IST: Cubs @ Reds

TL1961 · Jun 30, 2017

The Cardinals, who are positively awful, are 1.5 back of Cubs.

Ari Bear · Jun 30, 2017

Cubs lose. Same reason as usual. Cubs can't hit. Wash rinse and repeat.

beckdawg · Jun 30, 2017

chibears55 said:
Same old cubs this year..
Win a big game, split series against Nats and then crap the bed against the reds..

Mediocre .500 Team

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk

They're also missing a crap load of starters. You're talking about Zobrist, Heyward, Bryant, all being hurt. Russell probably isn't 100% either with his shoulder but they need him.

beckdawg · Jun 30, 2017

Schwarber is 2-4 tonight with 2 HRs a walk and a K. Assuming he doesn't hit again tonight he's 7-19(.368) with 2 walks and 9 K's in AAA. I'm not certain he's back but like I said I thought he'd destroy AAA pitching. K's would indicate there is some worry moving back to the majors but he's hitting .368 and the cubs aren't hitting.

CSF77 · Jun 30, 2017

beckdawg said:
Schwarber is 2-4 tonight with 2 HRs a walk and a K. Assuming he doesn't hit again tonight he's 7-19(.368) with 2 walks and 9 K's in AAA. I'm not certain he's back but like I said I thought he'd destroy AAA pitching. K's would indicate there is some worry moving back to the majors but he's hitting .368 and the cubs aren't hitting.

Joe said that to expect the SO's to go away is unrealistic.

That said it has to be about him being ready vs the team needing a life preserver. They will bring him up when he is ready.

CSF77 · Jun 30, 2017

beckdawg said:
They're also missing a crap load of starters. You're talking about Zobrist, Heyward, Bryant, all being hurt. Russell probably isn't 100% either with his shoulder but they need him.

Zo is on rehab in AA. Joe said he is close. He should be back soon. I'm really not sure how the team shakes out when Kyle and Zo return. Add to it Heyward has been on rehab also and should be back soon. The line up should be intact post ASG. Hendricks would be in rehab at that point. It makes you wonder where they put Happ.

TL1961 · Jul 1, 2017

beckdawg said:
Schwarber is 2-4 tonight with 2 HRs a walk and a K. Assuming he doesn't hit again tonight he's 7-19(.368) with 2 walks and 9 K's in AAA. I'm not certain he's back but like I said I thought he'd destroy AAA pitching. K's would indicate there is some worry moving back to the majors but he's hitting .368 and the cubs aren't hitting.

7 for 19 is good.

9 K's in 19 AB's at AAA? Hes' not ready to come back.

With all the injured players coming back, I don't think we'll see him real soon. Maybe toward late July. Maybe later.

I just hope they aren't going to try him at catcher while he's down there.

beckdawg · Jul 1, 2017

CSF77 said:
Joe said that to expect the SO's to go away is unrealistic.

That said it has to be about him being ready vs the team needing a life preserver. They will bring him up when he is ready.

Well as I mentioned birch who covers the iowa cubs and is basically the guy to know stuff essentially said Schwarber will be back in the next few days. I'm not going to speculate on their motives. My feeling was always there was never anything truly "wrong" with Schwarber. I always felt like he had run into his first major adjustment to the league and hadn't figured it out yet and even then there were still positives in what Schwarber did. Almost every player has that. His hitting in AAA sort of proves my thinking that he was too advanced for it. I mean as mentioned the strikeout rate is higher than you want to see but it is a small sample so it's hard to judge exactly how much of that is a systemic problem and how much is him toying with his approach.

I still feel like the question I asked when people were talking about sending him down in the first place remains. How do you know when he's "ready?" For example, if he's hitting over .300 but still K'ing at 30% is he now ready? In the majors this year his k rate was a problem but it wasn't *THE* problem. His problem was he wasn't getting anything but extra base hits. He had 16 singles and 10 doubles with 12 HRs. Those ratios are pretty absurd.

To me all of this feels like a glorified rehab stint. That is to say someone who's too advanced for the level but needs to get back their timing or whatever after an injury. Schwarber obviously isn't hurt but that's what it feels like to me. But my issue is more we're not going to know whether or not Schwarber is "back" until he's in the majors. These AAA results don't really mean much in my eyes. If all this gets him going that's great but feels more like a side show than a concerted effort to fixing something.

