Bears sign the AFL's Devin Hester

didshereallysaythat · Jul 28, 2015

Mongo_76 said:
You say poor execution, I say that he refused to run what the coaches called.

But don't let what Trestman or Kromer say get in the way of your undying support.

On that note, other than 9 years of futility, what will it take for you to see things realistically?

Last year pushed me over the edge. In fact one of my most disputed and commented on threads on here was one in which I supported Cutler and freeze framed a throw McCown couldn't make but Cutler could.

So what will it take for you PIB or HBK to finally get it?

I already told you that Cutler was a stopgap QB and should no longer be considered a franchise QB.

The only area I defend him is when people question his effort. And even if he didn't run what Trestman called, that still doesn't question his effort to try and win. I mean, Trestman's play calling was shit anyway. I bet if he was coaching Brady, Tom would have told him to fuck off.

Mongo_76 · Jul 28, 2015

didshereallysaythat said:
I already told you that Cutler was a stopgap QB and should no longer be considered a franchise QB.

You're right. My bad.

The only area I defend him is when people question his effort. And even if he didn't run what Trestman called, that still doesn't question his effort to try and win. I mean, Trestman's play calling was shit anyway. I bet if he was coaching Brady, Tom would have told him to fuck off.

Cool. Got it.

There are many ex-NFL players who have said the Mike Martz was the best offensive mind they have ever been coached by. Trestman also came in with similar credentials.

HE basically told both to fuck off and refused to play in the system.

Does that show a lack of effort?

You tell me.

didshereallysaythat · Jul 28, 2015

Mongo_76 said:
You're right. My bad.

Cool. Got it.

There are many ex-NFL players who have said the Mike Martz was the best offensive mind they have ever been coached by. Trestman also came in with similar credentials.

HE basically told both to fuck off and refused to play in the system.

Does that show a lack of effort?

You tell me.

Insubordination, sure. I definitely think Cutler is stubborn. But at the same time, he is competitive and does want to win. He just isn't that emotional rah rah rah guy. But really, as I said before, it is kind of an irrelevant topic. That's because Cutler doesn't have the skill set to be a franchise QB. Sure he has the arm strength and athleticism. But he doesn't have the ability to process information and react to defenses that an elite QB has.

Willis1524 · Jul 28, 2015

Mongo_76 said:
You're right. My bad.

Cool. Got it.

There are many ex-NFL players who have said the Mike Martz was the best offensive mind they have ever been coached by. Trestman also came in with similar credentials.

HE basically told both to fuck off and refused to play in the system.

Does that show a lack of effort?

You tell me.

Trestman also came in with a history of his offense folding in the second year as firsttimer showed right when he was hired.

1ke · Jul 28, 2015

Mongo_76 said:
You're right. My bad.

Cool. Got it.

There are many ex-NFL players who have said the Mike Martz was the best offensive mind they have ever been coached by. Trestman also came in with similar credentials.

HE basically told both to fuck off and refused to play in the system.

Does that show a lack of effort?

You tell me.

Doesn't it ever get tiring for you to continue on with this shit?

Hbkrusso · Jul 28, 2015

botfly10 said:
I sure miss Hester.

Granted, ST unit was shit last year and Hester prob wouldnt have done anything, but still miss him.

Rush said:
I got excited for a second, even almost over the hill, miss #23

makes 3 of us guy was a great bear I enjoyed his career as a bear one of my favs

Mongo_76 · Jul 28, 2015

didshereallysaythat;2212045[B said:
]Insubordination, sure. I definitely think Cutler is stubborn. But at the same time, he is competitive and does want to win. [/B] He just isn't that emotional rah rah rah guy.

Cool. So he wants to win.

Do you know anyone who doesn't like winning? No really. Who like losing?

But really, as I said before, it is kind of an irrelevant topic. That's because Cutler doesn't have the skill set to be a franchise QB. Sure he has the arm strength and athleticism. But he doesn't have the ability to process information and react to defenses that an elite QB has.

Agreed on the above.

But more than that, as the film from Greg Olsen (via HBK) noted, this is a team sport. All11 guys HAVE to play to the same beat of the same drummer. When one guy strays off ( whether its a LT, C, RB, RG, WR...) it destroys the scheme.

As a QB, he is the most integral part of that harmony. If he is on board, the whole offense will likely follow. If he takes a shit (on the scheme or playcaller), the team offense will crumble.

And when you build your team around a scheme(that is based on your QB) and he quits on it - the team will fold.

Do you agree with that?

Mongo_76 · Jul 28, 2015

1ke said:
Doesn't it ever get tiring for you to continue on with this shit?

Does it ever get tiring backing a guy who has repeatedly(and almost admittedly) blown up the team you love?

Mongo_76 · Jul 28, 2015

Willis1524 said:
Trestman also came in with a history of his offense folding in the second year as firsttimer showed right when he was hired.

He runs a WCO.

Has a few wrinkles here and there.

But anyone who actually knows offensive schemes, knows what he called.

The WCO is, by nature, a "here is what I'm sending, try and stop it" offense.

That is why a zone Oline scheme is required. That is why receivers sight adjust. That is why pre-snap reads are critical.

