Offseason rumors/discussion thread

beckdawg

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There were players like NL Most Valuable Player Award candidate Javier Baez, who took a big step forward regarding his offense. But Epstein said there were others who are trending in the opposite direction.

Pre---Post BA. Yep kinda tells a tale
Almora .319---.232
Heyward .285---.247
Russell .272---.198
Happ .256---.196
Schwarber .249---.221

Baez .292--..289
Rizzo .246--.329
Zobrist .285--.330
Bryant .280--.252

Doesn't really tell the whole story. Almora's 2nd half BABIP was .279. Russell's was .266. Happ's was .310. Heywards was .283. Schwarber's was .272. In other words, if everyone had a .300 BABIP, Almora's BA would be .253, Russell's would be .232, Happ would be .186, Heyward would be .264, Schwarber would be .249. With the exception of Happ and Russell, most of those aren't disastrously bad. Perhaps you argue Almora as well given his total lack of power but given that everyone in the org had that issue this year something else seems to be going on there.
 

chibears55

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I'm not going to hate on you like some for liking Happ. I get it. I don't have anything really against him myself. I prefer Schwarber to him but that's not because I think Happ is bad. I just really think Schwarber in his prime is going to be scary good.
2 reasons why I think Schwarber could be traded this offseason...

1. They sign Machado, he could play 3B and Bryant moves to LF

Or

2. They sign Harper and he plays LF with Heyward in RF
 

beckdawg

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Something i was thinking about tonight re: bullpen... I think we're looking at relievers wrong. There's guys you bring in at say the top of the 7th vs guys you bring in when shit hits the fan. Just because a guy is good at the top of the 7th doesn't mean he's a very good reliever for pitching with runners in scoring position. With that in mind I took a look at guys FIP with runners on. I used runners on as a stand in for RISP because relievers don't pitch much and when you limit their innings just to RISP it's even smaller sample.

Unsurprisingly Morrow was the best cubs reliever with runners on having a 2.25/2.29 ERA/FIP. Sort of surprising but when you see it not really was Chavez being #2 at 2.20/3.28. Strop was #3 at 3.68/3.33. Edwards was #4 at 5.56/3.43. And the only other reliever under 3.50 FIP was Wilson at 5.72/3.44. Interesting takeaway from this? Cishek with a clean inning.... 0.71/3.24 ERA/FIP. With runners on 3.94/3.69. Interesting takeaway #2? Carl Edwards with no one on had a 0.31/2.55 ERA/FIP.

Having seen this... i'm wondering if they would be better off just giving Cishek the 7th inning role with Edwards in the 8th and Morrow in the 9th and using Strop and presumably Chavez if he returns to pitch around trouble and anyone else in the pen to get from the 5th to the 7th.
 

beckdawg

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2 reasons why I think Schwarber could be traded this offseason...

1. They sign Machado, he could play 3B and Bryant moves to LF

Or

2. They sign Harper and he plays LF with Heyward in RF

I think you're trying to force this issue to be honest. Simply put starting heyward in CF vs RHP and sitting Schwarber vs most LHP solves this issue without you needing to trade him. You'd likely need to move Happ to make it work but as I've said all along I think you pick one of him or Schwarber and go from there. For me that's Schwarber and vs RHP you could easily go Schwarber/Heyward/Bryant-Harper and vs LHP you can go Bryant-Harper/Almora/Heyward. It's not a problem at all to make that happen and given the way Joe tends to rotate guys into the 400-500 PA range rather than 600 where they start nearly every game that style works better anyways than just parking a guy at one position all season.
 

Parade_Rain

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I think the context was scoring runs in general after the ASG. Getting Murphy did bluster it. Bote was over his head at .219. But in general you really see who was a asset and who was a hindrance and it lead to lower output.

Honestly they could retool LF/CF/RF right now.

Oh Contreras: .279-.200 I'm not making excuses but he played more games than anyone else.... Guess I'm bias.

