Bulls to find Rose's replacement in draft?

Scoot26

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I don't see them having the assets to make a trade unless they trade Butler.

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Axl Rose

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I don't see them having the assets to make a trade unless they trade Butler.

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so basically we'll have the same team next year sans Gasol?

i don't see us signing anybody impactful with the current state of the team
 

Enasic

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Even if we somehow were able to land Dunn, I'm not sold on him being the PG of the future. Very questionable decision maker, not a great shooter, average instincts at best. Physically he has great tools, but he is already 22 and while that's still young, it's old for a rookie. I think he'll be a John Wall - lite type of player but not nearly the passer. That's not terrible for a top 5 pick, but it's not great either. Besides Simmons/Ingram, I would prefer Hield and Murray over Dunn.
 

Enasic

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I just don't buy Simmons.

He definitely comes with a lot of concerns, mainly his desire to be great and competitive spirit, but he would just be too tough to turn down. Just his passing ability, athleticism, and ability to run and start the break is something this team sorely needs. He didn't need a jump shot in college because he was completely dominant inside the paint, but his form isn't terrible. If he puts the time in, he should develop a respectable jumper. I probably would take him over Ingram, but it's close and that could change. I haven't really watched much of either of them, TBH.
 

Gustavus Adolphus

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He definitely comes with a lot of concerns, mainly his desire to be great and competitive spirit, but he would just be too tough to turn down. Just his passing ability, athleticism, and ability to run and start the break is something this team sorely needs. He didn't need a jump shot in college because he was completely dominant inside the paint, but his form isn't terrible. If he puts the time in, he should develop a respectable jumper. I probably would take him over Ingram, but it's close and that could change. I haven't really watched much of either of them, TBH.
This is what I mean when I say I'm not buying Simmons: college basketball sucks. It's watered down to the point where one person can dominate and do some damage for a team, and LSU doesn't make the tournament. The number 1 overall recruit should be able to lead a team to the tournament in a watered down game.

Another thing is in basketball, more so than any other sport (maybe hockey, but I'm a hockey idiot), it's so easy to identify a standout player. You should really be able to watch a game and say, "He's a superstar." Wiggins had that. Lebron had that. Anthony Davis, Kyrie, Rose. I just don't see it with Simmons.
 

Enasic

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This is what I mean when I say I'm not buying Simmons: college basketball sucks. It's watered down to the point where one person can dominate and do some damage for a team, and LSU doesn't make the tournament. The number 1 overall recruit should be able to lead a team to the tournament in a watered down game.

Another thing is in basketball, more so than any other sport (maybe hockey, but I'm a hockey idiot), it's so easy to identify a standout player. You should really be able to watch a game and say, "He's a superstar." Wiggins had that. Lebron had that. Anthony Davis, Kyrie, Rose. I just don't see it with Simmons.

I gotcha. I think the main thing is that it's harder to buy into since his jump shot is so bad. I actually didn't buy the Wiggins superstar hype...or Kyrie...and while they're both really good and Wiggins should get better, are they franchise caliber players? I don't know...I wouldn't say Kyrie is and I'd be fairly surprised if Wiggins got into that first tier either. I think Simmons will be a star...to what caliber? Who knows. Same goes for Ingram.
 

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Wiggins under Thibs is going to be something. It'll probably shave 4 years off of his career, but it'll be a something.
 

Enasic

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Wiggins under Thibs is going to be something. It'll probably shave 4 years off of his career, but it'll be a something.

He'll get the most out of him. Still needs to improve his defense, rebounding, play making, and become more efficient. Outside shot still needs work. I think he'll take a leap next season and hover at or below all-star level.
 

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Rose has one year left on his contract. Which should be obvious, means he's in a contract year. So we know what happens with players in contract years, they either do or die, as far as their career goes. Especially that of a player in Rose's classification(broken but capable).

If the Bulls want to trade him, he'll likely be protected from rumors(aside from the speculation when the draft happens and the Bulls possibly do draft a potential replacement). Then he'll basically find that extra gear and show off during the season. OR he'll just crumble or quit. If scenario A happens, his stock will go up a bunch, especially to any team that is desperate to salvage their roster in a season where the cap should increase enough to reduce that impact. They would be willing to rent him and make that risk. IMO that would be the BEST case (not to be confused with the LIKELY case) for the Bulls.

IMO, it is really that simple, and nothing we say or do will change those facts. Also it would be pretty dumb for GarPax to aggressively shop him, or even give Rose the impression that he is being shopped, unless Rose himself has discussed a desire to leave behind closed doors. The best solution is to build on his progress from last season and extend that into this season, then work the trade deadline. This way you maximize the return, something a team with this many broken pieces needs to do for a rapid rebuild. The tank-tank-tank method can be just as bad as purgatory.
 

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Rose has one year left on his contract. Which should be obvious, means he's in a contract year. So we know what happens with players in contract years, they either do or die, as far as their career goes. Especially that of a player in Rose's classification(broken but capable).

