Bulls inability to get the big fish

Scoot26 · Jun 24, 2015

Alpha Male said:
They have failed on both fronts. I can't understand how anyone can dismiss their ineptitude in free agency. This team has had chances to acquire franchising changing players and has failed every time. This isn't the memphis grizzlies. This is chicago. I would think you can convince at least one guy to come here and play for a big market.

Please please please. Continue to disregard this post:

http://www.chicitysports.com/forum/...the-big-fish?p=2191069&viewfull=1#post2191069

BearDen · Jun 24, 2015

Alpha Male said:
Doesn't matter. Fact remains no one thought he was a franchise changing player when they acquired him. I think it was equivalent to getting boozer. Good player but not enough. There have been those but the bulls always struck out.

Making stuff up is fun.

BearDen · Jun 24, 2015

Alpha Male said:
They have failed on both fronts. I can't understand how anyone can dismiss their ineptitude in free agency. This team has had chances to acquire franchising changing players and has failed every time. This isn't the memphis grizzlies. This is chicago. I would think you can convince at least one guy to come here and play for a big market.

So much fail in this post.

Scoot26 · Jun 24, 2015

Alpha Male said:
Doesn't matter. Fact remains no one thought he was a franchise changing player when they acquired him. I think it was equivalent to getting boozer. Good player but not enough. There have been those but the bulls always struck out.

lol, everyone thought he was a franchise changing player just about. You had tons of fans and Chicago writers claiming the move made Chicago championship contenders. Claiming the FA curse was over and such.

Stop trying to make shit up and just admit you're wrong when it comes to the free agency side.

There's tons of reasons why we didn't get top notch free agents and rarely is it because of who we are.

BearDen · Jun 24, 2015

I would like to know what star players we actually had a chance to get, but didn't try.

Alpha Male · Jun 24, 2015

BearDen said:
I would like to know what star players we actually had a chance to get, but didn't try.

Harden, howard, melo when he was on the trading block, and I'm sure there are others i am forgetting. I understand not having the assets like was the case for love and cousins this year but some of those guys were traded for junk.

Scoot26 · Jun 24, 2015

Alpha Male said:
Harden, howard, melo when he was on the trading block, and I'm sure there are others i am forgetting. I understand not having the assets like was the case for love and cousins this year but some of those guys were traded for junk.

Harden nor Howard have any desire what so ever to come to Chicago. They both had lists, and Chicago was not on that list. Funny that they are both playing together now.

Melo was involved in a ton of trade rumors to Chicago before he went to New York.

Alpha Male · Jun 24, 2015

Scoot26 said:
lol, everyone thought he was a franchise changing player just about. You had tons of fans and Chicago writers claiming the move made Chicago championship contenders. Claiming the FA curse was over and such.

Stop trying to make shit up and just admit you're wrong when it comes to the free agency side.

There's tons of reasons why we didn't get top notch free agents and rarely is it because of who we are.

This team has a history of missing out on free agents. That is an undeniable fact. Getting ben wallance and a pau gasol past his prime doesn't change that.

clonetrooper264 · Jun 24, 2015

Alpha Male said:
Doesn't matter. Fact remains no one thought he was a franchise changing player when they acquired him. I think it was equivalent to getting boozer. Good player but not enough. There have been those but the bulls always struck out.

You're off your rocker. Pretty much every major sports outlet thought Chicago was a title contender because of that move.

Here's one example: http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2006-07-04/sports/0607040228_1_bulls-grant-hill-center-stage

BearDen · Jun 24, 2015

Alpha Male said:
Harden, howard, melo when he was on the trading block, and I'm sure there are others i am forgetting. I understand not having the assets like was the case for love and cousins this year but some of those guys were traded for junk.

As Scoot said, we never had a chance at Harden (he was traded by the way, not a FA pickup) or Howard. When Melo was traded from Denver, NY had to give up every asset they had and now they're stuck in a terrible situation. I'll take the Bulls current situation over the Knicks.

BearDen · Jun 24, 2015

Alpha Male said:
This team has a history of missing out on free agents. That is an undeniable fact. Getting ben wallance and a pau gasol past his prime doesn't change that.

Every team that didn't sign a star free agent has a history of missing out on free agents. There are only so many stars that become available in this league.

Scoot26 · Jun 24, 2015

Alpha Male said:
This team has a history of missing out on free agents. That is an undeniable fact. Getting ben wallance and a pau gasol past his prime doesn't change that.

So does every single team in the NBA not named the Orlando Magic, Miami Heat, and Los Angeles Lakers.

clonetrooper264 · Jun 24, 2015

I'd say of all the FAs that we supposedly suck at getting, the only real chances we had were maybe Pau before he went the Lakers, in theory the Big 3 of Miami in 2010 or Joe Johnson, and Melo last offseason.

Pau is probably the biggest fail knowing what Deng is now. Could've been had, we just overvalued Deng. Blame GarPax for this one.

