The nuclear option

czman

Well-known member
Joined:
May 7, 2013
Posts:
2,195
Liked Posts:
551
I know some people will argue that the Bulls should not go into a total rebuild. I would prefer not to convolute this thread with that discussion. Let’s just pretend that the Bulls are going into one. This is how I would proceed. (at least I tried)

Note here is why (in case anyone cares):
I think they are better off blowing it up now. They are not good enough to make an impact in the playoffs, if they even make it, and they are not a young team. I know people like Butler a lot and want to build around him. The problem is he’s not good enough to be the best player on a title team. Additionally, he is probably at his absolute peak value right now. His long term health and has to be a question. He plays a very physical game and is undersized for the SF. He is not a great shooter and gets much of his value from FTs, and those come at a price to his body. As he ages and his legs start to go, can he really continue to be affective? I think he could have a steep drop off around 30.

Here is a basic total rebuild option. The Pelicans are 1 game back of the 8th spot and have multiple bad contracts that will saddle them for now and the next couple of years. They have to find a way to show improvement and get out from under some of the bad deals. Davis is not going to stay happy forever.

Pelicans get
Wade

Bulls get:
Solomon hill (3/37mil left after this year)
Omar Asik. (2/22mil left and team option in 3rd year)
First round pick.

The Pelicans get Wade and his leadership this season. He can be an expiring contract if they want next season. At a minimum they get 20+ million off the books 1 season sooner save another 13 million the following year.


This next deal would be with Thibs, and that may be a hard one. The Timberwolves 1.5 games out and also have a few bad contracts. Thibs has a style of play and the Bulls can help him. We know he always wants to win.

Bulls get:
Cole Aldrich (7.3 mil next season following year is not guaranteed)
Pekovic (done but still on the books this year and next for 11 mil.)
First round pick.

Timberwolves get
Lopez (Long term option at a market fair price.)
Gibson (expiring contract.)

The Timberwolves will still be under the capo, but they save money get rid of two bad contracts next season and talent for the short term and long term. We also know that Thibs likes Gibson a lot.


The Celtics are 3rd in the East and 1.5 games behind the Raptors. I am sure they would really like to get to the ECF.
Bulls get
Zeller (not guaranteed next season)
Crowder (3/22 so a team friendly contract)
Jerebko (expiring)

Celtics get
Butler
Mirotic (expiring)
First round picks (nets) (Celtics keep the rights to swap picks in 2017)
The Celtics get a long term “star” with a team friendly contract and Mirotic who is better than Jerebko and an expiring deal.


The Clippers are 3rd and are getting nothing out of the SF spot.

Bulls flip Crowder to the Celtics for Wesley Johnson, Paul pierce and a first round pick.
Pierce is done and gets 3.5 million next season. Johnson is no good and gets 6 million next season and a team buy out the following year. The Clippers solve a problem at SF and save money next year. They also get a team friendly contract, something they don’t have much of, and a player who is willing to do some of the dirty work. And dirty work players are something they don’t have.

Not all of the picks should be for this year. The Timberwolves probably should since they are on the rise. The Clippers pick should be for 202x or so when they very well might be a terrible team. Plus it is easier to give up a 202x pick then next seasons. The Pelicans don’t have a pick this year so the Bulls can try to get a 202x pick from them.

Moves like this could give the Bulls extra first round picks first years. Additionally, with a total rebuild and the Nets 1st round pick this season and 2018, plus the fact that the Bulls will be terrible, it could be a very short rebuild process. They Bulls could legitimately have two top 3 picks in 2018. The extra picks 202x will only help the team sustain success if they can hit on someone.
 

Gustavus Adolphus

?‍♂️?
Donator
CCS Hall of Fame '20
Joined:
Jun 15, 2010
Posts:
44,291
Liked Posts:
38,748
My favorite teams
  1. Chicago White Sox
  1. Chicago Bulls
  1. Chicago Bears
  1. Nebraska Cornhuskers
  2. Villanova Wildcats
How any fan can look at the Bulls right now and not think they should blow it up is beyond me.
 

clonetrooper264

Retired Bandwagon Mod
Staff member
Donator
Joined:
Apr 11, 2009
Posts:
23,316
Liked Posts:
7,394
My favorite teams
  1. Chicago Cubs
  1. Chicago Bulls
  2. Golden State Warriors
  1. Chicago Bears
  1. Chicago Blackhawks
Sounds fine to me. Can you inception this into the mind of GarPax or something?
 

RacerX

Silicon Valley CA Bears H
Joined:
Aug 21, 2012
Posts:
9,853
Liked Posts:
9,908
Location:
Silicon Valley, CA
How any fan can look at the Bulls right now and not think they should blow it up is beyond me.

Precisely. OP - your premise is flawed.