It's a bit dramatic of a dropoff, but a catcher is never as healthy in the 2nd half as he is the first. I'm not too worried about Willy. He has a lot of heart. I think he will bounce back and have better power numbers, too. The backup role probably needs to be addressed by FO.
 

chibears55

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I think you're trying to force this issue to be honest. Simply put starting heyward in CF vs RHP and sitting Schwarber vs most LHP solves this issue without you needing to trade him. You'd likely need to move Happ to make it work but as I've said all along I think you pick one of him or Schwarber and go from there. For me that's Schwarber and vs RHP you could easily go Schwarber/Heyward/Bryant-Harper and vs LHP you can go Bryant-Harper/Almora/Heyward. It's not a problem at all to make that happen and given the way Joe tends to rotate guys into the 400-500 PA range rather than 600 where they start nearly every game that style works better anyways than just parking a guy at one position all season.
Thing is, he probably going to move more then just Happ if he one they move

I dont think Theo going to go into 2019 with basically the same group of hitters

I see 2 maybe 3 new additions to the lineup depending on If/who they sign Machado or Harper

plus a backup catcher
 

JP Hochbaum

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Here is the thing about Harper, you're essentially going to have to use Harper to replace Schwarber. Harper has definitely been the better player, but is he better enough to warrant using 200 or 300 million ro replace a guy still in arb years and very cheap? You'd have a hard time selling any GM on this.

Machado, on the other hand, replaces Russell, who can possibly never be seen in a Cubs uni again. And you're getting a SS, who can move to 3b, when someone like Rizzo moves on if his age and contract becomes cumbersome. You can move KB or Schwarber there in the future, or someone else not on the roster yet. Getting Machado gives you more flexibility and the WAR replacement at SS is much higher than what you get in a swap of Harper for Kyle.
 

fatbeard

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Here is the thing about Harper, you're essentially going to have to use Harper to replace Schwarber. Harper has definitely been the better player, but is he better enough to warrant using 200 or 300 million ro replace a guy still in arb years and very cheap? You'd have a hard time selling any GM on this.

Machado, on the other hand, replaces Russell, who can possibly never be seen in a Cubs uni again. And you're getting a SS, who can move to 3b, when someone like Rizzo moves on if his age and contract becomes cumbersome. You can move KB or Schwarber there in the future, or someone else not on the roster yet. Getting Machado gives you more flexibility and the WAR replacement at SS is much higher than what you get in a swap of Harper for Kyle.

Machado does not replace Russell. He played 3B almost exclusively since he came up until playing mostly SS this year, and he was bad. -12 DRS and -6.9 UZR/150 are not something you want at SS given the defensive importance of that position. If the Cubs sign Machado and lose Russell, Baez will stay at SS while Machado plays 3B and Bryant moves to LF.
 

JP Hochbaum

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Machado does not replace Russell. He played 3B almost exclusively since he came up until playing mostly SS this year, and he was bad. -12 DRS and -6.9 UZR/150 are not something you want at SS given the defensive importance of that position. If the Cubs sign Machado and lose Russell, Baez will stay at SS while Machado plays 3B and Bryant moves to LF.

I didn't say he was better than Russell in the field, we definitely lose out there. But Ill take -DRS for the gain in WRC that we get for his bat.
 

kapooncha

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Machado does not replace Russell. He played 3B almost exclusively since he came up until playing mostly SS this year, and he was bad. -12 DRS and -6.9 UZR/150 are not something you want at SS given the defensive importance of that position. If the Cubs sign Machado and lose Russell, Baez will stay at SS while Machado plays 3B and Bryant moves to LF.

And who plays 2nd? Happ? No thanks.
 

TC in Mississippi

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Machado does not replace Russell. He played 3B almost exclusively since he came up until playing mostly SS this year, and he was bad. -12 DRS and -6.9 UZR/150 are not something you want at SS given the defensive importance of that position. If the Cubs sign Machado and lose Russell, Baez will stay at SS while Machado plays 3B and Bryant moves to LF.

