OT: Lebron

Crystallas · May 26, 2018

Gustavus Adolphus said:
Well it's not really a straw that I'm grasping at, and nowhere have I said your arguments haven't been consistent. That said, earlier in this thread you asked someone to look up the fouls that Lebron gets. So I took your advice and found two sources. They both kind of go against what you're going on about.

The first link has nothing to do with what I'm talking about(the sample is small and from well before this seasons playoffs). The second link only examines the final 2 minutes of contests and for this years playoffs, but if it "kind of goes against what [I'm] talking about" , does that mean you didn't even bother to read the source you provided?

Heck, even if it's *just the final 2 minutes* of the contests.... let's review the final portion of the season and it only goes up to the Pacers v Cavs series anyways.
Notice. In the LEFT column, where LeBron was called for something, it was favorable to him 100% of the time when the call was wrong.
Notice. In the RIGHT column, when LeBron was the defender, it was unfavorable for his opponent 100% of the time.

Gustavus Adolphus · May 26, 2018

The second link says that Lebron isn't the most favored player in the league.

ijustposthere · May 27, 2018

Enasic said:
Yes. That is a huge problem. Not only is he the best player on the floor but he's arguably the best player to ever step foot on the floor. I myself tend to put him over MJ more and more each passing year, but it's very close. I have no qualms with putting them as equals. But the guy just impacts the game in so many different ways and as much as anyone I've ever watched play. Fans take it for granted because we have just become accustomed to it and a lot of people like to hate on him. Which is fine, fans hated on MJ too (especially Knicks/Pacers/Pistons/Jazz fans lol), but you have to give credit where credit is due.

I think the series ultimately goes 7 but I'm not betting against LeBron. Another thing that doesn't get talked about is the insane transformation of the Cavs from last year and this year. The Cavs team from last season barely resembled the team that started the year....and then they traded what, 5-6 guys MID-SEASON??? Just uncanny turnover and he's right back in the ECF like nothing. It's amazing, really.

LeBron's a great player, but I don't even think he's better than Kobe.

anotheridiot · May 27, 2018

Gustavus Adolphus said:
MJ was 6'6"

nope, check the official statistics from the olympic rosters, the ones that use real rulers and real numbers. The bigger surprise was Charles Barkley was actually 6'4 1/2.

Axl Rose · May 27, 2018

LeBron is top 5 but he blew his chance to surpass Jordan.

Hes had too many mental hiccups in his career.

RoseMVP1 · May 27, 2018

Hopefully the Terry Rozier hype dies for good. Holy shit....I’d argue he cost Boston the game.

Enasic · May 27, 2018

Axl Rose said:
LeBron is top 5 but he blew his chance to surpass Jordan.

Hes had too many mental hiccups in his career.

Lol that’s just dumb...Jordan lost plenty in the playoffs...and the “hiccups” you’re referring to is when LeBron was younger than Jordan at the age of his first title and with much worse teams. You’re also acting like LeBrons career over. With the way he’s playing he could win 2-3 more titles. His impact is undeniable. It’s as big as anyone to play.

Shawon0Meter · May 27, 2018

I'm way too casual of an NBA fan to want to try to sound smart in any in sort of "greatest ever" debate..... but if any individual player has done more to help their team win games and playoff games than LeBron.....HOLY SHIT

didshereallysaythat · May 28, 2018

Isaiah Smith said that LeBron is a MUCH BETTER player than Jordan.

LOL, their wouldn't be any sort of resentment there would there?

Axl Rose · May 28, 2018

didshereallysaythat said:
Isaiah Smith said that LeBron is a MUCH BETTER player than Jordan.

LOL, their wouldn't be any sort of resentment there would there?

Who?

anotheridiot · May 28, 2018

CODE_BLUE56 said:
Boston has a good thing going with a young nucleus of Brown,Tatum, and Rozier, plus Horford as the stable vet(then add in guys like Marcus Morris and smart). With that said, Kyrie is on a different compared to all of these guys offensively. Boston doesn't really have a guy who can make x straight buckets and pull a team back. There's other ways of making a comeback besides facilitation. Kyrie as such a dangerous option, both in driving and shooting, also puts less pressure on the other guys. Kyrie on ISO would at times lead to less ball movement, but I have no doubt that Kyrie makes the Celtics a better team and more competitive in the playoffs.

With that said, still a good chance Boston wins the series. I mean, they are up 3-2.

Rosier reminded me of grant, moves too fast, dribbles too much, plays 1 on 5.

I think when he came back in the game in the fourth, cold, he took three threes in a row without a single pass. When the team showed no jump in their step after Tatum dunked on LeBron, it was over.

The east will belong to boston for the next few years, Kyrie, Tatum, Brown, Hayward and anybody really. Lets see how LeBron does in his last run with the cavs.