Nothing you can do regarding the Big 3. We cleared the space and could offer two of them max deals with the appeal of playing alongside Rose. They already had their plans set.

Joe Johnson and Melo we just got screwed with money. Their teams could offer them more and that's what they went for. How much can you really blame GarPax for not being able to match a Bird rights max deal? And before you make some argument that it only happens to them, remember Chris Bosh just this past offseason with Dallas.

So yes, we do suck at getting FAs and whatnot, but it's not due to lack of effort.

Scoot26 · Jun 24, 2015

clonetrooper264 said:
I'd say of all the FAs that we supposedly suck at getting, the only real chances we had were maybe Pau before he went the Lakers, in theory the Big 3 of Miami in 2010 or Joe Johnson, and Melo last offseason.

Pau is probably the biggest fail knowing what Deng is now. Could've been had, we just overvalued Deng. Blame GarPax for this one.

Nothing you can do regarding the Big 3. We cleared the space and could offer two of them max deals with the appeal of playing alongside Rose. They already had their plans set.

Joe Johnson and Melo we just got screwed with money. Their teams could offer them more and that's what they went for. How much can you really blame GarPax for not being able to match a Bird rights max deal? And before you make some argument that it only happens to them, remember Chris Bosh just this past offseason with Dallas.

So yes, we do suck at getting FAs and whatnot, but it's not due to lack of effort.

Pau wasn't an FA then.

And if we're going to talk current GM regime, then yes.. But if you want to include the post-Jordan era.. then TMac and Eddie Jones were failures, though you really didn't miss much concerning Eddie Jones.

Duncan has still never left SA and Grant Hill was never the same, so no real big miss there either if we're going to include hindsight into this.

LeBron-Wade-Bosh knew they were going to play together, I don't think they knew where until probably that summer. I always got the feeling Wade tipped Riley off as to what they were up to, thus giving Riley the ability to plan and prepare for 2010 free agency.

Joe Johnson was definitely ours until Atlanta offered the absolute max and of the max. And as much as we trash Boozer, he was considered the 6th best free agent that year behind The big 3, Johnson,and Amare.. and he was way cheaper than Amare.

So, the majority of it is a turn of a bunch of bad luck, unforeseen circumstances, or simply not being prepared for the moment (Like Melo last year in not shedding enough salary, though they still may not have swayed him).

RamiTheBullsFan · Jun 24, 2015

Alpha Male said:
A little bit too late.

Sorry, but that signing started in the All-Star game. You can't just dismiss Gasol because it doesn't suit your argument.

BearDen · Jun 24, 2015

Don't get me wrong, we've certainly missed on some role player free agents (every available SG before we moved Jimmy there) or chose not to retain good ones that we had (Korver, Belineli).

clonetrooper264 · Jun 24, 2015

Scoot26 said:
Pau wasn't an FA then.

Yeah I guess I meant "big fish" instead of FAs...YOU GET MY POINT!

And if we're going to talk current GM regime, then yes.. But if you want to include the post-Jordan era.. then TMac and Eddie Jones were failures, though you really didn't miss much concerning Eddie Jones.

Duncan has still never left SA and Grant Hill was never the same, so no real big miss there either if we're going to include hindsight into this.

LeBron-Wade-Bosh knew they were going to play together, I don't think they knew where until probably that summer. I always got the feeling Wade tipped Riley off as to what they were up to, thus giving Riley the ability to plan and prepare for 2010 free agency.

Joe Johnson was definitely ours until Atlanta offered the absolute max and of the max. And as much as we trash Boozer, he was considered the 6th best free agent that year behind The big 3, Johnson,and Amare.. and he was way cheaper than Amare.

So, the majority of it is a turn of a bunch of bad luck, unforeseen circumstances, or simply not being prepared for the moment (Like Melo last year in not shedding enough salary, though they still may not have swayed him).

But hey...screw GarPax

Scoot26 · Jun 24, 2015

clonetrooper264 said:
Yeah I guess I meant "big fish" instead of FAs...YOU GET MY POINT!

But hey...screw GarPax

And I'd argue of all the "big free agents" that have moved in whatever years, only 3 have had profound impacts on their franchise and changed the make up of those franchises.. Shaq when he signed in 96 with LA, then not one until LeBron and Bosh going to Miami in 2010. And I guess you could say LeBron again in 2014. That's it.

clonetrooper264 · Jun 24, 2015

If I'm gonna fault GarPax for not getting players, I'm going to fault them for not getting a SG for like 3-5 years depending on how you view drafting Jimmy. Maybe you add Afflalo in 2011 and things are different (barring Rose's torn ACL). Maybe you trade Deng way earlier and you get someone useful on the wing.

And even then, they got Rip, which once again failed, but when he was healthy he actually looked pretty good on that team. Except he was never healthy. Always get the players several years to late...

FirstTimer · Jun 24, 2015

Gar Pax's biggest issue was overvaluing guys already on the team. Noah/Deng/Hinrich/Gordon etc

Bulls inability to get the big fish

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