Machado improved throughout the season. He was the 20th best SS in Def according to Fangraphs for the first half and 7th in the second half. Is he great there? No, but the offense is worth the dropoff. Harper means moving Heyward to CF or trading Schwarber, either of which I'm OK with at this point but the WAR advantage is not worth $350 mil. Just my opinion.
 

beckdawg

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Thing is, he probably going to move more then just Happ if he one they move

I dont think Theo going to go into 2019 with basically the same group of hitters

I see 2 maybe 3 new additions to the lineup depending on If/who they sign Machado or Harper

plus a backup catcher

I don't think he has a choice. They are already by my rough figures going to be around $210 mil in payroll before you add in FA. And while i'm certain they go over the luxury tax there's a second threshold which really hurts teams that hit it. If you assume Machado gets $30 mil a year the cubs are going to be right up against that and there's not a ton they can do to save money.
 

chibears55

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I don't think he has a choice. They are already by my rough figures going to be around $210 mil in payroll before you add in FA. And while i'm certain they go over the luxury tax there's a second threshold which really hurts teams that hit it. If you assume Machado gets $30 mil a year the cubs are going to be right up against that and there's not a ton they can do to save money.
I saw something too from the cubs writer, that both Schwarber and Happ could be the ones moved ..
 

beckdawg

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I saw something too from the cubs writer, that both Schwarber and Happ could be the ones moved ..

Wasn't the way I took the article. I think the intent was that if someone is going to move it's one of those two not both.
 

chibears55

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Wasn't the way I took the article. I think the intent was that if someone is going to move it's one of those two not both.
https://twitter.com/BleacherNation/status/1048266397879558146?s=19

But Gonzales, who has been on the Cubs beat for a good long while now, also points to Kyle Schwarber and Ian Happ as likely to depart. I’ll let you head to the Tribune to read Gonzales’s rationale there, as well as his take on the rest of the roster.


I see AND not OR
 

Parade_Rain

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I didn't say he was better than Russell in the field, we definitely lose out there. But Ill take -DRS for the gain in WRC that we get for his bat.
The pitching staff arms/pitch counts would likely prefer the DRS though. ;)
 
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TC in Mississippi

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https://twitter.com/BleacherNation/status/1048266397879558146?s=19

But Gonzales, who has been on the Cubs beat for a good long while now, also points to Kyle Schwarber and Ian Happ as likely to depart. I’ll let you head to the Tribune to read Gonzales’s rationale there, as well as his take on the rest of the roster.


I see AND not OR

Yes, and I agree with Gonzales but they aren't giving Schwarber away. Happ is young enough to fetch something but it won't be a ton, Addi will likely have to be non-tendered although if anyone could move him in trade it's Theo and Schwarber has the best trade value of the three. I'd say that all three could very well be gone, but it wouldn't surprise me if Schwarber stays depending on what they do in FA. Personally, I love the kid and think that special player is still there but I'd move him for another hitter preferably a CF. Then I sign Machado and Michael Brantley. He's not a WAR increase over Kyle but he strikes out only 9% of the time and gets on base 36% of the time. He's also a better fielder, although Kyle improved a ton there this year. If you could tell me that Ender Inciarte would get his OBP back up he'd be a nice trade target and Atlanta wants Acuna there long term, but I'm not sure those numbers will regress to the mean. They should, but who knows. There are deals to be made and FA that can help. I want zero part of Harper but Machado would really breathe some life into this team IMO.
 

beckdawg

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https://twitter.com/BleacherNation/status/1048266397879558146?s=19

But Gonzales, who has been on the Cubs beat for a good long while now, also points to Kyle Schwarber and Ian Happ as likely to depart. I’ll let you head to the Tribune to read Gonzales’s rationale there, as well as his take on the rest of the roster.


I see AND not OR

He also has Chavez on likely to part when Chavez literally said he's either going to play for the cubs next year or retire..... so I wouldn't put that much faith in this.
 

beckdawg

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Yes, and I agree with Gonzales but they aren't giving Schwarber away. Happ is young enough to fetch something but it won't be a ton, Addi will likely have to be non-tendered although if anyone could move him in trade it's Theo and Schwarber has the best trade value of the three. I'd say that all three could very well be gone, but it wouldn't surprise me if Schwarber stays depending on what they do in FA. Personally, I love the kid and think that special player is still there but I'd move him for another hitter preferably a CF. Then I sign Machado and Michael Brantley. He's not a WAR increase over Kyle but he strikes out only 9% of the time and gets on base 36% of the time. He's also a better fielder, although Kyle improved a ton there this year. If you could tell me that Ender Inciarte would get his OBP back up he'd be a nice trade target and Atlanta wants Acuna there long term, but I'm not sure those numbers will regress to the mean. They should, but who knows. There are deals to be made and FA that can help. I want zero part of Harper but Machado would really breathe some life into this team IMO.

