Who would you rather have?

Twinndaddy

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I thought this would be a fun post!

Consider the contract and years left in your answer.

I'll start with a few:

Willson Contreras or Gary Sanchez

Anthony Rizzo or Paul Goldschmidt

Kris Bryant or Any other 3rd baseman

Jon Lester or Justin Verlander
 

TC in Mississippi

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Honestly, the only player I would even consider the swap is Goldschmidt and that's essentially a push anyway. More than anything this shows me lucky we are to have these guys.
 

fatbeard

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Contreras (Defense)

Rizzo (Age, Contract)

Bryant

Lester (Playoff performance, more likely to remain effective as he ages)
 
DanTown

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Contreras
Rizzo (would take Goldschmidt but Rizzo has two more option years)
Bryant
Verlander (less years)
 

beckdawg

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Don't think any of those are particularly tempting. Bryant is realistically only matched by someone like Trout. Rizzo and Goldy I'd effectively say are the same in terms of performance and they are both at the top of the list. Like wise, I'd say from a bat stand point Contreras and Sanchez are basically the same. Maybe you argue Sanchez has better power but I think you take Contreras' defense.

As for Lester vs Verlander, I don't think I'd really take either given the choice. Both are on the down side of their careers. That's not to say they can't be effective for a few more years but my point is more you want younger pitching.
 
CSF77

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beckdawg said:
Don't think any of those are particularly tempting. Bryant is realistically only matched by someone like Trout. Rizzo and Goldy I'd effectively say are the same in terms of performance and they are both at the top of the list. Like wise, I'd say from a bat stand point Contreras and Sanchez are basically the same. Maybe you argue Sanchez has better power but I think you take Contreras' defense.

As for Lester vs Verlander, I don't think I'd really take either given the choice. Both are on the down side of their careers. That's not to say they can't be effective for a few more years but my point is more you want younger pitching.
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Kinda agree here. Lester was signed to a loyalty payday. I doubt they would have signed any vet to that deal if there was no connection. With Jon there was that history and it was time to pay him for it. Verlander is basically the same thing right now. Both are looking MoR at this stage of their careers.
 

brett05

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The only possibility for me is maybe Areando over Bryant and Goldy over Rizzo. But why? Not worth it at all.
 
CSF77

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brett05 said:
The only possibility for me is maybe Areando over Bryant and Goldy over Rizzo. But why? Not worth it at all.
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I can't up vote players that live in notoriously hitter juiced parks. Both Areando and Goldy play in parks that juice production.

From a D perspective I see their elite contributions. But from a O I don't.

That is why what Stanton is doing is remarkable. That park in Miami is doing him no favor and it don't matter.
 

fatbeard

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brett05 said:
The only possibility for me is maybe Areando over Bryant and Goldy over Rizzo. But why? Not worth it at all.
Click to expand...

Seems odd to me to even consider Arenado over Bryant. One is an All-Star level player whose numbers are inflated by the park he plays in (can clearly be seen in metrics that control for park effects like wRC+), and the other is a legitimate MVP candidate year-in-year-out.
 

brett05

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fatbeard said:
Seems odd to me to even consider Arenado over Bryant. One is an All-Star level player whose numbers are inflated by the park he plays in (can clearly be seen in metrics that control for park effects like wRC+), and the other is a legitimate MVP candidate year-in-year-out.
Click to expand...

I got curious, so I had to look.
Areando, back to back years MVP votes, probably a third this year. 3xAS, 4xGG (probably 5 this year), 19.2bWAR(last three) (up every year since arriving)
Bryant MVP (he'll be top five this year), 2xAS 19.7bWAR

Areando plays well on the road as he matured, but obviously plays better at Coors. Same power this year and clearly his glove plays anywhere. Bryant gets more WAR because Joe plays him out of position.

This is why I think it might be Areando. Slightly less bat, superior glove.
EDIT: Nolan gets hurt at MVP time because of his team. This year I would not be shocked if he finished ahead of Bryant in the voting thanks for Colorado being a playoff team.
 

Twinndaddy

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brett05 said:
This is why I think it might be Areando. Slightly less bat, superior glove.
EDIT: Nolan gets hurt at MVP time because of his team. This year I would not be shocked if he finished ahead of Bryant in the voting thanks for Colorado being a playoff team.
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The fact that Bryant has two more years of control should give the 100% definite edge to wanting him over Arenado. Can't go wrong with either but I'll take 2 more years!
 

fatbeard

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brett05 said:
I got curious, so I had to look.
Areando, back to back years MVP votes, probably a third this year. 3xAS, 4xGG (probably 5 this year), 19.2bWAR(last three) (up every year since arriving)
Bryant MVP (he'll be top five this year), 2xAS 19.7bWAR

Areando plays well on the road as he matured, but obviously plays better at Coors. Same power this year and clearly his glove plays anywhere. Bryant gets more WAR because Joe plays him out of position.

This is why I think it might be Areando. Slightly less bat, superior glove.
EDIT: Nolan gets hurt at MVP time because of his team. This year I would not be shocked if he finished ahead of Bryant in the voting thanks for Colorado being a playoff team.
Click to expand...

Bryant's offense vs. Arenado's defense is a wash. Bryant creates about 20 more runs per year (wRC+) than Arenado, who prevents about 20 more runs per year (DRS) than Bryant, so we've got to look at other factors to differentiate them. Bryant is a much better baserunner, one of the best in baseball, in fact. Also more versatile in that he can play the OF at a very high level (better than he can play 3B). Arenado's never played a major league inning at another position, and his baserunning scores suggest he doesn't have the footspeed to play the OF. I don't buy the argument that Bryant playing "out of position" artificially inflates his WAR; playing out of position is as much a penalty to his defensive value as it is a benefit to his offensive value. Also, the two more years of control is huge since both guys will be looking at +200mil contracts as FAs (Bryant almost certainly +300mil), so Bryant ends up being 50-60mil cheaper through his remaining team control period than Arenado. Awards don't really matter for me personally, as they're entirely subjective.
 

brett05

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fatbeard said:
Bryant's offense vs. Arenado's defense is a wash. Bryant creates about 20 more runs per year (wRC+) than Arenado, who prevents about 20 more runs per year (DRS) than Bryant, so we've got to look at other factors to differentiate them. Bryant is a much better baserunner, one of the best in baseball, in fact. Also more versatile in that he can play the OF at a very high level (better than he can play 3B). Arenado's never played a major league inning at another position, and his baserunning scores suggest he doesn't have the footspeed to play the OF. I don't buy the argument that Bryant playing "out of position" artificially inflates his WAR; playing out of position is as much a penalty to his defensive value as it is a benefit to his offensive value. Also, the two more years of control is huge since both guys will be looking at +200mil contracts as FAs (Bryant almost certainly +300mil), so Bryant ends up being 50-60mil cheaper through his remaining team control period than Arenado. Awards don't really matter for me personally, as they're entirely subjective.
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You mentioned them which is why I commented on the awards.

And like I said, might.
 
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I'd only take Verlander, and it isn't as clear cut as it was a few years ago.
 
Bear Pride

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Twinndaddy said:
I thought this would be a fun post!

Consider the contract and years left in your answer.

I'll start with a few:

Willson Contreras or Gary Sanchez

Anthony Rizzo or Paul Goldschmidt

Kris Bryant or Any other 3rd baseman

Jon Lester or Justin Verlander
Click to expand...

For me, the one consideration that the OP left out seals the deal for no changes for me, and that is chemistry.
 
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