Probie2429 · May 28, 2018

Boston flat out choked that game away. 74 points against the Cavs' defense? LOL. Brad Stevens showed his true colors.

I'm not gonna take anything away from Lebron's performance, but Boston was also down its two top players (Irving and Hayward). If even one of those guys plays in this series, Lebron is sitting at home after game 5. Lebron can add to his legacy of Finals losses unless both Curry and Thompson or Harden and Paul are both out for the series.

Probie2429 · May 28, 2018

Lebron has a tough decision ahead of him. Cleveland is a bad team with no younger players to help Lebron (who will also be entering the twilight of his career soon). Kevin Love is a bad joke at this point as well. Boston will own the East for a few years. Philly is likely to pass Boston in due time as well. I think Lebron has to win at least 1 more Championship in order to justify all the Finals losses he has. I wouldn't fault him for sticking in Cleveland and just riding out his career. He's played a lot of basketball in his career, but I think he bolts in the offseason especially if the Cavs lose against GS/Houston.

Gustavus Adolphus · May 28, 2018

They have a top 10 pick coming up.

CODE_BLUE56 · May 28, 2018

ijustposthere said:
LeBron's a great player, but I don't even think he's better than Kobe.

He's definitely better than Kobe.

CODE_BLUE56 · May 28, 2018

Like I said, this is where having a guy like Kyrie would have immensely helped Boston. Yes, they choked, considering how well they usually play at home, considering they missed god knows how many threes. But sometimes the shots won't fall, and you need a player who can create offense and make plays when it matters most.

The problem for Boston wasn't just that LeBron was the best player on the floor. It's that he was by far the best player on the floor.

Probie2429 · May 28, 2018

Gustavus Adolphus said:
They have a top 10 pick coming up.

Which doesn't help him since most rookies are gonna need a season or two to reach their full potential. If it was a top 3 pick, that's a different story. By then, Lebron is 36 all while Boston and Philly are peaking. The Bulls will also begin to be competitive at that point with all the young assets they have accumulated.

Again, if Lebron's wishes are to win, he won't stay in Cleveland. If he wants to ride out his legacy in his home city, no one is going to fault him for that, but his chances of winning in Cleveland are going to get worse going forward since putting the entire team on his back at his advanced age will shorten his career quickly. There is no reason Lebron can't be an effective player into his late 30s, but he is going to have to start thinking about a reduced role in order to do that.

Really I think his best bet is to hook up with New Orleans. That team would be scary good with him and Davis.

anotheridiot · May 30, 2018

Probie2429 said:
Lebron has a tough decision ahead of him. Cleveland is a bad team with no younger players to help Lebron (who will also be entering the twilight of his career soon). Kevin Love is a bad joke at this point as well. Boston will own the East for a few years. Philly is likely to pass Boston in due time as well. I think Lebron has to win at least 1 more Championship in order to justify all the Finals losses he has. I wouldn't fault him for sticking in Cleveland and just riding out his career. He's played a lot of basketball in his career, but I think he bolts in the offseason especially if the Cavs lose against GS/Houston.

well, it is getting a little more confusing. Philly, Boston and the always fading Raptors in the east, its still a little easier to get to the finals in the east. But with the Philly owner being the current twit on twitter, that could implode quickly too.

They had some interesting comments on the lebron and MJ comparison on ESPN this morning, as far as "normal" basketball seasons compare, LeBron is basically where MJ was at age 36 as far as wear and tear on the body. Three are not too many more records for him to pass, and I dont think Lebron will go play baseball soon, but you really wonder how much longer he plans to do this. If he is looking at one or 2 more seasons, staying in Cleveland might be best for his legacy over titles.

Axl Rose · Jun 4, 2018

This is why - in my view - LeBron will not surpass Jordan.

https://streamable.com/0bpcd

@1:35

jooo83 · Jun 4, 2018

Probie2429 said:
Lebron has a tough decision ahead of him. Cleveland is a bad team with no younger players to help Lebron (who will also be entering the twilight of his career soon). Kevin Love is a bad joke at this point as well. Boston will own the East for a few years. Philly is likely to pass Boston in due time as well. I think Lebron has to win at least 1 more Championship in order to justify all the Finals losses he has. I wouldn't fault him for sticking in Cleveland and just riding out his career. He's played a lot of basketball in his career, but I think he bolts in the offseason especially if the Cavs lose against GS/Houston.

That seems to be the popular theory and certainly makes sense for the reasons you mentioned. But there does not appear to be an obvious place for him to sign. Houston would have to rework the roster for the cap space. Lebron doesn't seem like a great fit to play with Ben Simmons (of course I heard the same thing about Dwyane Wade). In general, signing in the west makes it more difficult for him to make the finals. So while the Lakers will probably have the cap space to sign Lebron and another top player (George Paul?) would they really be better than GS/Houston?

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