Only fools and the Bulls FO (redundant?) can't see the doomed inevitability of it all.

As soon as they resisted moving Gasol last trade deadline it was obvious they intend to keep moving sideways until terminated.
 

Axl Rose

and I knew the silence of the world
Joined:
Oct 11, 2011
Posts:
12,138
Liked Posts:
4,431
Location:
a distant shoreline
if you look back i really tried to be optimistic about this team but they are as shit as everybody expected
 

Raskolnikov

CCS Donator
Donator
Joined:
Aug 23, 2012
Posts:
22,240
Liked Posts:
7,739
Location:
Enemy Territory via southern C
I'd wait and see who Wade/Butler can recruit. This league is all about the "cool" factor, and Butler is one of the cool guys. Let him go make friends starting at the all-star game, that is where these things are formed.

There is simply no better way to build this thing. We have a ton of trade pieces other than Butler...you would think we would try to deal others first.

This management is a joke.

Its unfortunate what happened the other night, if the Bulls value Cousins less after the blow up (you think despite the 40?) but Sacramento seems to like him more and more.
 

Gustavus Adolphus

?‍♂️?
Donator
CCS Hall of Fame '20
Joined:
Jun 15, 2010
Posts:
44,291
Liked Posts:
38,748
My favorite teams
  1. Chicago White Sox
  1. Chicago Bulls
  1. Chicago Bears
  1. Nebraska Cornhuskers
  2. Villanova Wildcats
Wade said today he will opt out if he sees no plan to rise from mediocrity, and I can't blame him. Wade isn't going to recruit.

Cousins has said he is staying. As a matter of fact, and one of our better cap guys can explain this, most players are not going to be leaving during their option year because they get more to stay under the new CBA.

The Bulls are in hell, and with the way the last few drafts have been going, they aren't likely to leave hell anytime soon.
 

PolarBear

Well-known member
Joined:
Jul 8, 2013
Posts:
4,711
Liked Posts:
2,811
Wade said today he will opt out if he sees no plan to rise from mediocrity, and I can't blame him. Wade isn't going to recruit.

Cousins has said he is staying. As a matter of fact, and one of our better cap guys can explain this, most players are not going to be leaving during their option year because they get more to stay under the new CBA.

The Bulls are in hell, and with the way the last few drafts have been going, they aren't likely to leave hell anytime soon.

I find that hard to believe from Cousins. But your last point is very valid. Cousins I think may be the one of the last real big free agents for a couple years.
 

Gustavus Adolphus

?‍♂️?
Donator
CCS Hall of Fame '20
Joined:
Jun 15, 2010
Posts:
44,291
Liked Posts:
38,748
My favorite teams
  1. Chicago White Sox
  1. Chicago Bulls
  1. Chicago Bears
  1. Nebraska Cornhuskers
  2. Villanova Wildcats
I find that hard to believe from Cousins. But your last point is very valid. Cousins I think may be the one of the last real big free agents for a couple years.

I mean, he's said he's staying, but I can totally understand not necessarily believing a grown man with the nickname 'Boogie.'
 

Axl Rose

and I knew the silence of the world
Joined:
Oct 11, 2011
Posts:
12,138
Liked Posts:
4,431
Location:
a distant shoreline
Kings will offer 200m and hes not turning that down
 

Crystallas

Three if by air
Staff member
Donator
Joined:
Jun 25, 2010
Posts:
19,890
Liked Posts:
9,618
Location:
Next to the beef gristle mill
My favorite teams
  1. Chicago Bulls
This is more along the lines of reality.

kirkistrash.gif
 

Axl Rose

and I knew the silence of the world
Joined:
Oct 11, 2011
Posts:
12,138
Liked Posts:
4,431
Location:
a distant shoreline
LOL i forgot i made that
 

Crystallas

Three if by air
Staff member
Donator
Joined:
Jun 25, 2010
Posts:
19,890
Liked Posts:
9,618
Location:
Next to the beef gristle mill
My favorite teams
  1. Chicago Bulls
yeah, that thing was pretty good.
 

AussieBear

Guest
Jimmy Butler to Orlando for C Nikola Vucevic, SG Mario Hezonja and 1st Rd Pick.

then ship lopez for bogut (expiring) straight up..

etc etc
 

AussieBear

Guest
Jimmy Butler to Orlando for C Nikola Vucevic, SG Mario Hezonja and 1st Rd Pick.

then ship lopez for bogut (expiring) straight up..

etc etc

continuing

wade, mirotic, canaan to boston for PF Amir Johnson, C Tyler Zeller and PG Marcus Smart.

rondo to denver (has cap) for PG mo williams (expiring)

