NFL Preseason keeps taking body blows

[sevvy]

if they drop the preseason games...who is gonna pay the bills?

Terrence Pegula, the owner of the Bills.


HAHAHAHAHA GET IT???

 

[Bearin' Down]

Sorry, don't see the NFLPA buying into a 17 or 18 game season, and don't see the owners pulling a lockout to get those extra games. The players key issues are guaranteed contracts and better revenue sharing. The owners won't be willing to give much ground on those just to get the extra games. The sensible compromise is a 16-game 18 week regular season with 2 byes, and an extra playoff round (extra wildcards & a play-in round). That gives the owners an extra two weeks of meaningful games to sell to the networks. Preseason games drop down to two, and get used mostly to evaluate new acquisitions.

An interesting question is whether the small print in the current CBA specifies that in absence of a new CBA or a lockout, the specifications of the current CBA remain in effect. If so, the owners are effectively screwed wrt unilaterally changing the preseason/regular season/playoff mix. I'll bet they didn't think of that back in 2011, when the current CBA was negotiated...

I have to agree with @iueyedoc. Teams are not gonna give up 32 games of revenue for 4. While I'm sure playoff revenue for TV is greater than the stadium revenue, I'd highly doubt it comes anywhere close to the total revenue generated from the preseason.

I would not assume the owners aren't willing to have a short term blackout for long term gains. It will impact the players far more.

There is zero chance the players get guaranteed contracts (if I'm understanding this point). This isn't the NBA. Players are injured and careers end abruptly. This would severely impact the competitiveness and parody that exists. If it did happen, players could expect much lower salaries.

However, they could see a marginal increase in revenue and guaranteed benefits for life. They'll also see expanded rosters. So that means more players are getting paid, there's more money, more opportunity, and benefits.

I also don't know about the provision of the cba you are referencing. You should provide it so we can all read it.

 

[airtime143]

This would severely impact the competitiveness and parody that exists. If it did happen, players could expect much lower salaries.

Your typo seems almost more appropriate than the right word.

 

[iueyedoc]

There is zero chance the players get guaranteed contracts (if I'm understanding this point). This isn't the NBA. Players are injured and careers end abruptly. This would severely impact the competitiveness and parody that exists. If it did happen, players could expect much lower salaries.

Agree that the fully guaranteed contract is a pipe dream for players. Though they could do a form of team cap relief or credit for career ending injuries. Problem there is guys flush with money, like Jerry Jones, would likely overpay aging players with long term deals and then they would get mysterious career ending injuries once their skills deminished.

 

[baredown]

You believe the owners will give up 32 dates of local ticket and concession sales fora few playoff games? How would that work? Add 2 wild cards teams (4 total) and now half the league is in the playoffs with some definite sub .500 teams making it. And that would just add 4 total games not an additional week. Where do the likes of Buffalo benefit from stadium revenue lost from the 2 home preseason games given up?

Umhhh, dropping two preseason games means dropping one (1) home preseason game, correct?

That aside, the whole point of the owners wanting an 18 game schedule is that regular games generate more money for them that preseason games, a lot more. That's mostly due to broadcast revenue. So yeah, I expect the TV revenues for an extra regular season weekend of games and an extra playoff week easily offset the loss of one home preseason game. In case you haven't noticed, preseason stadiums are generally ~half empty. I have trouble giving my preseason game tickets away. And by the way, the Bears (and I suspect most other NFL teams...) charge quite a bit less for their preseason game tickets.

Look, the owners will do what they can to maximize revenue. The players will do what they can to maximize their career earnings. You seem to feel the owners will simply get the 18 game schedule they want. I don't. I think the NFLPA holds the high ground here. The owners aren't going to get everything they want. Yeah, the preseason schedule will get reduced because everyone wants that. But the players don't want an 18 game schedule, and I don't see the owners being able to force it...

 

[Visionman]

I still like the idea they floated a few months ago. Cut 2 preseason games. Every team them plays one out-of-country\overseas game, with the 2nd bye week immediately after this extra game.

Each team still has 8 home and 8 away games, an extra bye to recover, a shorter preseason, and a grestly expanded world NFL market. Win across the board, IMO...

