Is this team a true closer short of another WS run?

anotheridiot

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Norwood had enough chances last year to show he belonged here, they chose to sign just about every other pitcher we never heard about instead of him having a slot on this roster. To me that was what worked in 2016, threw all the chances out there in the first half, fixed the pen when you found out what you really needed. Instead we have a pen with two guys having options and the roster is jammed waiting for injuries. Instead of Norwood getting shot, we get Allen Webster who has a 5 era, 2 bombs out of 14 hits he gave up, 9 k's deflated by 5 walks.
 

CSF77

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Norwood had enough chances last year to show he belonged here, they chose to sign just about every other pitcher we never heard about instead of him having a slot on this roster. To me that was what worked in 2016, threw all the chances out there in the first half, fixed the pen when you found out what you really needed. Instead we have a pen with two guys having options and the roster is jammed waiting for injuries. Instead of Norwood getting shot, we get Allen Webster who has a 5 era, 2 bombs out of 14 hits he gave up, 9 k's deflated by 5 walks.
It has a lot to do with expected use and if in development still. Webster is not being used that much and he is more accomplished. Norwood is the closer at Iowa and this would be more about steady work load and a more inexperienced pitcher needing a steady work load. That is why Maples got demoted. He was at the bottom of the depth chart and needed a steady work load.

If the Cubs were celler dwellers then I would guess that they would burn a year to get Maples and Norwood acclimated.

Oh. I believe Alozay is still in extended AZL. Clifton is not on the 40 man. ODLC is at A+. None are options ATM.

I have to agree with the you are crazy to be co-depandent on these guys on a contender.

I would push Chatwood into the 9th and run with it. See how it pans out for now. As far as set up it really is situational
 

CSF77

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Cubs Activate Xavier Cedeno, Place Allen Webster On IL
May 11th, 2019 at 10:01am CST • By TC Zencka
The Cubs have activated left-hander Xavier Cedeno from the injured list to make his 2019 debut, per MLB.com’s Jordan Bastian (via Twitter). In a corresponding move, right-hander Allen Webster takes Cedeno’s slot on the injured list with radial nerve inflammation in his throwing arm.

Cedeno split 2018 between a pair of Cub rivals in the Brewers and White Sox, pitching to a combined 2.43 ERA across 48 games. Cedeno, 32, put together back-to-back solid campaigns for Tampa Bay after being DFA’ed by the Nationals early in 2015, but a forearm injury cost him most of 2017, leading to another non-tender prior to 2018. He bounced back successfully for the White Sox and Brewers, pitching without a real platoon split as right-handers mustered only a .212/.316/.288 line versus lefties who hit .207/.281/.293 against Cedeno. Still, the Brewers rarely used Cedeno for more than a batter at a time, and he got as many as four outs in an appearance only thrice last season.

Webster, meanwhile, already hit a career high in appearances with 12 so far this season in Chicago, though his 11 total innings have a ways to go before catching the 59 innings he threw as a starter for the Red Sox back in 2014. Results have been underwhelming for Webster in 2019, 4.91 ERA to 5.48 FIP while surrendering 11.5 hits per nine innings.
 

chibears55

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Cubs Activate Xavier Cedeno, Place Allen Webster On IL
May 11th, 2019 at 10:01am CST • By TC Zencka
The Cubs have activated left-hander Xavier Cedeno from the injured list to make his 2019 debut, per MLB.com’s Jordan Bastian (via Twitter). In a corresponding move, right-hander Allen Webster takes Cedeno’s slot on the injured list with radial nerve inflammation in his throwing arm.

Cedeno split 2018 between a pair of Cub rivals in the Brewers and White Sox, pitching to a combined 2.43 ERA across 48 games. Cedeno, 32, put together back-to-back solid campaigns for Tampa Bay after being DFA’ed by the Nationals early in 2015, but a forearm injury cost him most of 2017, leading to another non-tender prior to 2018. He bounced back successfully for the White Sox and Brewers, pitching without a real platoon split as right-handers mustered only a .212/.316/.288 line versus lefties who hit .207/.281/.293 against Cedeno. Still, the Brewers rarely used Cedeno for more than a batter at a time, and he got as many as four outs in an appearance only thrice last season.