CSF77 · Jul 1, 2017

beckdawg said:
Well as I mentioned birch who covers the iowa cubs and is basically the guy to know stuff essentially said Schwarber will be back in the next few days. I'm not going to speculate on their motives. My feeling was always there was never anything truly "wrong" with Schwarber. I always felt like he had run into his first major adjustment to the league and hadn't figured it out yet and even then there were still positives in what Schwarber did. Almost every player has that. His hitting in AAA sort of proves my thinking that he was too advanced for it. I mean as mentioned the strikeout rate is higher than you want to see but it is a small sample so it's hard to judge exactly how much of that is a systemic problem and how much is him toying with his approach.

I still feel like the question I asked when people were talking about sending him down in the first place remains. How do you know when he's "ready?" For example, if he's hitting over .300 but still K'ing at 30% is he now ready? In the majors this year his k rate was a problem but it wasn't *THE* problem. His problem was he wasn't getting anything but extra base hits. He had 16 singles and 10 doubles with 12 HRs. Those ratios are pretty absurd.

To me all of this feels like a glorified rehab stint. That is to say someone who's too advanced for the level but needs to get back their timing or whatever after an injury. Schwarber obviously isn't hurt but that's what it feels like to me. But my issue is more we're not going to know whether or not Schwarber is "back" until he's in the majors. These AAA results don't really mean much in my eyes. If all this gets him going that's great but feels more like a side show than a concerted effort to fixing something.

I believe the difference is in the D used. Are they using the shift?

chibears55 · Jul 1, 2017

beckdawg said:
They're also missing a crap load of starters. You're talking about Zobrist, Heyward, Bryant, all being hurt. Russell probably isn't 100% either with his shoulder but they need him.

So Rizzo Baez Contreras Jay Almora Russell Happ are all incapable of stringing hits together and scoring runs off a guy with high Whip and ERA over 4 ? Scott flippn Feldman

They just split with the Nats without those guys and Bryant the game before...
They should of been able to handle the Reds and Feldman..

No Excuse

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk

chibears55 · Jul 1, 2017

beckdawg said:
Schwarber is 2-4 tonight with 2 HRs a walk and a K. Assuming he doesn't hit again tonight he's 7-19(.368) with 2 walks and 9 K's in AAA. I'm not certain he's back but like I said I thought he'd destroy AAA pitching. K's would indicate there is some worry moving back to the majors but he's hitting .368 and the cubs aren't hitting.

I read he was still swinging from his heels trying to hit everything 500 feet...
That works in AAA not in MLB

He needs to cut down on his Ks and work on just hitting the ball, making good contact..

Is anyone actually talking/working with the kid or is he just down there just to do his normal things..
Too bad Manny gone, he probably could of helped him

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk

chibears55 · Jul 1, 2017

CSF77 said:
I believe the difference is in the D used. Are they using the shift?

No, they don't use the shift..

He has 5 singles and 2 homers all to right field..

I know of 2 singles that were actually hit off the RF wall ..

if he just swinging hard from his heels trying to jack everything , he really not helping himself for when he returns back to MLB..

Here my question, he returns and continues to struggle and hits around 200 his next 50 to 100 AB, what happens next?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk

beckdawg · Jul 1, 2017

CSF77 said:
I believe the difference is in the D used. Are they using the shift?

I would assume yes but I don't have data to support it.

beckdawg · Jul 1, 2017

chibears55 said:
Here my question, he returns and continues to struggle and hits around 200 his next 50 to 100 AB, what happens next?

Can I amend this question a bit? Schwarber has a .193 BABIP. I don't care how good the shift is that's not going to hold. The absolute worst BABIP in the majors last year was Todd Frazier among qualified hitters at .236. So, realistically let's set that question at him hitting say .220. That'd essentially make his batting line .220/.344/.427 if nothing else changed but a few more singles fell.