 

[DrGonzo]

I can't believe the NFL actually makes any money on preseason games unless it's artificially structured that way in their tv contracts. Viewership just can't be that high.

The prevailing wisdom used to be that the coaches wanted preseason games and the players didn't. But the coaches are managing to evaluate talent well enough to ID their starters to hold them out of those games anyway.

I think the only option that has something for everyone is to cut the preseason in half and add a 17th regular season game to be played in an out of market location, i.e. Europe, Mexico, Canada, or a U.S. city vying for a franchise. This way no one gives up a home game. Then a second bye week could also be added for the eighteenth week.

The owners get more revenue and a better chance to expand the league, the players have to swallow another chance to risk injury but it's only one game and it's another check. And there might be something they want more anyway they can bargain for in return. The fans get more real football in a season of the same length if you include preseason.

 

[Bearin' Down]

Your typo seems almost more appropriate than the right word.

Well, you learn something new every day. All this time I thought that's what was being said and didn't really give it too much thought. Thanks to you, I now see I was way off and question why I ever thought it was parody instead of parity.

 

[dweebs19]

No way do the players accept more regular season games without more money. Personally, I say keep it as is. Nagy is smart enough to not play his starters. Maybe the other coaches will come to that line of thinking at some point.

 

[DrGonzo]

No way do the players accept more regular season games without more money. Personally, I say keep it as is. Nagy is smart enough to not play his starters. Maybe the other coaches will come to that line of thinking at some point.

The were huge give-backs in the last CBA and the players' leverage is minimal. I think the owners will offer them something for more games but the fight will be over whether it's guaranteed money. The owners have been wanting to go to war ever since the dawn of free agency and they aren't afraid of a strike. The NFLPA might actually get more for the players by negotiating a longer season now than in the next CBA after 2020.

 

[xer0h0ur]

Meh. In my opinion, it's really just a matter of people adjusting their expectations for what preseason should be: an extension of practice to allow teams to evaluate backup talent / rookies against another team and whittle down the roster before the regular season begins, that happens to be televised. I don't think it needs to be done away with, it's useful in that way. Once more and more coaches stop playing starters completely, which will leave only the die-hard fans who want to see the depth players.

While I agree with you on that, lets say pre-season turns almost exclusively into that from now on. Does it really then take 4 games to evaluate your 2's and 3's? Methinks nein. So I'm all good with eliminating a couple of those pre-season games and tacking on 1 or 2 regular season games to replace them. I still believe franchises will make far more money off the replacement regular season game than those 2 pre-season games combined. There are always more people attending regular season games and more money being thrown around buying food and merch than in the pre-season.

 

[xer0h0ur]

Agree that the fully guaranteed contract is a pipe dream for players. Though they could do a form of team cap relief or credit for career ending injuries. Problem there is guys flush with money, like Jerry Jones, would likely overpay aging players with long term deals and then they would get mysterious career ending injuries once their skills deminished.

Didn't the whole Roquan Smith contract language fiasco last year already teach us that in the NFL even "guaranteed money" isn't actually guaranteed in a lot of contracts? IMO that bullshit contract language needs to be snuffed out entirely at the very least.

 

[Raskolnikov]

A real CEO with the slightest vision would have gone to 2 pre-season "scrimmages" for back-ups and wannabe back-ups while adding a 17th "international" game for every team over a decade ago.

That would expand the game globally

Anyway...as it is their stupid short term imbecile attitude typical of business men today, now has empty stadiums with player injuries echoing cacophonously throughout them.

They clung to pre-season games for revenue, so now that there isn't much they shouldn't be long for the game.

What does Goodell do?
Bascically collect bonus's and extensions off the success of the game others built. I haven't seen much evidence of him doing anything but harming the game, yet he collects on the popularity ESPN, Fox, NFL network and especially fantasy football that largely pushed the needle for him.

However, I would add now that not playing your starters is becoming the trend, Goodell and the NFL are losing the leverage they once had to let players out of the pre-season and add that international game. I think 10, or 5 years ago the players union would have jumped for it.