Problem I have with this is you're taking more payroll on and I'm not sure you're substantially improving. Like you wanna bring on Machado i'm all for that. I think that's a huge offensive impact at one of the worst positions the cubs had last year. Brantley is going to be 32 and the past 3 years combined he's been a 115 wRC+ hitter which is identical to the 115 Schwarber put up this year. Sure they are entirely different kind of hitters but the point there is the impact you're getting isn't really there. And Schwarber could finally break out next year making this conversation look even more silly.

I just don't see how the cubs are getting better removing Schwarber from their team. He's basically a top 60 hitter in baseball with enormous potential. If you're going for an upgrade IMO it's 3 positions. CF, C and SS. Now when I say C I don't think you fuck with Contreras too much but I'd bring in someone behind him that's better than Caratini. The cubs got a 85 tOPS+ out of C last year which other than pitchers was the worst position on the team. SS was second worst at 99 and keep in mind that's WITH Baez playing there quite a bit. CF is 104. 3B is 107 but that's mostly Bryant not playing. RF is 112, LF is 112, 2B is 121 and 1B is 123.

Solving SS is easy if you sign Machado. Solving CF is harder. I mentioned the idea of Fowler before. But other than him I don't see a lot of CF who can hit who are getting traded. Maybe Tommy Pham? Either way, that's where I'm putting my effort not trying to ditch Schwarber. I do think you have some leverage to potentially move Heyward to CF more and look for a RF. That was the idea behind Adam Eaton for say Happ and Monty I mentioned previously. However, I don't think the cubs have unlimited money as I mentioned before.

They are already on the hook for Heyward($20 mil), Lester($27.5 mil), Darvish($20 mil), Zobrist($12.5 mil), Chatwood($12.5), Morrow($9 mil), Rizzo($11.286), Cishek($6.5), Smyly($7), and Duensing($3.5). That's a combined $130 mil. When you bring in the guys likely with options, Hamels($20 mil), Quintana($10.5), Kintzler has a $10 team option which I assume they decline but a $5 mil player option I think he takes, Strop($6.25) and that combines to another $41.75 mil or roughly $171.5 mil before you even talk about arb. I'd estimate the cubs end up owing at least $40 mil in arb most of which goes to Hendricks and Bryant but you also have Baez and Schwarber both being first year eligible. So that would put you at $211.5 mil. Presumably Machado's getting around $30 mil a year and Harper likely will too.

The problem is last year if you spent more than $237 mil your first draft pick was lowered 10 spots on top of paying a 42.5-45% surcharge tax on top of the normal luxury tax. So, trading Schwarber who's going to still be relatively cheap to sign a FA who's not doesn't make sense in that regard either.
 

anotheridiot

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I just think Schwarber needs regular at bats. He will not get them under Maddon and on this roster. I still think the easy fix is giving Schwarber a pitcher and let him catch one game a week, best case, make him the backup since Wilson catches too much as it is. That was the plan when he got clipped by Fowler running to left field the first fucking week of the season. Schwarber was going to get Hammel.

Those are regular at bats where you are not benching him for Happ or Bryant in left. I also think him watching 150 pitches a game will help his hitting.

Since that is not going to happen, he should be DH'ing in the Al and playing left a few days a week. From the day he was drafted I said we drafted a DH. Too bad it got shot down in the NL.

I think part of the rift with Theo and Joe has alot to do with that. Also, not playing Almora enough when he was hitting .300. Allow Happ to play 2B with Zo and Bote, with Bote backing up Short and third and reward Baez SS since you will not reward him with leadoff, like on the all star teams he played on.

This team already has 12 everyday players, bringing in more does not fix everything.
 

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