David Njoku or OJ Howard?

Aesopian

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I wrote not a second rounder. And I personally wouldn't spend a 3rd or even a 4th on him. I think at his career stage potential is a risky thing to trade that kind of capital on.

In 2021 on the 5th year option he's probably going to be $6-7mil, not really cheap for his production.

Potential? He's underutilized not untapped potential.
 

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Howard-2nd
Njoku-3rd
Njoku..do it.
our late 2nd for Njoku and their late 6th rounder maybe?
..fuck, just give them the pick for Njoku.
 

dennehy

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Potential? He's underutilized not untapped potential.

When a first round pick is 'underutilized' by two separate regimes over three years, you have to wonder a little bit.
 

WindyCity

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I wrote not a second rounder. And I personally wouldn't spend a 3rd or even a 4th on him. I think at his career stage potential is a risky thing to trade that kind of capital on.

In 2021 on the 5th year option he's probably going to be $6-7mil, not really cheap for his production.

500 yards and 5-6 TDS.

We have paid Burton 18 million for that production.
 

dennehy

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500 yards and 5-6 TDS.

We have paid Burton 18 million for that production.

How's that working out?

Bears also didn't give up a 2nd rounder for Burton, for 2 years of him. Howard isn't a bad player, but not worth a second rounder at this stage.
 

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When a first round pick is 'underutilized' by two separate regimes over three years, you have to wonder a little bit.

Arians makes it VERY clear that he doesn't utilize tight ends like a Gronk or a Greg Olsen. So if you're going to "wonder" try researching facts instead.

That doesn't mean Arians is expecting to see the next Rob Gronkowski emerge at the position – and his reason is purely financial.
“We pay Larry (Fitzgerald) and those guys too much money to throw it to the tight ends,” Arians said. “They’re here to block.”
 

KittiesKorner

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Arians makes it VERY clear that he doesn't utilize tight ends like a Gronk or a Greg Olsen. So if you're going to "wonder" try researching facts instead.

giphy.gif
 

dennehy

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Arians makes it VERY clear that he doesn't utilize tight ends like a Gronk or a Greg Olsen. So if you're going to "wonder" try researching facts instead.
Haha, a quote from probably 10 years ago about players on a different team. Here's some more recent 'research'- Howard had fewer catches and TDs than another TE on his own team last year. The TEs on Tampa had over 800 yards on 74 catches last year. And you want to spend a second rounder on him, with one more cheap year on his contract.
 

Aesopian

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Haha, a quote from probably 10 years ago about players on a different team. Here's some more recent 'research'- Howard had fewer catches and TDs than another TE on his own team last year. The TEs on Tampa had over 800 yards on 74 catches last year. And you want to spend a second rounder on him, with one more cheap year on his contract.

Cameron Brate is a beast in the redzone and he always has been he had 8 touchdowns in 2016 and 6 in 2017 and 2018. OJ Howard didn't seem to be utilized in those situations so to call that research is like critiquing Mahomes because he doesn't run as much as Trubisky it's apples to oranges.

The quote is from ten years ago but it's still fricken true you silly goose as you can see with his under utilization.
 

dennehy

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Cameron Brate is a beast in the redzone and he always has been he had 8 touchdowns in 2016 and 6 in 2017 and 2018. OJ Howard didn't seem to be utilized in those situations so to call that research is like critiquing Mahomes because he doesn't run as much as Trubisky it's apples to oranges.

The quote is from ten years ago but it's still fricken true you silly goose as you can see with his under utilization.

If a TE is worth a 2nd round, he should be utilized in the red zone more, don't you think?

Your analogy makes no sense.

If you look earlier in this thread, and in another, Cameron Brate is a player I'd like. And if the Bucs want to keep Howard you can maybe get him for much less than a second rounder. Although really there's little reason for the Bucs to give up either, they have a ton of cap space.
 

remydat

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Pass on both for anything more than a 5th rounder. Not worth it. Move on.
 

bearsfan1977

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Maybe after year two I'd consider a second for OJ, but he's had three mediocre years, consistently missed games, and has only one year left at a decent pay rate. I don't think you trade a second rounder for a 4th year tight end based on his unrealized talent.

