Quietly the cubs front office has assembled some interesting bullpen pieces.

beckdawg

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People know I'm a stats guy. So, I was digging into them just looking at bullpen guys and suffice to say I was pleasantly surprised. Historically the cubs under theo and company haven't been that obsessed with k/9. That seems to have changed in the past year or two because jesus they have brought in a lot of really high k/9 guys. They also appear to love SD pitchers. After 2018, they traded Vosler to SD to nab Wick who was gonna be left off their 40 man for the rule 5. Wick wasn't a huge k/9 guy prior(high 8's). However, cubs apparently saw something and fixed his grip on a pitch. That netted a 11.31 k/9 in 35 innings at AAA last year and earned him a call up where he was fantastic albeit with his k/9 dropping to 9.45.

At the deadline they traded Edwards in what kind of appears to be a salary dump for Nick/giving up on edwards. At the time I was kinda down on it as the return was just another reliever. But as I dug into the stats a but I noticed Wieck had killer k/9's and was a lefty where the cubs have struggled to find in the bullpen. He had a 45/9 k/bb ratio in AAA in 23.1 innings split between SD and chicago's AAA affiliates. That's a 17.36 k/9 a 3.47 bb/9. His main issue has been HRs. In his 24.2 IP in SD he had a 2.55 HR/9 rate. However in his 10 innings in chicago that dropped to 0.90. So, it's plausible that they figured something out but that 16.20 k/9 he also had in chicago is FILTHY. I'm sure it will come down some but there's only 5 lefties in the majors over 13 k/9(Hader, Chapman, Will Smith, Felipe Vazquez, and Brad Hand). He's a guy who could break out big next year.

This offseason, they drafted Trevor Megill in the rule 5 draft from SD. He had a 12.70 k/9 in 50.1 innings in AAA. He appears to have been unlucky with a .411 BABIP hurting his ERA but looks like he was also their high leverage guy in AAA as he had near the top in saves for them. He looks to me like he might be a better version of Wick based on the stats he's posted.

On top of raiding SD's upper minor relievers, they've also re-signed Morrow. I mean I don't need to say much here. If Morrow is healthy he's been dominant. So, he could be a really big set up guy which is also interesting because if the cubs do go through trading Bryant or whoever, they might be in a trade position in july in which case Morrow could be a really interesting cheap dominant reliever for someone to give up some prospects for.

Like Morrow, they re-signed Hultzen today. A lot of what I said about Wieck applies to him. Thing with Hultzen is had injuries not derailed him he probably would have been an ace level starter based on his minor numbers. It wouldn't shock me at all if those to make the lefty side of the bullpen really interesting in ST.

So, those are 5 guys the cubs pretty much paid nothing for who are very interesting. You add in Kyle Ryan who was a dependable lefty specialist last year and you're at 6. Kimbrel makes 7. Your long guy is still open. For my money I'm hoping they trade Chatwood to a starter needy team and clear some cap room and have Alzolay/Mills fight for #5/long reliever spots respectively. If that happens you're at 8 guys.

Given the uncertainty of some of these guys it'd be nice to bring back a dependable guy like Cishek with the money you can hopefully save on Chatwood. But, the main thing i want to get across here is while it's not the most glamorous offseason thus far for relievers, the cubs have a lot of interesting bullpen talent.
 

CSF77

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Cubs have been getting their new guys using a knuckle curve grip. Kimbrel taught it to Darvish also.
 

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The fascination with San Diego is likely familiarity.
 

anotheridiot

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probably just means the guys that took a step last year in Wick and Wieck will start the year in the minors.
 

CSF77

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I see the pen as

CL Kimbrel
SU Wick
SU Ryan


Mills and Rae have no minor league options. They should be long relief. Chatwood should get the 5.

Rest will be in a battle in ST for a role. Underwood has the edge. Wieck showed promise from the left.

The new guys are just battling for a spot also.
 

zack54attack

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I see the pen as

CL Kimbrel
SU Wick
SU Ryan


Mills and Rae have no minor league options. They should be long relief. Chatwood should get the 5.

Rest will be in a battle in ST for a role. Underwood has the edge. Wieck showed promise from the left.

The new guys are just battling for a spot also.

I’m fine with that for now. I like the small bullpen moves they have made so far.
 

CSF77

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I’m fine with that for now. I like the small bullpen moves they have made so far.

I like the flex pen also. Gives opertunity for a extra starter (Alozay) set up (Underwood) etc.

They should have the basics though.

Closer
2 set up
2 multi inning arms.

Rest should be flex depending on who they are matching up against
 

anotheridiot

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I see the pen as

CL Kimbrel
SU Wick
SU Ryan


Mills and Rae have no minor league options. They should be long relief. Chatwood should get the 5.

Rest will be in a battle in ST for a role. Underwood has the edge. Wieck showed promise from the left.

The new guys are just battling for a spot also.

I cant agree with this with the new system. Ryan was good against lefties, like .226/.291, but against righties they hit .256/.353 on base. Both sides hit over .300BABIP off him and we know he is not a big strike out guy (only like 2:1) Definitely was better at home, that .256/.363 were his numbers on the road combined. I highly doubt he will be able to get in games to just face lefties, if he does it would be third out, that cant be your set up guy.
 

CSF77

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I cant agree with this with the new system. Ryan was good against lefties, like .226/.291, but against righties they hit .256/.353 on base. Both sides hit over .300BABIP off him and we know he is not a big strike out guy (only like 2:1) Definitely was better at home, that .256/.363 were his numbers on the road combined. I highly doubt he will be able to get in games to just face lefties, if he does it would be third out, that cant be your set up guy.


