Things that have become clearer about the Bears off season

dabears70 · Jan 22, 2017

Matt Suhey said:
In the 2013 draft EJ Manuel was taken with the 16th pick and Geno Smith was taken with the first pick in the second round Mike Glennon was picked with the 73rd pick 3rd round Matt Barkley was picked at the top of the 4th round. . Dion Jordan, Mingo and Dee Milliner all went top 10. Sheldon Richardson and Star Lotulelei went 13 and 14.

In the 2012 draft Luck and RG3 were 1 and 2 Tannehil 8 Weeden 22 Osweiler 57 2nd round Russell Wilson 75 3rd round. So IMO Luck and Wilson were the only guys worth the 3rd pick in any draft maybe RG3 and they went 1 and 2. Morris Claibourne and Mark Barron went 6 and 7. Kuechly Stephne Gilmore and Dontari Poe went 9, 10, 11.

I believe this makes a good case to tread cautiously with passing an elite defender for a QB with reasonably big question marks at 3. I am trying to keep an open mind but Trubisky at 3 and Mahomes mid first to early 2nd round still makes the most sense to me.

Some good points here that even the posters that are wanting QB at #3 for sure can't overlook.

dabears70 · Jan 22, 2017

Matt Suhey said:
What QB's outside of Trubisky do any of you believe Pace has ranked top 10 material?

I'm not sure any of them will be in his top 10 on a BPA board with how strong the top half if not the whole 1st round of this draft is especially on defense but even with guys like L.Fournette and M.Williams i don't see any of the 3 making top 10.

JoJoBoxer · Jan 22, 2017

The thing that is funny is that we really have no idea who is going to be rated where by the time everything is said and done before the draft.

This time last year, Paxton Lynch was considered the #1 draft pick, Goff middle of the 1st, and Wentz a 2nd rounder.

When all was said and done, Goff and Wentz were top 10 rated (went 1 and 2) while Lynch dropped to late 1st early 2nd (picked 26th).

CAP BOSO · Jan 22, 2017

I don't understand the Jimmy G hype. I think his ceiling is Alex Smith caliber. Smith is really good, but not going to win a SB imo. I like Watson. He is a true boom or bust prospect. If he can improve his technique, I think he can be an elite qb. He has all the intangibles.

JoJoBoxer · Jan 22, 2017

CAP BOSO said:
I don't understand the Jimmy G hype. I think his ceiling is Alex Smith caliber. Smith is really good, but not going to win a SB imo. I like Watson. He is a true boom or bust prospect. If he can improve his technique, I think he can be an elite qb. He has all the intangibles.

Easy answer ... he is not Cutler.

dabears70 · Jan 22, 2017

bearmick said:
Honestly even if Allen or Adams or whoever pans out, their position is so irrelevant in comparison to QB that I just don't think it's worth pissing around and trying to get cute. If Pace likes one of these top 3 QBs I hope he doesn't over think it, and just gets him at 3.

If I'm going to for sure get the player I want at QB or a defensive position, but know if I shoot for both I might only get one, I'm getting the QB every time and I'll compromise on the defender.

As I said in another thread, to give an example of this, I would far rather have Eddie Goldman and a legit QB than have Gerald McCoy and a lesser QB.

WestsideResider said:
This board makes me think this daily.

The problem is that nobody is saying to pass on a QB at 3 if Pace believes that he's a franchise QB, all anyone is saying is only if Pace doesn't believe that then go defense at 3 and then take a QB with our next pick at 36 or some are even saying to take a defender at 3 and trade back into the bottom of the 1st and get a QB but NOBODY (unless i missed it) is saying to pass on a QB at 3 if there's one Pace believes in.

KittiesKorner · Jan 22, 2017

This shit again

Washington · Jan 22, 2017

tardigrade said:
This shit again

I do believe 98% of the people are on the same page. The disparity is the 1% saying don't draft a QB @ #3 no matter what and the other 1% saying take a QB @ #3 no matter what. This will be reiterated over a million times here before the draft gets here.

dabears70 · Jan 22, 2017

bearmick said:
Honestly even if Allen or Adams or whoever pans out, their position is so irrelevant in comparison to QB that I just don't think it's worth pissing around and trying to get cute. If Pace likes one of these top 3 QBs I hope he doesn't over think it, and just gets him at 3.

If I'm going to for sure get the player I want at QB or a defensive position, but know if I shoot for both I might only get one, I'm getting the QB every time and I'll compromise on the defender.

As I said in another thread, to give an example of this, I would far rather have Eddie Goldman and a legit QB than have Gerald McCoy and a lesser QB.

JoJoBoxer said:
Oops. I wasn't clear.

Would you rather draft a QB (all being equal at around 15) or trade down to 6 to 8 (or where you believe at least one QB will still be available) while getting extra picks?

As you mentioned above, with the 2nd round pick we might get lucky and get Cam Robinson who would be excellent for Howard's running while we can possibly end up with Watson at 6(?), and have 2 3rd (trade down) and 4th rounders for DB help. Moveover; we would still be getting the chance at the franchise QB while it being less of a reach.