I said before in another thread-Leonard Floyd for OJ Howard. I think Floyd is a better fit in their defensive scheme. We get a TE with huge upside. Spend the 13 mil on a FA OLB.
 

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I said before in another thread-Leonard Floyd for OJ Howard. I think Floyd is a better fit in their defensive scheme. We get a TE with huge upside. Spend the 13 mil on a FA OLB.

I don't think Tampa would want Floyd at $13m, for one year though. Where does he fit better in their scheme?
 

bearsfan1977

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I don't think Tampa would want Floyd at $13m, for one year though. Where does he fit better in their scheme?

I think he’d make a good SAM LB in their 4-3. Good length with crazy athleticism that be called on to blitz the gaps or the edge occasionally. Problem is, he was drafted (I’m assuming) because of his pass rushing, but he never was elite at that even at UGA. He just doesn’t have the strength to be more than a possible above average pass rusher. He WAS great at being a versatile chess piece. I just think he can be used more effectively in a different scheme.

You’re right about the 13 mil tho. Only way Tampa would do it is with an extension both sides could live with.
 

dennehy

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I think he’d make a good SAM LB in their 4-3. Good length with crazy athleticism that be called on to blitz the gaps or the edge occasionally. Problem is, he was drafted (I’m assuming) because of his pass rushing, but he never was elite at that even at UGA. He just doesn’t have the strength to be more than a possible above average pass rusher. He WAS great at being a versatile chess piece. I just think he can be used more effectively in a different scheme.

You’re right about the 13 mil tho. Only way Tampa would do it is with an extension both sides could live with.

Tampa plays a 3-4 now, with Todd Bowles. I agree that he's a good fit as a SAM now though, and you say one that is very versatile. IMO his game could be kind of like Lorenzo Alexander, who just retired from Buffalo.

I agree that he's only trade-able with an extension.
 

bearsfan1977

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Tampa plays a 3-4 now, with Todd Bowles. I agree that he's a good fit as a SAM now though, and you say one that is very versatile. IMO his game could be kind of like Lorenzo Alexander, who just retired from Buffalo.

I agree that he's only trade-able with an extension.

Shit, good call. I wasn’t aware they switched schemes. I still think he would be better utilized in a different way. But, I’ve always been a big fan of OJ Howard. I don’t know why Tampa hasn’t used him more recently.

I know one thing-no way in hell I want the Bears to pay Floyd 13 mil when he’s averaged 4 sacks/season.
 

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Njoku IMO has been more productive but is hurt constantly, Howard is rated as an elite athlete which makes me wonder why he's never had the breakthrough year while his WR's have
He has never been productive, even at Alabama. Alabama's offense and QB play was blamed for his lack of production. At some point it is just the player.
 

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If a TE is worth a 2nd round, he should be utilized in the red zone more, don't you think?

Your analogy makes no sense.

If you look earlier in this thread, and in another, Cameron Brate is a player I'd like. And if the Bucs want to keep Howard you can maybe get him for much less than a second rounder. Although really there's little reason for the Bucs to give up either, they have a ton of cap space.

He's not excelling in the red zone? he had 6 touchdowns in 2017, 5 touchdowns in 2018 just because it was down a year doesn't mean he sucks in the redzone.

That question made no sense.

OJ Howard was only targeted 53 times in 2019 while Travis Kelce was targeted 136 times in 2019. Bucs can offer him a contract but he would be foolish to stay somewhere where his targets are extremely low.
 

dennehy

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He's not excelling in the red zone? he had 6 touchdowns in 2017, 5 touchdowns in 2018 just because it was down a year doesn't mean he sucks in the redzone.

That question made no sense.

OJ Howard was only targeted 53 times in 2019 while Travis Kelce was targeted 136 times in 2019. Bucs can offer him a contract but he would be foolish to stay somewhere where his targets are extremely low.

He doesn't get to choose where he plays this year, or probably in 2021. He's under contract. Also he was targeted less than another TE on his team.

You said he wasn't excelling in the red zone, and you used Brate as an excuse for that. And I didn't say he sucked in the red zone. I said that I wouldn't trade a second round pick for a player who has played like he has.
 

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