Gibson, McDermott, 2nd rd to OKC for PF Nick Collison (expiring) PF D. Sabonis and 1st Rd

oh i forgot to throw in portis in that orlando trade

So with my delusional 2k trades ya end up with

2 extra 1sts

PG Smart
PG C-Williams (expiring)
PG Mo Williams (expiring)
PG Grant

SG Valentine
SG Hezonja (would give him plenty SF minutes..hes got the size)

SF Zipser

PF Johnson (expiring)
PF Sabonis
PF Collison (expiring)
PF Felicio (expiring)

C Vucevic
C Bogut (expiring)
C Zeller (would try to pass on for expiring contract)
 

AussieBear

Guest
continuing

wade, mirotic, canaan to boston for PF Amir Johnson, C Tyler Zeller and PG Marcus Smart.

rondo to denver (has cap) for PG mo williams (expiring)

Gibson, McDermott, 2nd rd to OKC for PF Nick Collison (expiring) PF D. Sabonis and 1st Rd

oh i forgot to throw in portis in that orlando trade

So with my delusional 2k trades ya end up with

2 extra 1sts

PG Smart
PG C-Williams (expiring)
PG Mo Williams (expiring)
PG Grant

SG Valentine
SG Hezonja (would give him plenty of SF minutes..hes got the size)

SF Zipser

PF Johnson (expiring)
PF Sabonis
PF Collison (expiring)
PF Felicio (expiring)

C Vucevic
C Bogut (expiring)
C Zeller (would try to pass on for expiring contract)

then i would probably target gordon hayward as my numero uno priority in fa..
 

czman

Well-known member
Joined:
May 7, 2013
Posts:
2,195
Liked Posts:
551
continuing

wade, mirotic, canaan to boston for PF Amir Johnson, C Tyler Zeller and PG Marcus Smart.

rondo to denver (has cap) for PG mo williams (expiring)

Gibson, McDermott, 2nd rd to OKC for PF Nick Collison (expiring) PF D. Sabonis and 1st Rd

oh i forgot to throw in portis in that orlando trade

So with my delusional 2k trades ya end up with

2 extra 1sts

PG Smart
PG C-Williams (expiring)
PG Mo Williams (expiring)
PG Grant

SG Valentine
SG Hezonja (would give him SF minutes..hes got the size)

SF Zipser

PF Johnson (expiring)
PF Sabonis
PF Collison (expiring)
PF Felicio (expiring)

C Vucevic
C Bogut (expiring)
C Zeller (would try to pass on for expiring contract)

Please don't take this the wrong way, I am not sure that makes much sense. The Bulls are probably worse long and short term with these moves. It is highly doubtful they get a top 3 pick. They probably get a pick in the early 20s and around 10. The Bulls pick will be in the low teens. They could end up with the 10/12 and 23 picks in the draft. That is not a rebuild. The Bulls also don't get much value from the players. Vucevic and Smart are not guys you want to build around.

Yes, they free up some money, but there are better ways to free up money and build through FA (building through FA is the worst possible idea).

This really isn't a total rebuild. It more a half rebuild, those rarely work.

I am not sure the Magic would be interested in that trade. I think Boston would be looking for more long term assets and they are giving up a younger player for no long term assets. So not sure they would do that.

Cap space is good, but not if you can't sign top tier talent; therefore, cap space this year with Vucevic and Smart probably get you nothing.
 

AussieBear

Guest
Please don't take this the wrong way, I am not sure that makes much sense. The Bulls are probably worse long and short term with these moves. It is highly doubtful they get a top 3 pick. They probably get a pick in the early 20s and around 10. The Bulls pick will be in the low teens. They could end up with the 10/12 and 23 picks in the draft. That is not a rebuild. The Bulls also don't get much value from the players. Vucevic and Smart are not guys you want to build around.

Yes, they free up some money, but there are better ways to free up money and build through FA (building through FA is the worst possible idea).

This really isn't a total rebuild. It more a half rebuild, those rarely work.

I am not sure the Magic would be interested in that trade. I think Boston would be looking for more long term assets and they are giving up a younger player for no long term assets. So not sure they would do that.

Cap space is good, but not if you can't sign top tier talent; therefore, cap space this year with Vucevic and Smart probably get you nothing.

it makes sense to me.. kill em..

bulls probably aint competing for the next decade as is.... its all cavs, warriors, spurs, raptors for the next 5-6.. then the greek and porzingis taking ova...

smart is sitting behind thomas forever..
mario on the bench and not needed with butler.. Biyombo got that contract.. vu is expendable in a sense.. butler may give ibaka a reason to return to orlando

im gambling on young talent improving (smart, valentine, hezonja, sabonis.. and vucevic is still 26-27?? avg 18-19 in prior years).. perhaps adding hayward in the offseason.. unload then let the bulls tank the rest of the year.. so 3 1sts with two of them being possible lottery picks..
 

Top