.

The excuses are running dry for Thibs in the view of the front office.

Do I think he should be fired? No. And I hope this is the year he has a healthy lineup in the playoffs finally so we can see what he can do.
 

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In Thibs' defense he's only had a healthy playoff roster once. Rose being out obviously has much to do with the lack of Finals/ECF appearances that are so desired, but there is something to be said about getting smashed by Washington and losing all your home games.
 

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In Thibs' defense he's only had a healthy playoff roster once. Rose being out obviously has much to do with the lack of Finals/ECF appearances that are so desired, but there is something to be said about getting smashed by Washington and losing all your home games.
I'd argue even the Philly series after Rose tore his ACL. Game 2-4 were pathetic displays of basketball. I never watched Game 5, so I don't know what happened, but they won that one... Game 6... they blew it at the end. But they should have never put themselves in the 3-1 hole to begin with.
 

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I'd argue even the Philly series after Rose tore his ACL. Game 2-4 were pathetic displays of basketball. I never watched Game 5, so I don't know what happened, but they won that one... Game 6... they blew it at the end. But they should have never put themselves in the 3-1 hole to begin with.
True. Losing Noah in that series played a factor too (ankle injury in game 3? don't quite remember). Perhaps the team was completely gut punched by losing Rose that first game or something. But yeah, I still thought we could win that series.
 

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True. Losing Noah in that series played a factor too (ankle injury in game 3? don't quite remember). Perhaps the team was completely gut punched by losing Rose that first game or something. But yeah, I still thought we could win that series.
Yeah, Noah got hurt in Game 3. The team fall completely apart.. Much like the next year in the Nets series how everyone got injured in that series.

Injuries injuries injuries.. Either we're cursed, brought in glass players, coaching staff/training staff is doing something wrong.
 

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Yeah, Noah got hurt in Game 3. The team fall completely apart.. Much like the next year in the Nets series how everyone got injured in that series.

Injuries injuries injuries.. Either we're cursed, brought in glass players, coaching staff/training staff is doing something wrong.
I'm gonna put at least 30% blame on the training staff. The number of injuries does get somewhat ridiculous after a certain point. The Luol Deng spinal tap fiasco should never have happened either.

At the same time though, we have experienced quite a large number of freak injuries in the Thibodeau era (Rose's major injuries, Boozer gym bag, Jimmy's random shoulder/elbow injuries, McDermott injury, etc). Bad luck is probably the biggest factor of all.
 

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In Thibs' defense he's only had a healthy playoff roster once. Rose being out obviously has much to do with the lack of Finals/ECF appearances that are so desired, but there is something to be said about getting smashed by Washington and losing all your home games.
While that might be true, the obvious argument here is that what he brings you as a regular season coach does not even begin to equal the lack of what is being brought in the playoffs.

Again, while I will not be happy if Thibs is let go (or traded, at least do that), it's clear from the expectations that the FO has that they are well within their right to fire him.
 

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I'm gonna put at least 30% blame on the training staff. The number of injuries does get somewhat ridiculous after a certain point. The Luol Deng spinal tap fiasco should never have happened either.

At the same time though, we have experienced quite a large number of freak injuries in the Thibodeau era (Rose's major injuries, Boozer gym bag, Jimmy's random shoulder/elbow injuries, McDermott injury, etc). Bad luck is probably the biggest factor of all.
wouldn't really say McDermott was a freak injury more so than just wear and tear on the guy that was affecting his game.

Rose's injuries all are... Rose has kind proved he's made of glass though.

Boozer had a reputation for being made of glass, but after his first season here (which was his best season here) he was actually VERY healthy the reminder of his time here. And if I recall, the gym bag was more so him punching a hole in a wall over some argument with his ex-wife.

Noah has also had injuries his entire career here.
 

houheffna

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I would think that if Thibs is let go...it HAS to be for a damn good reason. And it would be hard to imagine he was let go without certain players signing off on it, if only by their silence.
 

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wouldn't really say McDermott was a freak injury more so than just wear and tear on the guy that was affecting his game.

Rose's injuries all are... Rose has kind proved he's made of glass though.

Boozer had a reputation for being made of glass, but after his first season here (which was his best season here) he was actually VERY healthy the reminder of his time here. And if I recall, the gym bag was more so him punching a hole in a wall over some argument with his ex-wife.

Noah has also had injuries his entire career here.
Yeah I'm just more saying that the injuries aren't on Thibs...they were either freak injuries or the guys were just prone to injury anyway. Boozer being the healthiest member of the team the past 3 years is the weirdest thing to say.
 

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Yeah I'm just more saying that the injuries aren't on Thibs...they were either freak injuries or the guys were just prone to injury anyway. Boozer being the healthiest member of the team the past 3 years is the weirdest thing to say.
Maybe the Bulls should sign other injury prone players in this league and they'll suddenly be healthy.
 

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If they let Thibs go, they better get Popovich or Rivers in return, because you won´t find a better Coach than Thibs.

Dude is a top 3 coach!
 

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It's a big IF that they would fire him. The only way I see it happening is if they had a replacement already in mind who they thought could get the team over the hump in the playoffs. I really don't know who that might be. Despite what the experts here think, the Bulls are a championship organization and maybe they see some limitations in Thibs.

I have grown weary of him playing people heavy minutes and never taking starters out the last 3-4 minutes of a 10-12 point game. They have had the best record during the regular season and not made the Finals. There are guys like Scott Skiles who turns a bad team around into a fair team but goes no farther before he wears thin on everybody. Thibs may be a guy who takes a good team to the brink but can't get them that last bit to win it all.
 

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I suppose it's possible that Thibs is another Mark Jackson...:shrug:
 

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I used to be a Thib's guy, he could do no wrong in my eyes. He's a great defensive coach. However, after the Bulls stocked the roster with a lot more offensive type of players, that has changed for me.

Injuries is part of the picture, imo. When your team is injured every year, you have to look at the whole process to see if you can do things differently to prevent this. It's not so much that Thib's is the cause of all the injuries, but instead, what can be done to prevent the injuries.

My main gripe with Thib's is his stubbornness of wanting to do things his old fashioned way. He knows one way and that's it. It's his unwillingness to try to do things differently that I don't like, and he refuses to change.

I'm not sure he really is that good of an offensive coach, and I'm not sure that he really knows how to use an offensive roster properly. He refuses to let go of his defensive mentality of an offensive roster.

My main gripe is his roster lineup management. He is way too predictable with how he manages his substitutions and lineups, imo. He picks a rotation before a game, and he rarely strays from it. He makes his 1st substitution at the 4 minute mark, and then at the 3 minute mark of every quarter.

He'll stick with these substitution even if another player is hot. He always tries to win a game with a defensive lineup at the end of games rather than with an offensive lineup. His screen offense just doesn't work against good defensive teams late in the game.

The question for me is, is Thib's good enough to take the Bulls to a Championship? Sure, he wins a lot of games in the regular season, but he doesn't win in the post season when it really counts. This is his main problem.

This problem has nothing to do with anything else except maybe Thib's isn't good enough to win it all. There have been a lot of good coaches in the regular season, but there are only a few that separate themselves in the post season.

The bottom line is that if Thib's wants to silence the critics, he must win some games when it counts.... in the playoffs. The injuries, his stubbornness, his old fashioned way, and his red shirting of rookies, are all just part of what Thib's brings to the table.

But it ultimately be his ineffectiveness to win in the playoffs that could cost him his job. Stick up for Thib's all you want, and I have in the past, but another early exit this year in the playoffs could be the final straw on the camels back, imo, and especially if they under perform.
 

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