IST: Cubs @ Padres

TL1961

Well-known member
Joined:
Apr 24, 2013
Posts:
32,593
Liked Posts:
18,982
This is actually the exact opposite. IL play always favors the NL. In NL parks, the AL benches their DH or loses a regular so that the DH can "play" the field. In the AL parks the NL loses the pitcher and replaces that spot with a much better hitter. In both cases the advantage is given to the NL. On top of that, while the AL has to budget for a DH, the NL teams don't and thus can use that money elsewhere which is another advantage for the NL. Given those facts one would logically think that the NL should be better. Thru the years they aren't (based on IL play) which is why generally speaking the AL is a better league IMO.

You are entirely wrong with that logic. You're saying the poor AL team has to "bench a regular", when in fact the two teams are still playing by the same rules- i.e., the pitchers bat.

On the contrary, in an AL park, the AL plays the guy on their roster with lots of hitting ability who usn't well rounded enough to be a position player. The NL teams don't carry such a player on their rosters.

Both teams have knives, and the AL team also has a gun.

In the NL park, both use knives only.

In the AL park, the NL team uses one more knife, while the AL team draws a gun.
 

anotheridiot

Well-known member
Joined:
Jul 15, 2016
Posts:
5,935
Liked Posts:
799
2:30 start

Dexter Fowler CF
Kris Bryant 1B
Ben Zobrist 2B
Jorge Soler LF
Addison Russell SS
Jason Heyward RF
Javier Baez 3B
Willson Contreras C
Kyle Hendricks P
 

DJMoore_is_fat

New member
Joined:
Aug 26, 2012
Posts:
4,143
Liked Posts:
1,789
I expect us to win 10-0 today. Rizz gets a day off. Bryant will probably hit a 700-foot homer.

#FatBlimp
 

brett05

867-5309
Joined:
Apr 28, 2009
Posts:
27,226
Liked Posts:
-1,272
Location:
Hell
You are entirely wrong with that logic. You're saying the poor AL team has to "bench a regular", when in fact the two teams are still playing by the same rules- i.e., the pitchers bat.

So yes, the AL team is benching a regular member of the lineup. No need for the quotes. And in place of that person they put in a pitcher who does not bat unlike their NL counterpart. The loss for the AL team is very, very large.

On the contrary, in an AL park, the AL plays the guy on their roster with lots of hitting ability who usn't well rounded enough to be a position player. The NL teams don't carry such a player on their rosters.

No, the NL teams do not carry someone like that so they get to use that money elsewhere unlike the AL team. So in the AL parks the NL team gains a batter over a pitcher. Tremendous gain there.


That's the sound logic that you gloss over. The AL team loses offense in the NL parks and the NL teams gain it in the AL parks all the long the NL team has money to spend on a non-DH player that the AL does not.

I'm open, but that logic that I have presented seems full proof.
 

beckdawg

Well-known member
Joined:
Oct 31, 2012
Posts:
11,723
Liked Posts:
3,723
No, the NL teams do not carry someone like that so they get to use that money elsewhere unlike the AL team.

There's some dubious logic here IMO. For 150 games AL teams can throw most of their money into 9 position players and can largely skimp on their bench players with the lone exception being C where most teams will run two decent catchers. For example, let's look at the Blue Jay's roster. Their starting 9 is Martin, Smoak, Devon Travis, Tulow, Donaldson, Saunders, Pillar, Bautista and Encarnacion. Their next 4 players are Josh Thole their back up catcher, Darwin Barney(making $1.05 mil), Ezequiel Carrera(pre-arb), and Ryan Goins(league min). Cleveland like wise features a bench of Rajai Davis($5.25 mil), Marlon Byrd($1 mil), Chris Gimenez(back up C $1 milish) and Abraham Almonte(pre arb). In other words, AL teams don't need as deep of a bench because they rarely if ever pinch hit. In contrast, NL teams will often employ more expensive players on their bench because those players need to be able to field semi-regularly.

Also, you're missing one aspect of the DH which is greatly helpful to AL teams. They can take fading stars and plug them into a DH position when they no longer play like they are being paid. For example, Victor Martinez is still a useful hitter but he couldn't play anywhere in the field at this point. Like wise, ARod was getting huge money the past few years but they didn't want him playing the field. It's rarely a case of the team going out and paying the best hitter in the league to DH. It's more often the case of them having paid some position player big money in the past and now having a get out of jail free card. NL teams in the same position are forced into playing that aging star in the field
 

brett05

867-5309
Joined:
Apr 28, 2009
Posts:
27,226
Liked Posts:
-1,272
Location:
Hell
There's some dubious logic here IMO. For 150 games AL teams can throw most of their money into 9 position players and can largely skimp on their bench players with the lone exception being C where most teams will run two decent catchers. For example, let's look at the Blue Jay's roster. Their starting 9 is Martin, Smoak, Devon Travis, Tulow, Donaldson, Saunders, Pillar, Bautista and Encarnacion. Their next 4 players are Josh Thole their back up catcher, Darwin Barney(making $1.05 mil), Ezequiel Carrera(pre-arb), and Ryan Goins(league min). Cleveland like wise features a bench of Rajai Davis($5.25 mil), Marlon Byrd($1 mil), Chris Gimenez(back up C $1 milish) and Abraham Almonte(pre arb). In other words, AL teams don't need as deep of a bench because they rarely if ever pinch hit. In contrast, NL teams will often employ more expensive players on their bench because those players need to be able to field semi-regularly.

