Jahns notebook: Bears can’t wait to see Montgomery in camp, Trubisky ‘more than fine’ against Pagano’s defense

[Leomaz]

That's right. I recall the premise of the Rams offense is to have every play look exactly the same, so the defense doesn't know if it's a run, pass, or what kind of each.

Whoa, you are going to confuse him now.

 

[Penny Traitor]

Well I didn’t watch every game he played in but as soon as I do I’ll get back to ya

Looking forward to it.

Just know that I have more names when we are done with Wilson that I think fit the criteria...you just only asked for one.

 

[Gustavus Adolphus]

Yeah not sure you are wrong, I am just saying Loggains did do a few unique things. It was one of his only redeeming qualities as he would pull something out of his hat from time to time. Also tried a lot of different players because WR in particular sucked so that would lead to more groupings as well.

Yeah, I remember guys like Bowen going on the Score saying how Loggains was doing anything he could schematically to get the WRs open, because they couldn't really do it on their own. That lends itself to some different personnel groupings.

 

[Leomaz]

Looking forward to it.

Just know that I have more names when we are done with Wilson that I think fit the criteria...you just only asked for one.

Lol. Every game I watch I see both abs make stupid plays. Even the GOAT Deshaun Watson

 

[bearmick]

If Amos had been deployed on offense at any position at all then it would have been 33 unique personnel groupings on offense instead of 32.

You just said it wasn't about players. Make up your mind. Whether it's about player personnel or position sets/alignments, the Bears had an entirely different set of both in 2018 than they did in 2017.

Over that span, they had all of Loggains' personnel groupings and all of Nagy's. The Rams only had McVay's. So why is it surprising that the Bears had more?

If you're stuck, I'll back off. I'm not here to taunt you like the other poster did with the whole Amos at LB ordeal. I'm just asking why this should surprise anyone.

 

[Gustavus Adolphus]

That's right. I recall the premise of the Rams offense is to have every play look exactly the same, so the defense doesn't know if it's a run, pass, or what kind of each.

So then why wold the players matter?

 

[Penny Traitor]

Lol. Every game I watch I see both abs make stupid plays. Even the GOAT Deshaun Watson

How do you know it was stupid on their part?

Maybe their receiver ran the wrong route?

Maybe the play design was stupid?

Maybe the opposing DC just made it look like a stupid play?

Maybe the QBs cleat caught the grass just right to sail the ball just off the mark?

 

[xer0h0ur]

You just said it wasn't about players. Make up your mind. Whether it's about player personnel or position sets/alignments, the Bears had an entirely different set of both in 2018 than they did in 2017.

Over that span, they had all of Loggains' personnel groupings and all of Nagy's. The Rams only had McVay's. So why is it surprising that the Bears had more?

If you're stuck, I'll back off. I'm not here to taunt you like the other poster did with the whole Amos at LB ordeal. I'm just asking why this should surprise anyone.

Holy Christ. I used Amos as an example because you name dropped him. The point being made is if you take a safety and put him on offense. Doesn't matter if its the starter or his backup. It becomes a new personnel grouping on offense. You're on another level of blockhead. Doesn't even have to be a player from defense to create a new personnel grouping. Nagy could have marched out 8 offensive linemen onto the field and it would have been another new personnel grouping. It is literally about the combination of positional players on the field.

Anyways, I've already wasted enough time on you. I have to get back to work.

 

[bearmick]

Holy Christ. I used Amos as an example because you name dropped him. The point being made is if you take a safety and put him on offense. Doesn't matter if its the starter or his backup. It becomes a new personnel grouping on offense. You're on another level of blockhead. Doesn't even have to be a player from defense to create a new personnel grouping. Nagy could have marched out 8 offensive linemen onto the field and it would have been another new personnel grouping. It is literally about the combination of positional players on the field.

Anyways, I've already wasted enough time on you. I have to get back to work.

Absolutely shocking that a team with two completely separate coaching staffs, playbooks, and philosophies over the said two-year span had more of these unique groups than a team with the same coaches and playbook in both years. Have a good day.

 

[WestCoastBearsFan]

You are kidding me right? TRUBISKY HAD A HIGHER QBR? Is that better than passer rating. I honestly don’t know the difference.

Yes passer rating is considered to be much superior to QBR but they both have flaws. The main difference is passer rating does not take into account a QB’s running and just focuses on what he does with his arm were QBR takes his feet into account.

 

[bearmick]

QBR is ESPN's metric that nobody really pays attention to until it puts average Bears QBs as third in the NFL.

 

[Gustavus Adolphus]

Absolutely shocking that a team with two completely separate coaching staffs, playbooks, and philosophies over the said two-year span had more of these unique groups than a team with the same coaches and playbook in both years. Have a good day.

Wait a second...I'm confused about this argument just a tad. I just want two basic sets of players here:
Group A: Cohen-Burton-Robinson-Gabriel-Miller

Group B: Cohen-Burton-Robinson-Gabriel-Ridley

Is the suggestion here that these are two different personnel groupings? If so, how? They both have 3 WRs, 1 TE, 1 RB. It shouldn't matter the names on the back of the jerseys.

Is this really what some people are arguing with you about?