If the Bulls want to trade him, he'll likely be protected from rumors(aside from the speculation when the draft happens and the Bulls possibly do draft a potential replacement). Then he'll basically find that extra gear and show off during the season. OR he'll just crumble or quit. If scenario A happens, his stock will go up a bunch, especially to any team that is desperate to salvage their roster in a season where the cap should increase enough to reduce that impact. They would be willing to rent him and make that risk. IMO that would be the BEST case (not to be confused with the LIKELY case) for the Bulls.

IMO, it is really that simple, and nothing we say or do will change those facts. Also it would be pretty dumb for GarPax to aggressively shop him, or even give Rose the impression that he is being shopped, unless Rose himself has discussed a desire to leave behind closed doors. The best solution is to build on his progress from last season and extend that into this season, then work the trade deadline. This way you maximize the return, something a team with this many broken pieces needs to do for a rapid rebuild. The tank-tank-tank method can be just as bad as purgatory.

I absolutely believe that the re-build needs to start right now not after Rose does whatever he is going to do. And I do not trade Butler unless they get some unbelievable bounty in return. This cannot be another Philly strip job which has proved to be exactly not what to do. One mid range draft pick isn't going to make much difference on this team. So they should eat their pride and trade Rose right now even if they do not get fair value in return. My target would be the Lakers who have beau coup bucks and a high lottery pick.

One of the problems the Bulls will prove to have also is the real inability to bring in free agents. I listened to a program on local LA radio out here about why high value free agents go where they want to. The biggest major factors is weather, good coaches, big market potential, chance at a championship, going back "home", and ,of course, money. Right now Chicago only has big market potential and MAYBE money(cheap ass owner). The likelihood of one of the top three free agents coming to Chi town is very very small.
 

ChiSoxCity

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Nah, big time free agents are looking for three things:
1. Getting the most money possible.

2. A chance to play with other big time players (who they like).

3. A chance to win a championship.

Weather, coaches and big markets do not matter. Everything is about relationships and money now. The Bulls don't have a great reputation among players around the league, so that is an extra strike against them.


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It's always money, first and foremost. And the notion that the best athletes need to take a pay cut to win is pretty dumb.


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Axl Rose

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Bulls will never get a big free agent unless said free agent is from Chicago. even if you dismiss the undesirables like cold weather and high crime rate...its just rare big time players switch teams via free agency

more focus needs to be put on the trade market and less on maintaining "flexibility" for future free agent classes

i mean how many times has a true superstar switched teams via free agency since 2000? only ones that are coming to mind are Grant Hill/Tmac in 2000 and LeBron in 2010...ironically both times they joined together/with other stars

*forgot about Dwight but hell he was pretty much ran out of LA by Kobe and wasn't a superstar by that point anymore anyway...if he was LA would have put in extra effort to make sure he stayed
 

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Nah, big time free agents are looking for three things:
1. Getting the most money possible.

2. A chance to play with other big time players (who they like).

3. A chance to win a championship.

Weather, coaches and big markets do not matter. Everything is about relationships and money now. The Bulls don't have a great reputation among players around the league, so that is an extra strike against them.


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I wish that you would have listened to that show I talked about. They went down the list of big time free agents and warm weather was definitely a consideration.
 

Enasic

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The trade market is great but we need pieces to trade. The only piece we have with significant trade value is Jimmy Butler. So our options are really:

1. Trade Jimmy
2. Try to lure Durant this year or Westbrook etc next year (not going to happen)
3. Keep Jimmy and sign 2nd and 3rd tier players and hope that could overcome the Cavs and Warriors of the league (it won't)
4. Bottom out, position yourself to land in the lottery, and hope to strike gold (too much luck needed there)

To me, option 1 is the best as it is the most realistic, and we could land a top 3 pick + other assets for him. Whereas landing in the lottery other years won't guarantee us a top 3 selection. If we keep Jimmy, we're going to end up like the Atlanta Hawks and be a decent/good regular season team and then an easy out in the post season. It depends on what your expectations are. I'd rather not be stuck in NBA purgatory and try to shake things up to propel the franchise into a championship contender. Sure, we may not get there, but staying pat and keeping up with the status quo is guaranteed not to get us there. Might as well take the chance now. Trade Jimmy for the richest package you could get, let contracts come off the books next year, and re-tool via free agency (even if it is just 2nd and 3rd tier players) and possible other picks/assets you acquired in the Jimmy trade.
 

ChiSoxCity

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I wish that you would have listened to that show I talked about. They went down the list of big time free agents and warm weather was definitely a consideration.

I'm not seeing any bigtime FAs flocking to Orlando, Los Angeles, Atlanta, Phoenix or Houston.

I think LeBron "taking his talents" to Miami to play with his pal created a paradigm shift in the NBA.

The problem with the Bulls is players seem to have a deep resentment towards ownership and the FO.

Let's be real here. Bad weather is a fact of life throughout North America. So is urban crime. Certain types of players just aren't interested in playing for this organization.

The reason why may have something to do with Michael, or the type of players the Bulls have shown a preference for drafting over the years. Either way, the Bulls have an image problem with certain players that needs to be addressed at some point.
 

cjswan232482

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It doesn't help that Illinois has some of the highest tax rates in the country. It is one thing to play below market in Texas and Florida, where the weather is solid and the taxes are low. You get a lot of bang for your buck. A whole other thing to do it in Chicago.
 

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