Yu Garbish...

hebs

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What do you guys think?... Can he turn it around or is this a permanent trend? All I know is that when he's in the lineup, I don't even pay attention to the game because he's eventually gonna give it up like a girl on prom night.
 

Dr. Manhattan

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I cringed when i read he signed a 6 year contract for $120+ mil.
 

beckdawg

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What do you guys think?... Can he turn it around or is this a permanent trend? All I know is that when he's in the lineup, I don't even pay attention to the game because he's eventually gonna give it up like a girl on prom night.

His stuff is fine. He's striking out 11.10 per 9. And prior to the last outing where he got roughed up on multiple HRs, his HR/FB was down. His issue is he's not locating as good as he should. His walk rate is 4.80 bb/9 for a guy who's been around 2.80 the past 2 seasons. I wouldn't worry too much about it just yet. Historically finding his command has taken him a month or two as April/May are his two worst months for career bb/9.

Other than that, the data doesn't suggest he's been bad. His strand rate is pretty low which suggests he's just had some bad luck/flukey stuff happen like bad 5th innings. But on the whole, his hard hit rate is actually down from the previous two seasons at 29.4 % vs 30.0 % and 33.1 % and his soft contact rate is also better.

If there is a worry with Darvish it's not that he's "broken" vs other years. It's that he either is tipping pitches or has a mental block type thing where he just loses focus for short periods. I'm not going to go psycho analyst on a guy. If others want to that's their choice but the tools are there for the guy people thought he could be.
 

Parade_Rain

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What were the Cubs supposed to do? Sign a player who didn't want to be here for the price they were willing to pay? Really crazy stuff here. Darvish is going to be fine. There's an ebb and flow to every season for each player. Pitchers are no different than hitters in that regard.
 

hebs

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His stuff is fine. He's striking out 11.10 per 9. And prior to the last outing where he got roughed up on multiple HRs, his HR/FB was down. His issue is he's not locating as good as he should. His walk rate is 4.80 bb/9 for a guy who's been around 2.80 the past 2 seasons. I wouldn't worry too much about it just yet. Historically finding his command has taken him a month or two as April/May are his two worst months for career bb/9.

Other than that, the data doesn't suggest he's been bad. His strand rate is pretty low which suggests he's just had some bad luck/flukey stuff happen like bad 5th innings. But on the whole, his hard hit rate is actually down from the previous two seasons at 29.4 % vs 30.0 % and 33.1 %and his soft contact rate is also better.

If there is a worry with Darvish it's not that he's "broken" vs other years. It's that he either is tipping pitches or has a mental block type thing where he just loses focus for short periods. I'm not going to go psycho analyst on a guy. If others want to that's their choice but the tools are there for the guy people thought he could be.

Great reply right there!


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hebs

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What were the Cubs supposed to do? Sign a player who didn't want to be here for the price they were willing to pay? Really crazy stuff here. Darvish is going to be fine. There's an ebb and flow to every season for each player. Pitchers are no different than hitters in that regard.

All I'm saying is that it seems this started with him late last year and it doesn't seem to be improving. Of course we as fans all hope he pulls out of it. But he hasn't earned any slack with me yet. I guess I just expected more. :shrug:


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It is too early to call Yu anything but a strike out machine.

Bears posted that analysts on ESPN were looking at location and ball movement as the core issue going on. Velocity was fine. So this has more to do with adjustments vs regression.

Add to it his curve is the most unhittable pitch in baseball. So I’m not sure of why this thread even started?

Sometimes it is easy as a armchair quarterback to toss hate around. Sometimes maybe look into the subject before posting hate mail
 

hebs

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Lighten up Francis... He’s losing games. Plain and simple.
 

TC in Mississippi

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Lighten up Francis... He’s losing games. Plain and simple.


Sure, but what does that tell you? It could tell you he sucks or it could tell you something is wrong. Based on his track record, where he clearly did not suck, it sure seems like something is wrong so you look at mechanics first and nothing really looks out of whack there, then you analyze the numbers which mostly tell you that he'll be OK. Not sure what's wrong with any of that.
 