Webster, meanwhile, already hit a career high in appearances with 12 so far this season in Chicago, though his 11 total innings have a ways to go before catching the 59 innings he threw as a starter for the Red Sox back in 2014. Results have been underwhelming for Webster in 2019, 4.91 ERA to 5.48 FIP while surrendering 11.5 hits per nine innings.
They should of bounced Webster when they brought Montgomery up instead of Maples
 

CSF77

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They should of bounced Webster when they brought Montgomery up instead of Maples
Again it was by use.

I see this as a trust thing. Joe doesn't trust Maples to toss strikes so he only used him in low pressure.

Joe said that he needed more stable work. So you can take that as Joe had pitchers that he trusted more.

This will be a ongoing issue. When your WHIP is closer to 2 vs 1 the strike out per 9 is not a priority.

SO/9 is something to look at when you take 2 guys at 1.30 WHIP and try to judge which one is better. It is not a gauge to tell if a guy belongs in the majors.

All it did is give him exposure. It will never keep him up. WHIP will.
 

CSF77

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And on that note. Maples is at 1.88 at the majors 1.33 at Iowa. I'm pretty sure if he gets that to a 1 at Iowa they will promote him and let him stick.

I take the .55 difference as nerves and lack of respect from ump's on close pitches.

But IMO he really needs to start making his 4 seem as his bread and butter with the slider as the knock out. Right now he is over using the slider. It comes down to trust IMO. He knows his slider is filthy. So this is akin to Marmol who had a 96 4 seem but sat on his slider until hitters just let him walk them
 

chibears55

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Again it was by use.

I see this as a trust thing. Joe doesn't trust Maples to toss strikes so he only used him in low pressure.

Joe said that he needed more stable work. So you can take that as Joe had pitchers that he trusted more.

This will be a ongoing issue. When your WHIP is closer to 2 vs 1 the strike out per 9 is not a priority.

SO/9 is something to look at when you take 2 guys at 1.30 WHIP and try to judge which one is better. It is not a gauge to tell if a guy belongs in the majors.

All it did is give him exposure. It will never keep him up. WHIP will.
I dont think who sticks or dont is Joe choice..
To think that it a who he trusts more and that he would trust Webster more then Maples is a bit laughable...
 

CSF77

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I dont think who sticks or dont is Joe choice..
To think that it a who he trusts more and that he would trust Webster more then Maples is a bit laughable...
Maples saw 3 games. Webster 12.

Here is a list of demotes or fake injuries.

Edwards over 2 WHIP
Montgomery WHIP near 2.
Collins 2.10
Roserio 1.86
Maples 1.88
Webster 1.73

Who stayed Ryan 1.31 WHIP

It matters. It is the best gague on if you have command or not.

And why I bring up Chatwood as a closer. 1.35.

I don't say these things for no reason. I research and form opinions on facts
 

beckdawg

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Norwood had enough chances last year to show he belonged here, they chose to sign just about every other pitcher we never heard about instead of him having a slot on this roster. To me that was what worked in 2016, threw all the chances out there in the first half, fixed the pen when you found out what you really needed. Instead we have a pen with two guys having options and the roster is jammed waiting for injuries. Instead of Norwood getting shot, we get Allen Webster who has a 5 era, 2 bombs out of 14 hits he gave up, 9 k's deflated by 5 walks.
Norwood threw 11 innings in the majors last year and had a 2.71 FIP. His ERA was 4.09 but that's entirely luck based in that his strand rate was 63.2%. Typically a normal strand rate is between 70-75% and it's not a skill based thing. It's just guys getting hits at the wrong time vs guys getting hits when it doesn't matter.
 

CSF77

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Norwood threw 11 innings in the majors last year and had a 2.71 FIP. His ERA was 4.09 but that's entirely luck based in that his strand rate was 63.2%. Typically a normal strand rate is between 70-75% and it's not a skill based thing. It's just guys getting hits at the wrong time vs guys getting hits when it doesn't matter.
Really? He had a 1.74 WHIP in 10 games giving up 14 hits and 5 walks. Basically he was giving up way more bases than he should have. 30 outs and 19 guys got on base. That ratio will burn you.

That is why he didn't stick around and is now in Iowa not even the fist line of defense. Maples was there also and still is hovering 2 guys on base per inning. Zast. Was there also and now is not with the team.

This is a old story of guys with good stuff that lack the command to master it
 
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