What doesn't work is when an OC calls a scheme and play and a QB decides he would rather do his own thing.

didshereallysaythat · Jul 28, 2015

Mongo_76 said:
Cool. So he wants to win.

Do you know anyone who doesn't like winning? No really. Who like losing?

Agreed on the above.

But more than that, as the film from Greg Olsen (via HBK) noted, this is a team sport. All11 guys HAVE to play to the same beat of the same drummer. When one guy strays off ( whether its a LT, C, RB, RG, WR...) it destroys the scheme.

As a QB, he is the most integral part of that harmony. If he is on board, the whole offense will likely follow. If he takes a shit (on the scheme or playcaller), the team offense will crumble.

And when you build your team around a scheme(that is based on your QB) and he quits on it - the team will fold.

Do you agree with that?

Yeah but the system was broken. The biggest problem last year was Trestman. The play calling was shit. The Bears were never THAT BAD with Cutler until last year. I don't agree with what Cutler supposedly did. But it was probably an act of desperation.

Willis1524 · Jul 28, 2015

Mongo_76 said:
He runs a WCO.

Has a few wrinkles here and there.

But anyone who actually knows offensive schemes, knows what he called.

The WCO is, by nature, a "here is what I'm sending, try and stop it" offense.

That is why a zone Oline scheme is required. That is why receivers sight adjust. That is why pre-snap reads are critical.

What doesn't work is when an OC calls a scheme and play and a QB decides he would rather do his own thing.

Even if we say last year was completly on Cutler, how do you explain the same drop in offense in his previous stops? Was Steve Young out there saying fuck trestman too?

Hbkrusso · Jul 29, 2015

Willis1524 said:
Even if we say last year was completly on Cutler, how do you explain the same drop in offense in his previous stops? Was Steve Young out there saying fuck trestman too?

he shoots....

Sculpt · Jul 29, 2015

Johnny said:
everyone you just named sucked brah

Even with the Bears sucky ST blocking, Chris Williams still scored us a TD plus a decent avg, dude just got injured, & Bears ST sucked.

Mongo_76 · Jul 29, 2015

Willis1524 said:
Even if we say last year was completly on Cutler, how do you explain the same drop in offense in his previous stops? Was Steve Young out there saying fuck trestman too?

Who said it was JUST Cutler?

When you base your point off a straw man argument, it flops...

And btw, the 1996 49ers (Trestmans 2nd year) offense was #3 in scoring, #6 in total yards, #2 in turn over ratio and finished 12-4 (were 11-5 in 1995). Steve Young was completing 68% of his passes, had a better than 2 to 1 TD to INT ratio - before he got injured.

Please don't compare Cutler to Steve Young.

Willis1524 · Jul 29, 2015

Mongo_76 said:
Who said it was JUST Cutler?

When you base your point off a straw man argument, it flops...

And btw, the 1996 49ers (Trestmans 2nd year) offense was #3 in scoring, #6 in total yards, #2 in turn over ratio and finished 12-4 (were 11-5 in 1995). Steve Young was completing 68% of his passes, had a better than 2 to 1 TD to INT ratio - before he got injured.

Please don't compare Cutler to Steve Young.

When you say things like "Cutler decides to do his own thing" you are implying that he sabotaged the offense. Sound like you are saying it was his fault. No straw man there. I want comparing Steve Young to Cutler, i was comparing second year offenses. I will see if I can find first timers post, he said it better than I did.

Mongo_76 · Jul 29, 2015

Willis1524 said:
When you say things like "Cutler decides to do his own thing" you are implying that he sabotaged the offense. Sound like you are saying it was his fault. No straw man there. I want comparing Steve Young to Cutler, i was comparing second year offenses. I will see if I can find first timers post, he said it better than I did.

Kromer and Trestman both said that....

But again, me pointing that out does not mean Cutler ignoring the playclaling was the only reason the team sucked. As I have said many many many times, Cutler sucking was just one of the reasons the team flopped.

1ke · Jul 29, 2015

Mongo_76 said:
Does it ever get tiring backing a guy who has repeatedly(and almost admittedly) blown up the team you love?

But why are you talking about the quarterback in a thread about a fringe specialist?

Tjodalv · Jul 29, 2015

FatBabiesHaveNoPride said:
Weems was a very solid NFL ST guy. The Bears had a massive hole at return man until Rocky Marciano came off the couch.

IIRC, Weems went back to Atlanta and had a nice season.

For what it's worth, Eric Weems is a very nice NFL special teams player.

Yep, 34 return yards and 11 tackles (the tackles are nothing to scoff at). He did set a career mark with 102 receiving yards though. (it should be noted that Weems averaged 17 yards per return last season, while the guy Desbro continuously whines about averaged 24.1)

Weems is a fucking stud, the Bears rue letting him walk...

truthbedamned · Jul 29, 2015

He plays it well off the net. Will definitely make the team

truthbedamned · Jul 29, 2015

Mongo_76 said:
Kromer and Trestman both said that....

But again, me pointing that out does not mean Cutler ignoring the playclaling was the only reason the team sucked. As I have said many many many times, Cutler sucking was just one of the reasons the team flopped.

And Mongo turns another thread into bashing Jay Cutler.

Bears sign the AFL's Devin Hester

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