CSF77

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Sure, but what does that tell you? It could tell you he sucks or it could tell you something is wrong. Based on his track record, where he clearly did not suck, it sure seems like something is wrong so you look at mechanics first and nothing really looks out of whack there, then you analyze the numbers which mostly tell you that he'll be OK. Not sure what's wrong with any of that.

Like I said: hitting 97 and his curve is unhittable. He is missing location and his fastball is running strait.

How to fix: honestly it might just be a velocity thing where he might have to ease back to gain move. Or he could adjust where he runs his cutter and slider in the heat box then use his 97 up in the zone.

If it was me I would have 2 location spots. 1 spot I would play the cutter off of the slider. That way you have a slight break vs a larger breaking action playing off of each other.

2nd location would be curve vs 4 seem. 1 rides high in the zone 2nd tumbles through it.

And I would attack each hitter differently to keep them off balance.

Now on the whole waste of cash. It would be if he was damaged goods or a clear regression of talent due to wear and tear. Then there is no recovery. Just adjusting to less talent. We have seen that plenty and sure he may still go through this. But not yet.
 

hebs

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Sure, I'll back off the hate until the fall... but my gut feelings still have me thinking he's not gonna come close to earning that pay. (and no, I didn't have a better offseason aquisition choice) The wife is a Cards fan, so it's less easier to handle as well.
 

beckdawg

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Sure, I'll back off the hate until the fall... but my gut feelings still have me thinking he's not gonna come close to earning that pay. (and no, I didn't have a better offseason aquisition choice) The wife is a Cards fan, so it's less easier to handle as well.

People need to understand value a bit better. I don't mean this in a condescending way either it's just I think people don't understand how teams value players. So, as an example here, there's 30 teams who each have 5 starters. If you look at the top 150 pitchers by fWAR last year they range from 0.6-7.7 which was Sale. I'd argue you probably could cut off the #5 starter because a lot of teams aren't going to have 5 healthy starters so the 5th guy tends to end up being either replacement level or a guy who doesn't pitch enough to be significantly better than replacement level. So if you scale that back to the top 120 guys or top 4 guys on every team that range is 1.0-7.7.

Teams are readily willing to pay $9-10 mil a year for a Jason Hammel and hope he's that 1-1.5 win pitcher. Darvish is making $25 mil this year and $20 mil next year. So, you're expecting him to be some where between a 2-3 win pitcher based on his salary. And assuming he doesn't opt out after 2 years the following 4 aren't bad at $22, $22, $19, and $18 mil. What's a 2.5-3 win pitcher look like? Assuming he's healthy and makes 30 starts, Mike Leake. That is the career 4.04/4.15 ERA/FIP Leake who has a career 6.13 k/9 and a 2.16 bb/9.

In other words, if Darvish is healthy he's going to be worth what they are paying him. That's not really even open for debate. It is a similar story with Heyward. The real discussion isn't whether those players will "earn" their money. The discussion instead should be about opportunity cost. That is to say if you had someone else rather than them would that person be giving you more. But even if the argument is someone would rather have Arrieta, he's making $10 mil more over the first 2 years and there are likely issues with the luxury tax because of that on top of the fact he needs to be roughly half a win better both of the first 2 years.

Long story short, I wouldn't sweat it. There's really no way for Darvish to be financially ruinous. It's more a question of whether or not he helps you presumably when the cubs make the playoffs. And while people will only remember the WS where he wasn't so great, he totally shut down a very good cubs team in the NLCS.
 

hebs

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beckdawg... I appreciate the effort and input you provided. I won't pretend to say that I crunch the numbers anywhere close to the degree that you provide. Your last paragraph kind of highlights my concern. (he's fallen off since the WC and it hasn't looked much better since)
 

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He’s got great stuff, but dude is a psychological wreck. The moment something goes wrong, he completely falls apart.
 

fatbeard

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He’s got great stuff, but dude is a psychological wreck. The moment something goes wrong, he completely falls apart.

Clayton Kershaw was "mentally weak" and "not clutch" and "couldn't pitch in the postseason".

Until he could. Funny how bigger sample sizes will do that.
 

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