Power vs Zone

[Chris Sojka]

Why does power suddenly work after it was abandoned so many years ago? Why do teams that run zone seem to be a gimmick instead of commited zone run teams?

The answer quite simply is personnel.

Zone - In the zone scheme you have multiple possibilites for a running lane to open up and are expecting your RB to see it and hit it hard and come up with some solid yards. The problem though is that Linebackers are more fluid and agile and built to cover sideline to sideline. To simply get there before the play sets up and stop things before they start. You are betting on 3 things from your running back in a zone run, he's explosive, he's agile, and he's got great vision. The problem, is that linebackers are a solid enough athletically to recover and attack the runner sometimes before he sees his lane. This is how the NFL defenses are built.

Power - the power run game depends on 1 on 1 matchups. As an offensive player you hsve the advantage of only having to attack while they read and react to the play. It's you vs your guy.

The 1st one on ones are in the trenches. If the linemen win it's a 2-3 yard gain minimum. If they don't its a 1 yard loss or no gain.

The 2nd matchup is the linebackers and the TEs or FB. If the line loses and the linebackers beat the TE or FB in their one on one it's stopped for around a 3 - 7 yard gain. If the linebacker gets beat by the FB or TE this means the safety is coming down to make the tackle. And you could get anywhere from 8-15 yards depending on how deep the safeties play and how quick they read the play.

The 3rd matchup is the safety vs the RB. If all goes well in the trenches and we can get a linebacker out of position. We have a RB full steam in the hole against a safety. If the runner is powerful and agile enough he can turn this play from 8-15 into 40+. The NFL safety is not built to take on sownhill runners anymore. All the recent ones that could are extremely valuable. Think Cam Chancellor.

So when you get a 220 - 240lb rb in space at full speed 1 on 1 downhill against a 205lb safety enough times youre going to win that matchup 80% of the time. Either because the safety takes a bad angle or he simply cant tackle him.

The zone run has most likely reached the end of its success cycle in the NFL.

 

[dennehy]

Ridiculous.

 

[modo]

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id...est-rushing-teams-why-zone-blocking-here-stay

The Baltimore Ravens' unique scheme tailored around quarterback Lamar Jackson has attracted most of the attention, but the more widespread trend is a resurrection of the zone-blocking concept popularized by the mid-1990s Denver Broncos.

And let's not overlook the San Francisco 49ers, who have deployed the NFL's best rushing offense outside of Baltimore and are using zone blocking on 55% of their run plays.

 

[sevvy]

I prefer the run scheme the Chicago Bears employ known as "Was that my man?" also known as, "Shit, we ran into each other and fell down"

 

[PolarBear]

The recent success of the power running game is a product of the NFL transitioning to smaller personnel to try and combat the high octane passing offenses.

Less big nose tackles, smaller LB's, smaller safeties, more nickel packages.

 

[Chris Sojka]

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id...est-rushing-teams-why-zone-blocking-here-stay

The Baltimore Ravens' unique scheme tailored around quarterback Lamar Jackson has attracted most of the attention, but the more widespread trend is a resurrection of the zone-blocking concept popularized by the mid-1990s Denver Broncos.

And let's not overlook the San Francisco 49ers, who have deployed the NFL's best rushing offense outside of Baltimore and are using zone blocking on 55% of their run plays.

Looking at San Francisco run looked very straight forward power run. Im not saying zone run dosen't have its place with mobile QBs. But the 3rd and short TD looked like a pure power run. Baltimore's run game outside of Jackson didn't hit many home runs. And when Jackson is running he is either scrambling or following a lead blocker. The Tennessee Titans put that tape on and did a little homework and the rest is history. Their gameplan was simple. Dont cross the LOS and let him beat you through the air.

The zone run seems to be more of a test, than actually taking shots at them. 49ers also passed the ball 9 times. They have a very run diverse offense but also a run first offense. Simply put i dont think it can be your identity. Also Green Bay has the worst run defense in the league by far.

Zone running didn't just make a comeback. Dont know wtf this writer is saying. Its been around for a long time and teams have run it a ton in the last decade. Just because QBs like Brady didn't doesnt mean it hasnt been tried with a bunch of different QBs and offenses. We have a ton of mobile QBs and it might suit the entire offense better to zone read and zone run but for the most part it's still a gimmicky style.