 

[baredown]

The were huge give-backs in the last CBA and the players' leverage is minimal. I think the owners will offer them something for more games but the fight will be over whether it's guaranteed money. The owners have been wanting to go to war ever since the dawn of free agency and they aren't afraid of a strike. The NFLPA might actually get more for the players by negotiating a longer season now than in the next CBA after 2020.

Disagree. The NFLPA actually has a lot of leverage, at least from the perspective of changes to the preseason/regular season/playoff structure. Nothing is going to change with that until the NFLPA agrees to it. Time works against the owners in terms of CBA negotiations, since it would undoubtedly take them at least a year to bid out additional regular season/playoff games to the networks. They can't run negotiations up to the current contract deadline without losing a year or more of the new broadcast revenues. The NFLPA isn't going to strike. The owners would have to lockout to force the issue, and that would be bad for the brand, especially since the owners would appear to be the greedy ones instead of the players. And as previously noted, continuing things under the terms of existing CBA into 2021 & beyond just preserves the current structure. The NFLPA seems to be in pretty good shape here...

 

[BradyJay]

I love the Bears current approach to the preseason. It's a lose lose situation. The same people bitching about starters not getting the necessary reps would be bitching if those same starters went down in a meaningless game. Why send them out there to play vanilla anyways?

 

[Starion]

You believe the owners will give up 32 dates of local ticket and concession sales fora few playoff games? How would that work? Add 2 wild cards teams (4 total) and now half the league is in the playoffs with some definite sub .500 teams making it. And that would just add 4 total games not an additional week Unless the plan would be to give the 1&2 seeds 2 weeks off. Where do the likes of Buffalo benefit from stadium revenue lost from the 2 home preseason games given up?

Yes it'a always better to play 1 less game and start further in but...

Giving top seeds 2 weeks off could be a DISadvantage in that teams get used to rhythm. This would actually be THREE weeks off. The single bye is a great chance to practice extra and rest up. Beyond that, it's too much time off. TBH, I don't know how the college teams do it when they sit for weeks and weeks before bowl games. Maybe I'm wrong here?

Here's what will happen IMO:

Option A: preseason reduced to 2 games. Regular season extended 2 games. Players get more money.

Option B: preseason eliminated. Regular season extended 2 games. Playoffs expanded. I don't know how they'd do this. They could add a 7 and 8 seed and then have 5-8 seeds play weekend 1. Get 3 and 4 seeds in round 2. Then 1 and 2 seeds in round 3. But that would mean a 2 week bye for the top two seeds. This is so complicated that I'd think they'll go with option A

Is 2 games enough to truly eval the fringe players and UDFAs? It's silly the league tries too hard to market preseason as more than practice/tryouts, but fans are starving for football so it is what it is. They can't complain that it's watered down though. Preseason seems to be an okay appetizer to me. 4 games is a but much though.

Should just be happy to sell what tickets & concessions they can, which I can't see them giving up without extra season or playoff games.

 

[Raskolnikov]

I still like the idea they floated a few months ago. Cut 2 preseason games. Every team them plays one out-of-country\overseas game, with the 2nd bye week immediately after this extra game.

Each team still has 8 home and 8 away games, an extra bye to recover, a shorter preseason, and a grestly expanded world NFL market. Win across the board, IMO...

I floated that several years ago

 

[HeHateMe]

I floated that several years ago

He would not know that. He only showed up last season from a lions board and probably has u on ignore by now anyway

 

[Bearfanuk]

I still like the idea they floated a few months ago. Cut 2 preseason games. Every team them plays one out-of-country\overseas game, with the 2nd bye week immediately after this extra game.

Each team still has 8 home and 8 away games, an extra bye to recover, a shorter preseason, and a grestly expanded world NFL market. Win across the board, IMO...

This sounds good. Everyone seems to win with these situation. Ownership growing their brand for more revenue must be appealing to them.

 

[baredown]

Is 2 games enough to truly eval the fringe players and UDFAs?

Well, ask yourself whether you feel the Bears know today what their 53 roster is going to be? My answer would be ‘yes’. The bottom 3-4 spots may be somewhat undecided, but those roster spots are going to be in continual churn throughout the season anyway. I doubt there are many NFL teams that don’t have a pretty firm handle on their regular season roster by now, and those that don’t probably won’t be much better off in two weeks...