 

[bearmick]

Wait a second...I'm confused about this argument just a tad. I just want two basic sets of players here:
Group A: Cohen-Burton-Robinson-Gabriel-Miller

Group B: Cohen-Burton-Robinson-Gabriel-Ridley

Is the suggestion here that these are two different personnel groupings? If so, how? They both have 3 WRs, 1 TE, 1 RB. It shouldn't matter the names on the back of the jerseys.

Is this really what some people are arguing with you about?

Initially I thought so, then he seemed to be saying it wasn't about the players but the positional set up. As in, RB, 2TE, 2WR is a different group to empty backfield with a TE, one WR on one side, trips on the other.

Either way, I would have thought a team with two completely different playbooks AND personnel would have more variance than a team with the same coaching and playbook. But I'm just a tweedle dumb, wtf do I know?

 

[Gustavus Adolphus]

Initially I thought so, then he seemed to be saying it wasn't about the players but the positional set up. As in, RB, 2TE, 2WR is a different group to empty backfield with one WR on one side, trips on the other.

Either way, I would have thought a team with two completely different playbooks AND personnel would have more variance than a team with the same coaching and playbook. But I'm just a tweedle dumb, wtf do I know?

Amos is a LB doe...

 

[remydat]

Yeah, I remember guys like Bowen going on the Score saying how Loggains was doing anything he could schematically to get the WRs open, because they couldn't really do it on their own. That lends itself to some different personnel groupings.

Yeah that was my recollection as well. I really am not sure how they get to 32 because the reality is in terms of how NFL coaches discuss personnel, there are only 21 combinations that I am aware of.

00, 01, 02, 03, 04, 05, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 20, 21, 22, 23, 30, 31, 32, 40, 41, 50

First number represents number of running backs on the field and 2nd number is number of tight ends. So it seems they may be counting when a defender or OL reports as eligible receiver but in reality that is still an OL or defender playing the position of RB, WR, TE so really still technically one of the above personnel groupings. It is not like Mack reports for offense then lines up at OLB or DE. He lines up as a WR, TE, or RB.

Rams for example run 11 personnel (1 RB, 1 TE and 3 WRs) the vast majority of the time ie around 85%.

 

[Gustavus Adolphus]

Yeah that was my recollection as well. I really am not sure how they get to 32 because the reality is in terms of how NFL coaches discuss personnel, there are only 21 combinations that I am aware of.

00, 01, 02, 03, 04, 05, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 20, 21, 22, 23, 30, 31, 32, 40, 41, 50

First number represents number of running backs on the field and 2nd number is number of tight ends. So it seems they may be counting when a defender or OL reports as eligible receiver but in reality that is still an OL or defender playing the position of RB, WR, TE so really still technically one of the above personnel groupings. It is not like Mack reports for offense then lines up at OLB or DE. He lines up as a WR, TE, or RB.

Rams for example run 11 personnel (1 RB, 1 TE and 3 WRs) the vast majority of the time ie around 85%.

If the first number is running backs, then you need to take out the last three. 40, 41, and 50 would all be illegal formations.

 

[Les Grossman]

Look man. Nagy isn't exactly holding Mitch's hand out there. People don't realize just how complicated Nagy's offense is. And its only going to become more complex as they keep adding.

That isn't a typo. The Chicago Bears in the LAST TWO SEASONS combined have used 32 unique personnel groupings...and you can be sure as shit that John Fox's offense didn't contribute much to that number. Mitch is only going to get better with time in this offense.

That time span also includes John Fox’s final year in Chicago, but Nagy put the Bears over the top purely with the number of defensive players he lined up on offense in the red zone.

More creative personnel groupings isn’t the only way to spur offensive creativity, as evidenced by two of the league’s best finishing at the bottom of the list.

The Los Angeles Rams and Kansas City Chiefs prefer to show opposing defenses similar looks on most plays so they can’t predict what is coming based on what the offense is showing.

Nagy diverged from his mentor Andy Reid in that way, landing their two offenses on the opposite side of the spectrum.

https://bearswire.usatoday.com/2019/06/27/chicago-bears-offense-matt-nagy-andy-reid-personnel/

 

[Les Grossman]

What's really interesting is that Nagy isn't like Reid at all really, he's like Sean Payton in terms of what he wants to do on offense.

 

[WestCoastBearsFan]

What? I don't follow.

Goff and the Rams were so good last year off of play-action because


That time span also includes John Fox’s final year in Chicago, but Nagy put the Bears over the top purely with the number of defensive players he lined up on offense in the red zone.

More creative personnel groupings isn’t the only way to spur offensive creativity, as evidenced by two of the league’s best finishing at the bottom of the list.

The Los Angeles Rams and Kansas City Chiefs prefer to show opposing defenses similar looks on most plays so they can’t predict what is coming based on what the offense is showing.

Nagy diverged from his mentor Andy Reid in that way, landing their two offenses on the opposite side of the spectrum.

https://bearswire.usatoday.com/2019/06/27/chicago-bears-offense-matt-nagy-andy-reid-personnel/

So it sounds like the Bears would have been up there if you remove Loggains / Fox from the equation?

 

[WestCoastBearsFan]

What's really interesting is that Nagy isn't like Reid at all really, he's like Sean Payton.

How so?