If you can run the ball 50 times a game and score 35 points it says more about personnel and coaching than simply scheme. Do you really believe the zone run can work without a stacked offensive line, the best blocking TE in Kittle. 3 RBs splitting carries and WRs who are willing blockers for 50 plays a game?

Im not saying it won't work anywhere or not at all. I'm saying you have to build an entire offense to run it and stick to running the ball while mixing the run design to keep defenses honest.

 

[Chris Sojka]

The recent success of the power running game is a product of the NFL transitioning to smaller personnel to try and combat the high octane passing offenses.

Less big nose tackles, smaller LB's, smaller safeties, more nickel packages.

The Packers are a 75% Nickel team. They see our QBs and HCs and said, they are gonna throw it 50 times. They won the division because they built there lineup to win the division. Not to win a superbowl. They're favorites to win it next year as well. Nagy seems stuck on running his offense regardless of success and the Packers will be in nickel ready for all of it.

Polar Bear... Henry, Lynch, Blount. Paired with a solid QB and you're in title games. These guys move sticks and soften defenses. I could see Tenessee getting back there next year too.

 

[PolarBear]

The Packers are a 75% Nickel team. They see our QBs and HCs and said, they are gonna throw it 50 times. They won the division because they built there lineup to win the division. Not to win a superbowl. They're favorites to win it next year as well. Nagy seems stuck on running his offense regardless of success and the Packers will be in nickel ready for all of it.

Polar Bear... Henry, Lynch, Blount. Paired with a solid QB and you're in title games. These guys move sticks and soften defenses. I could see Tenessee getting back there next year too.

The offensive line has more to do with it than the RB themselves IMO. The fact that the Bears can't run on a nickel defense with safeties in a cover two shell is absolutely ridiculous.

 

[Adipost]

Are you really making a case for zone blocking being dead literally one day after the best zone running team in the NFL just won the NFC Championship game? Zone running is THE staple of Shanahan’s offense.

 

[fenderpfunk]

You wanna talk about power running? How about Tarik Cohen running straight through 10 or 11 guys? Of course those are the opposing teams reserves, coaching staff, and trainers all of whom are standing on the sideline - but still those guys want no part of our east west running game - believe that.

 

[Starion]

If alluding to SF scheme, I see their run success as personnel knowing and willing to execute at a high level consistently. EVERYONE blocked and did it well. No screw up mental mistakes and/or poor form (Bears).

Scheme comes after those prereqs. I love all the "Bears can follow the TEN plan to success". Hell no. Not with this roster unless coaches have magic wands and Senzu beans a plenty.

 

[Mdbearz]

Looking at San Francisco run looked very straight forward power run. Im not saying zone run dosen't have its place with mobile QBs. But the 3rd and short TD looked like a pure power run. Baltimore's run game outside of Jackson didn't hit many home runs. And when Jackson is running he is either scrambling or following a lead blocker. The Tennessee Titans put that tape on and did a little homework and the rest is history. Their gameplan was simple. Dont cross the LOS and let him beat you through the air.

The zone run seems to be more of a test, than actually taking shots at them. 49ers also passed the ball 9 times. They have a very run diverse offense but also a run first offense. Simply put i dont think it can be your identity. Also Green Bay has the worst run defense in the league by far.

Zone running didn't just make a comeback. Dont know wtf this writer is saying. Its been around for a long time and teams have run it a ton in the last decade. Just because QBs like Brady didn't doesnt mean it hasnt been tried with a bunch of different QBs and offenses. We have a ton of mobile QBs and it might suit the entire offense better to zone read and zone run but for the most part it's still a gimmicky style.

If you can run the ball 50 times a game and score 35 points it says more about personnel and coaching than simply scheme. Do you really believe the zone run can work without a stacked offensive line, the best blocking TE in Kittle. 3 RBs splitting carries and WRs who are willing blockers for 50 plays a game?

Im not saying it won't work anywhere or not at all. I'm saying you have to build an entire offense to run it and stick to running the ball while mixing the run design to keep defenses honest.

Just a note on the Ravens,

The offensive coordinator screwed up the game against the Titans, he completely abandoned the run game that had worked all season long when they were trailing by only 10 points.

BTW, Jackson was not the only runner on that team, they had Mark Ingram that rushed for over 1,000 yards Larmar ran for 1200 and a third RB, Gus Edwards ran for over 700 yards.