I would think this should be an easy choice for Mick cause why wouldn't you trade down a couple of spots and still get one of the QB's while adding two or three more picks??

JoJoBoxer · Jan 22, 2017

dabears70 said:
I would think this should be an easy choice for Mick cause why wouldn't you trade down a couple of spots and still get one of the QB's while adding two or three more picks??

Well there are always the clueless people who can only say "trade down clowns" without actually analyzing the individual situation, though I don't believe that Mick falls into that category. Then again, he may have to much fear of not getting one of the top 3 QBs after years of the Bears ignoring the position for years.

JoJoBoxer · Jan 22, 2017

Luke said:
I don't know what boards you follow but Jeremiah had this sized up accurately on his first board. Wentz 7, Goff 8, Lynch 21.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000624732/article/ranking-top-50-prospects-for-2016-nfl-draft

You are right. I apologize. It was the talking heads.

Payton!34 · Jan 22, 2017

I understand that the odds of getting an elite qb drop the longer you wait in a draft but there just aren't any obviously good ones in this year's draft and it's bad luck for us.

People, Stop saying we need to draft a qb with our first pick. That's ignorant strategy at best, we should pick the best player available.

There's so much luck involved in drafts. We need a qb and this is a shitty draft for qb's. We need safeties but would we really draft one that high?

I just hope we get a great player

bearmick · Jan 22, 2017

JoJoBoxer said:
Oops. I wasn't clear.

Would you rather draft a QB (all being equal at around 15) or trade down to 6 to 8 (or where you believe at least one QB will still be available) while getting extra picks?

As you mentioned above, with the 2nd round pick we might get lucky and get Cam Robinson who would be excellent for Howard's running while we can possibly end up with Watson at 6(?), and have 2 3rd (trade down) and 4th rounders for DB help. Moveover; we would still be getting the chance at the franchise QB while it being less of a reach.

I think making sure you get the QB you want is too important to play the trading game and hope you can get him later.

bearmick · Jan 22, 2017

dabears70 said:
I would think this should be an easy choice for Mick cause why wouldn't you trade down a couple of spots and still get one of the QB's while adding two or three more picks??

Because someone else might get your guy.

Also, in order to make any trade you need a partner. You can't plan on specific trades to specific spots like that.

ijustposthere · Jan 22, 2017

bearmick said:
Depends what you mean by ranked higher. QB transcends BPA. I saw the other some guy had Watson as a 6.3 and Allen as a 6.6. Based on strict BPA, Allen is the higher ranked player, but QB is too important to settle for strict BPA, because the value of the position is so much more impactful. That's what I was getting at with the bed and lampshade analogy if you saw that.

to put it simply, I think it's worth compromising on a defender to take a shot at a potential impact QB.

I said in my post that if Pace has a grade on these QBs that has them dropping far enough for him to acquire them later, that he should take the defender.

bearmick · Jan 22, 2017

ijustposthere said:
I said in my post that if Pace has a grade on these QBs that has them dropping far enough for him to acquire them later, that he should take the defender.

Ok. If they have a QB identified they like, I hope they take him at 3 to make 100% sure they get him, and get the defender later. It's a deep defensive class; there will be plenty good talent there in the 2nd and 3rd round.

Monsieur Tirets · Jan 22, 2017

when it comes to taking a QB at 3, i look at it like this... if there is a guy available that you like at all and think theres at least a chance of him being the future at the position you take him, even over a guy that you could somehow be guaranteed would be a 10-15 year all star at another position, for the simple fact that even with such a player, without a qb you arent doing jack shit.

Chicago Staleys · Jan 22, 2017

If Paces guy is not there at #3 then he'll take BPA. It's really that simple. There will be a QB available at #35, that's a guarantee.

TL1961 · Jan 22, 2017

bearmick said:
I'd do it if it was for sure we'd get the QB but I think it's too important to gamble on. Whatever we'd be looking to get with the extra pick, could we get a fairly comparable player with our own 2nd anyway?

If they feel the QB they want is a real franchise opportunity, I'd rather they just take him and look to continue their solid 2nd round drafting (Goldman, Whitehair) in the next round.

It's a deep DB class; there should be some really good corners and safeties on the board at 35. I even saw a mock where Cam Robinson fell to the 2nd. I think he'd make a terrific RT in the NFL.

Well, we aren't giving up the 2nd for the second first rounder. It's an additional pick.

And my answer to the question - if all three QB's are rated the same, and all around #15, I'd trade lower than 8 and get more.

Enasic · Jan 22, 2017

Chicago Staleys said:
If Paces guy is not there at #3 then he'll take BPA. It's really that simple. There will be a QB available at #35, that's a guarantee.

This is exactly where I'm at. If Pace loves one of the QBs and he's there, go for it. If not, 1 of the top 4 (Trub, Kizer, Watson, Mahomes) will be there at #35.

Things that have become clearer about the Bears off season

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