Also, you're missing one aspect of the DH which is greatly helpful to AL teams. They can take fading stars and plug them into a DH position when they no longer play like they are being paid. For example, Victor Martinez is still a useful hitter but he couldn't play anywhere in the field at this point. Like wise, ARod was getting huge money the past few years but they didn't want him playing the field. It's rarely a case of the team going out and paying the best hitter in the league to DH. It's more often the case of them having paid some position player big money in the past and now having a get out of jail free card. NL teams in the same position are forced into playing that aging star in the field

OK so here's the flaws I see. The bench players of NL guys are still just that bench guys. They are paid very similar to the AL guys. They could spend more on a bench guy or more on a reliever or starting pitcher. Or spend more on the guy playing first base because they don't have to pay the DH which makes much more than a bench guy and a but less than the top star or three on the team.
 

beckdawg

Well-known member
Joined:
Oct 31, 2012
Posts:
11,723
Liked Posts:
3,723
OK so here's the flaws I see. The bench players of NL guys are still just that bench guys. They are paid very similar to the AL guys. They could spend more on a bench guy or more on a reliever or starting pitcher. Or spend more on the guy playing first base because they don't have to pay the DH which makes much more than a bench guy and a but less than the top star or three on the team.

Brandon Moss is making over $8 mil to be on the Cards bench. Additionally, I fail to see your logic in that DH's even make the much money save for the case I mentioned with aging stars filling the DH role because teams can't do anything else with them. If we look at DH's this year with qualified PAs they consist of

David Ortiz - $16 mil
Edwin Encarnacion - $10 mil
Nelson Cruz - $14.25 mil
Carlos Santana - $8.25 mil
Carlos Beltran - $15 mil
Khris Davis - $524.5 k
Mark Trumbo - $9.15 mil
Mike Napoli - $7 mil
Joe Mauer - $23 mil
Victor Martinez - $18 mil
Corey Dickerson - $522.9 k
Albert Pujols - $25 mil
Kendrys Morales - $9

Right off the bat, Beltran, Pujols, Mauer, and Martinez are guys who are making big money but were signed as other positions. Ortiz is a career DH. Cruz has quickly gone from OF to DH only. Outside of those 6 players most of these guys aren't making substantial money. As a comparison, Chris Coghlan in the last year of arbitration is making $4.8 mil as a bench player for the cubs. The $5 mil difference between him and Encarnacion isn't buying you much.

So, this idea that a DH burdens AL teams with a ridiculous amount of salary really isn't the case. Most are just paying a DH slightly more than a typical NL bench guy and then in turn going dirt cheap on a defense only replacement a la Darwin Barney because that guy is only ever coming in via injury or late in a game to relieve a sub par defender.
 

Ari Bear

Hall of Famer
Joined:
Aug 20, 2012
Posts:
5,365
Liked Posts:
965
Location:
Peoria, Arizona
No Rizz today![emoji22]

Sent from my SM-G925V using Tapatalk
 

TC in Mississippi

CCS Staff
Joined:
Oct 22, 2014
Posts:
5,305
Liked Posts:
1,815
Hendricks doesn't look especially sharp today. First time in a while that he's struggled some with his command.
 

Ari Bear

Hall of Famer
Joined:
Aug 20, 2012
Posts:
5,365
Liked Posts:
965
Location:
Peoria, Arizona
3 runs isn't going to win the game today. Come on offense!

Sent from my SM-G925V using Tapatalk
 

chibears55

Well-known member
Joined:
Apr 18, 2013
Posts:
13,554
Liked Posts:
1,924
Great to see Russell power up lately but I hope he doesn't start thinking he needs to do it every AB and start swinging from heels

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I527 using Tapatalk
 

Omeletpants

Save America
Donator
Joined:
Aug 20, 2012
Posts:
27,619
Liked Posts:
-1,619
My favorite teams
  1. Colorado Rockies
  1. Atlanta United FC
  1. Los Angeles Lakers
  2. Orlando Magic
  3. Phoenix Suns
  4. Sacramento Kings
  1. Columbus Blue Jackets
Jorge Solar: "Does anyone have a rally that needs killing?"
 

beckdawg

Well-known member
Joined:
Oct 31, 2012
Posts:
11,723
Liked Posts:
3,723
Guessing that's it for Hendricks. Another high quality start for him.
 

Top