Most "o-line" problems are because of the scheme/QB

[MontanaXXIII]

With most successful offenses in history, you couldn't even name most of the linemen.

Dan Marino hardly ever get sacked no matter who you put in front of him. They would move career backup centers to LT and he would still not get sacked...because he could move around in the pocket and zip the ball out with the flick of a wrist.

The QB's internal clock, pocket movement, and release are what cause or prevent the vast majority of sacks. A bit of that is scheme as well: Do you run slow-developing route combinations? Do you preach getting the ball out early? Do you max protect (this was a key to the "Hogs" journeyman scrubs' success in pass protection for the Redskins).

And run blocking is almost entirely about scheme. The Broncos during the Alex Gibbs/Mike Shanahan zone blocking days had a revolving door of guys who couldn't even make most rosters. Yet they opened gaping holes because of the way everything in their system was put together.

It's the techniques/philosophies and the guys coaching them.

The Bears right now could have prime Larry Allen and Quenton Nelson at guard, Dwight Stephenson at center, and Anthony Munoz and Rayfield Wright at tackle, and they would still get absolutely nowhere with the run with this scheme/coaching in place.

 

[nvanprooyen]

Have you actually watched Kyle Long and Leno this year? This isn't a scheme issue. They have both been atrocious this year so far. Getting beat consistently, is getting beat regardless of playcalling and scheme. Everyone gets beat from time to time, it's the NFL. But those two have been BAD.

 

[SugarWalls]

Just shut the site down for a week. Can’t take it. Someone send for help. These threads need to stop.

 

[nvanprooyen]

Just shut the site down for a week. Can’t take it. Someone send for help. These threads need to stop.

It's going to be a long two weeks...

 

[Bearly]

LOL at the OP. OL sucks Donkey Dong. Mitch being forced to and /or trying to stay home has compounded the issue. Last year, Mitch saved a lot of very poor blocking. Easy to see unless you're PFF.

 

[JesusHalasChrist]

This has to be a shtick of some sort.

 

[TL1961]

With most successful offenses in history, you couldn't even name most of the linemen.

Dan Marino hardly ever get sacked no matter who you put in front of him. They would move career backup centers to LT and he would still not get sacked...because he could move around in the pocket and zip the ball out with the flick of a wrist.

The QB's internal clock, pocket movement, and release are what cause or prevent the vast majority of sacks. A bit of that is scheme as well: Do you run slow-developing route combinations? Do you preach getting the ball out early? Do you max protect (this was a key to the "Hogs" journeyman scrubs' success in pass protection for the Redskins).

And run blocking is almost entirely about scheme. The Broncos during the Alex Gibbs/Mike Shanahan zone blocking days had a revolving door of guys who couldn't even make most rosters. Yet they opened gaping holes because of the way everything in their system was put together.

It's the techniques/philosophies and the guys coaching them.

The Bears right now could have prime Larry Allen and Quenton Nelson at guard, Dwight Stephenson at center, and Anthony Munoz and Rayfield Wright at tackle, and they would still get absolutely nowhere with the run with this scheme/coaching in place.

This satire lacks humor.

 

[didshereallysaythat]

If you have a HOF QB, he can mask a bad offensive line and no running game... until he gets hurt.

Otherwise, you need atleast a serviceable line and running game. It doesn't have to be the 1995 Nebraska level good, but it has to be good enough to protect your QB and atleast give the defense the threat of running.

 

[SlickWilly]

So the scheme and the QB's are the reason Long gets pushed into the backfield on running or passing plays. Got it.

 

[bamainatlanta]

Thia belongs in there with the Howard would look great regardless of the OLine posts

 

[Bears4Ever_34]

Have you actually watched Kyle Long and Leno this year? This isn't a scheme issue. They have both been atrocious this year so far. Getting beat consistently, is getting beat regardless of playcalling and scheme. Everyone gets beat from time to time, it's the NFL. But those two have been BAD.

They couldn't run last year either when both players were healthy and playing well. I point the finger at coaching, mainly Harry Heistand since he has been in charge of the offensive line.

 

[KoreanBear]

Long sucky long time

 

[TezMaKai]

I'll say that one positive is that there are a ton of worst thread of the year candidates over the last few days.