If that's the question I think you just live with it. I know people aren't going to like it but the fact of the matter is sometimes people have to eat a bad season to get to their potential. Rizzo took 690 PAs at age 23 hitting .233/.323/.419. Now maybe if you're still in the midst of a playoff run you don't play him every day and pick match ups that favor him but they rode out Heyward last year. Schwarber hitting that wouldn't be particularly pretty but the Dodgers are probably the best team in the NL and have given Utley 211 PAs hitting .228/.329/.400. With Schwarber's power and on base you can live with that. It's definitely not ideal but you can live with it so long as the rest of your line up is producing to their ability.

That's honestly the insanity of this years team. I don't think any 4 hitters have all been playing well at the same time this year between slumps and injuries. That was my earlier point about people being hurt. You're going to have to ride out slumps of guys but when you're talking about 3-4 every day guys either being hurt or not playing well at a given time it's hard to be consistent and win.

chibears55 · Jul 1, 2017

Zobrist is activated, Zagunis back down..

Bryant back in lineup

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk

chibears55 · Jul 1, 2017

Let's get 10 runs today
???

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk

Raskolnikov · Jul 1, 2017

CSF77 said:
The Cubs are under achieving. There is not much we can say to make this not true.

Reasons: Well Lackey should have retired.

Jake has gotten steadily worse after his 2nd no hitter.

Kyle got injured. Even though it may end up a blessing as his fastball dipped 2 mph. The time off may put his arm back where it was last year.

As far as the O is concerned. Even with out the injuries and Schwarber being demoted in general they has sputtered as a group. Sure Maddon may have made it worse with his jumbled approach.

Now how to fix the boat:

Honestly I believe they need Jay as the every day lead off to start. Rizzo did a great job and honestly may end up the long term guy but right now he is needed hitting 3. On Jay LF is the least potential problematic spot. He doesn't suck at all but he is not giving positive UZR either.

So for now until Bryant returns you want Jay, Happ, Rizzo at the top. After that you play the hitters that are producing currently. But 1-3 should be stable.

After that it is more about getting 100% and adding via trades. Even at 100% the rotation has 2 guys that have plain fallen off the table. There is no ace that you can lean on. The middle relief is shakey

Over all I personally feel that there is too much wrong going on to feel right.

I don't feel this is a quick fix issue either. That would be wishful thinking. Honestly they are not good and the brew is not good either. That is not something to hold faith in.

I believe a team deserves to be a champion. This year the Cubs don't. They are a flawed product.

The moment was after his ESPN Body Issue photo shoot. Even before it came out, he was rattled. Also I believe Jake is trying TOOO hard, both on the mound and in training. Take video of him now, and look at him 2-3 years ago. His shoulders are training into a forward roll from the hard lifting. He needs to do yoga and bring his shoulders back into healthy slot and posture before he gets hurt. I believe he was a warm weather pitcher last few years because he pitches better loose, but this is more of the same symptom....overtrained chest/tricep/front delt.

The Cubs continue to make shitty pitchers looks like the greatest ever. They allowed Feldman to get a few outs from a no hitter chance on them...I mean he had 5 perfect innings and is a guy with questionable stuff. But they make it really easy for guys that can pitch in and out of the zone. I mean...if a pitcher can change speeds and get them to chase, they are useless as a ball club.

Globetrotter · Jul 1, 2017

Baez with the Alfonso Soriano like strike outs again.

Why are you running yourselves out of the fucking inning?

Raskolnikov · Jul 1, 2017

Heyward, Baez, Schwarber, Russell, sometimes Happ and the pitcher slot, its just alot of guys that take TERRIBLE at bats and get themselves out on K's...but not just K's...terrible K's where they never gave themselves a chance to get a pitch to hit or stressed the pitcher.

Its who those guys are. Russell will get hot at some point when he see's the ball and maybe isn't going through a divorce. Zobrist can get back. But the odds of another playoff run with this club are dwindling. They need to get better. A pitcher will help but personally I think they will have to trade away some K's from the line-up sooner or later.

Briggs is GOAT · Jul 1, 2017

Good shit from Jay and Contreras. Contreras walloped that thing.

IST: Cubs @ Reds

Well-known member

Hall of Famer

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

CCS Donator

Well-known member

CCS Donator

Well-known member