The biggest mistake they made against the Titans was they left Ingram in the game even though he was hurt, (Edwards is a powerful RB also), and completely got away from the run in the second half.

 

[BearDownZZ]

Almost every team runs a variations of power, inside zone and outside zone. However, teams tend to either feature power, inside zone or outside zone. You can run lead or single back in either scheme. You can run behind center or shotgun with both schemes. However, most outside zone will run under center and most inside zone teams run out of shotgun as their base play often ran on 1st and 10 or 2nd and mid.

The 49ers, Rams, Vikings, Falcons, Packers, Redskins, Titans feature the outside zone scheme (wide gap zone). Its the scheme the Shanahan / Alex Gibbs Broncos made famous in the 90's. Its predicated on OL sprinting out into the boundary with spacing and cut blocking (though rules changed a bit to what they could do in the 90s).

The Bears, Chiefs, Eagles, Jaguars run mostly inside zone RPO with a lone setback next to QB with a draw play handoff in front of the QB. But with inside zone, the QB has to read it well and you have to hurt teams that come in and stack the box. The Chiefs and Eagles run the same thing. They are generally better at running it because 1. QB is better at running it 2. Good passing game that threatens defense. 3. Good TE's. Certainly a bit better OL but I think its more than that.

Nagy with Chiefs and Alex Smith had some very good seasons featuring inside zone with a top 10 run game with some of the highest YPC for running backs. Chiefs, Eagles have been top running teams with inside zone, so the scheme can work.

We ran outside with John Fox and mostly same OL with Jordan Howard ran well with a high ypc average.

 

[Bears4Ever_34]

The Shanahan run scheme has worked every where it's been implemented. It worked in Denver, it worked in Washington, it worked in Atlanta, it worked in HOU (with Kubiak), it worked in MIN (with Kubiak), and it works in SF.

The Bears ran a version of zone blocking with Gase, and it worked pretty damn well until Nagy got here and changed everything.

 

[Warrior Spirit]

Are you really making a case for zone blocking being dead literally one day after the best zone running team in the NFL just won the NFC Championship game? Zone running is THE staple of Shanahan’s offense.

My first thought as well. Knew OP didn't know football very well but he seems even more clueless than I thought.

 

[Chris Sojka]

Are you really making a case for zone blocking being dead literally one day after the best zone running team in the NFL just won the NFC Championship game? Zone running is THE staple of Shanahan’s offense.

"Was" the staple of his offense and there was an adjustment made in the beginning of the year if you dont recall. In fact he said he moved away from his gameplan to better suit his team. Which was the addition of power running.



In fact it was all over the place and it was mentioned multiple times on this forum when comparong nagy to the 9ers

 

[Warrior Spirit]

"Was" the staple of his offense and there was an adjustment made in the beginning of the year if you dont recall. In fact he said he moved away from his gameplan to better suit his team. Which was the addition of power running.



In fact it was all over the place and it was mentioned multiple times on this forum when comparong nagy to the 9ers

Hahaha. You may be the only one on earth who doesn't know the Niners and Shanahan do not use a zone blocking run scheme. He merely uses the FB, Juszczyk, as an extra blocker. Power running not their thing. Their backs are built for speed not power.

 

[Chris Sojka]

Hahaha. You may be the only one on earth who doesn't know the Niners and Shanahan do not use a zone blocking run scheme. He merely uses the FB, Juszczyk, as an extra blocker. Power running not their thing. Their backs are built for speed not power.

I know he does. I know when things werent working last year they changed things. Go do your research he balanced the run and irs the FB TE thst make his offense go. Those are elements of a power run game.

Every play is technically a zone run that doesnt go right. You fucking dope.

 

[Warrior Spirit]

I know he does. I know when things werent working last year they changed things. Go do your research he balanced the run and irs the FB TE thst make his offense go. Those are elements of a power run game.

Every play is technically a zone run that doesnt go right. You fucking dope.

?Your ignorant clumsy way of backtracking makes you look even more football Special person.

 

[BearDownZZ]

FB's or any lead blocker are used commonly in outside zone going back to Howard Griffith in Denver (though they ran a ton of 12 personnel). Shanahan and his predecessors have always used a fullback.

They are known for leading the NFL in FB snaps and producing pro bowl fullbacks Leach, Dimarco and Juszczyk.