 

[MontanaXXIII]

~sigh~

Here's Dan Marino getting sacked just 10 times with Jeff Dellenbach (a former backup center) having to play LT:

1989 Miami Dolphins Rosters, Stats, Schedule, Team Draftees | Pro-Football-Reference.com

Check out the 1989 Miami Dolphins Roster, Stats, Schedule, Team Draftees, Injury Reports and more on Pro-Football-Reference.com.

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The 49ers just destroyed the Browns last night with Joe Staley out and some rookie 6th round pick scrub named Justin Skule playing LT.

The 2017 Eagles won the Super Bowl after Jason Peters went down mid-season. He was replaced by some 5th round pick scrub named Halakjfdjksfdkjfdslkjfsd Vaitai.



Now, onto the 1998 Broncos, where Terrell Davis rushed for 2008 yards on 5.1 yards per carry. Here's their line: Tony Jones (undrafted free agent), Mark Schlereth (10th round pick), Tom Nalen (7th round pick), Dan Neil (3rd round pick), Harry Swayne (7th round pick).


Conversely, the 1999 Saints made Ricky Williams seem like a bust (3.5 yards per carry) with an offensive line of Willie Roaf, Kyle Turley, Chris Naole, Wally Williams, and Jerry Fontenot. 3 1st round, top 10 picks (including a HOFer and a Pro Bowler), and a center who started for 12 years in the league.


Linemen succeeding or failing depends almost entirely on the scheme. When there's a running lane designed based off designed blocking angles, it happens independently of a lineman's strength or athletic ability. He just does what he's told and the result depends on what was called vs. what the defense called.

Pass protection: If the QB holds the ball, he's going to get sacked. If he gets it out within 2 seconds of the snap, he's not going to get sacked...unless there's a blitzer coming free, which usually isn't on the offensive line to begin with.

And if he slides away from the rush/climbs the pocket...bonus time.

O-line is the biggest waste of draft capital ever. If I were a GM, I would never spend higher than a 5th round pick on an offensive lineman unless the rest of my team were stacked to where another player at any other position would be pointless.

People love those 90s Cowboys lines, but fail to realize they didn't have a single 1st round pick on those units, and the entire left side of their line consisted of undrafted free agents (including Mark Tuinei being a converted d-lineman).

And it's not just that all these uber-awesome players are falling to the late rounds/going undrafted. It's system.

Nate Newton was not the athlete Randall McDaniel was, but the Cowboys did not suffer any loss in effectiveness.

Oh, and then look at the current Cowboys. They have obsessed over offensive line the last several years...yet Dak Prescott was sacked 56 times last year.

 

[dweebs19]

it was nice of Mrs Leno to make an account.

 

[Diehardfan]

Funny......KC doesn't have much trouble using this "scheme".

 

[Aquineas]

To the OP, respectfully, let's agree to disagree.

 

[msadows]

Funny......KC doesn't have much trouble using this "scheme".

Yup. Its not the scheme, its the personnel.

Pretty easy to see.

Plus, don't discount how much not having a good #2 WR OR a TE hurts us in the short passing game AND the running game. No one besides AROB is a threat. Trey Burton is a fucking MASSIVE disappointment. Dude is more soft than charmin.

 

[remydat]

The OL sucks for sure but there is some element of truth. This OL was built for Jordan Howard ie a one cut runner who got up the field quickly. Nagy and Hiestand changed the blocking schemes when they were hired without ever really getting the OL to move to those new blocking schemes. We also have guys who don't get up field quickly as Cohen loves to run laterally and Monty has zero explosion and also dances a bit too much.

That along with regression from guys like Long and Leno are recipes for disaster.

 

[msadows]

The OL sucks for sure but there is some element of truth. This OL was built for Jordan Howard ie a one cut runner who got up the field quickly. Nagy and Hiestand changed the blocking schemes when they were hired without ever really getting the OL to move to those new blocking schemes. We also have guys who don't get up field quickly as Cohen loves to run laterally and Monty has zero explosion and also dances a bit too much.

That along with regression from guys like Long and Leno are recipes for disaster.

No. Our oline would still suck no matter who you put back there. It's built literally for no runningback dude.

When your right guard gets pushed back, and your center constantly has to help him, you aren't going to win the running battle EVER.

When your left tackle is scared of getting beat outside and then gets abused inside, you aint going to win any running battles ever.

Put Payton, Sanders, Sayers, whoever the fuck you want back there, this oline will make them look like trash.

Not saying montgomery is helping the situation, but c'mon man.