Ryan was already in that role with Wick. I wouldn't look at anyone else for the job.

Well unless Morrow is healthy and 100% dominate again. Then the pen becomes shut down.

Underwood looked pretty good also and I do feel that he will win a spot outright.

Alozay really needs a full season at Iowa to prove that he is durable.
 

CSF77

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Given the uncertainty of some of these guys it'd be nice to bring back a dependable guy like Cishek with the money you can hopefully save on Chatwood. But, the main thing i want to get across here is while it's not the most glamorous offseason thus far for relievers, the cubs have a lot of interesting bullpen talent.


This part I believe they have already addressed with the minor moves this off season.

To be frank. This off-season has sucked and Theo has failed to back up what he says with actions.

All this off has amounted to is a manager change over which has lowered over head and then signed some scrap heap arms that maybe something comes out of it.

Bad showing 2nd year in a row. They are a worse team than the end of the season.
 

CSF77

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And to be strait.

My main issue this off season is a clear lack of direction.

Compete

Or reload.

What they are doing are motions that have no direction behind them.
 

Chicagosports89

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And to be strait.

My main issue this off season is a clear lack of direction.

Compete

Or reload.

What they are doing are motions that have no direction behind them.
The offseason isn’t over. There will be trades made. Trades like the cubs will make have to be made after the major free agents on the market have signed
 

CSF77

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The offseason isn’t over. There will be trades made. Trades like the cubs will make have to be made after the major free agents on the market have signed


Well we hope.

To be honest this is just a repeat. Biggest move might end up Morrow just turning out healthy.

As far as any moves go. They are 6 mil over 208 I believe. And I really believe that Q will end up traded. They have Chatwood to replace him and Chatwood would be in position to build up mid season trade value.

So my idea is trade Q. Start Chatwood to build up his trade value.

The #5 make it a 2 person battle. Mills and Rae. Winner starts. Loser middle relief.

Alozay build up arm strength in AAA and promote mid season.

But I would be building up the next wave of talent via the rotation.

Abbott and Alozay should be in AAA at the start of the season and we could see them soon. Marquez I'm expecting the following year. So if that is the plan and all we are seeing is a Mulligan right now? I'm good with it.
 

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Cubs have been getting their new guys using a knuckle curve grip. Kimbrel taught it to Darvish also.
Interesting. How do we know this? Wasn’t Burt Hooten the master of that pitch?
 

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This part I believe they have already addressed with the minor moves this off season.

To be frank. This off-season has sucked and Theo has failed to back up what he says with actions.

All this off has amounted to is a manager change over which has lowered over head and then signed some scrap heap arms that maybe something comes out of it.

Bad showing 2nd year in a row. They are a worse team than the end of the season.
I just joined and do not want to start out negative. But, I do not see a play off level starting 5. Does anyone else?
 

CSF77

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I just joined and do not want to start out negative. But, I do not see a play off level starting 5. Does anyone else?

Not at all.

Yu had a great 2nd half. I believe that he can sustain it and push a 2.5-3.5 ERA which is 1 or 2 SP quality.

Hendricks it really depends on which guy gets on the mound that day. When he is locating and mixing in his curve he is unhittable. Other days he is unwatchable.

Lester is over the hill. He is a competitive person so you can give him 12 wins based off of experience. But he is not a draft day darling.

Q makes the most sense to trade if they want to clear a chunk under tax. They are 2 over and flipping Q for 2 mid tier non prospect types gets them 8 mil under tax. Then they can back fill with Mills or Rae and have some room to add if the team is close.

But in general I see this as a 81 win team. I expect to see some trades going out in June-July. That is my feeling on the state of the team.
 

Castor76

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I just joined and do not want to start out negative. But, I do not see a play off level starting 5. Does anyone else?

The expectations are not of a playoff caliber rotation. So unless someone really surprises with performance this year, I don't see it. That said, hoe many teams really have a rotation like that? Nats and Dodgers, sure. Who else in the NL really has one?
 

anotheridiot

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Not at all.

Yu had a great 2nd half. I believe that he can sustain it and push a 2.5-3.5 ERA which is 1 or 2 SP quality.

Hendricks it really depends on which guy gets on the mound that day. When he is locating and mixing in his curve he is unhittable. Other days he is unwatchable.

Lester is over the hill. He is a competitive person so you can give him 12 wins based off of experience. But he is not a draft day darling.

Q makes the most sense to trade if they want to clear a chunk under tax. They are 2 over and flipping Q for 2 mid tier non prospect types gets them 8 mil under tax. Then they can back fill with Mills or Rae and have some room to add if the team is close.

But in general I see this as a 81 win team. I expect to see some trades going out in June-July. That is my feeling on the state of the team.
My trouble with Yu from the beginning was, boy was he bad in the post season. That made me want Jake back over Darvish and who knows what might have happened. Jake lost some physical stuff, but I think more of his problems were mental being the true Ace here for so long and getting kicked to the curb. I understood him wanting to go because he was always put as number 2 after Lester, but I think the one thing that is not changing with Rossy is Lester is still going to be treated like the Ace. He has that bulldog that needs to get thru the locker room, not turn hippie.
 

CSF77

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My trouble with Yu from the beginning was, boy was he bad in the post season. That made me want Jake back over Darvish and who knows what might have happened. Jake lost some physical stuff, but I think more of his problems were mental being the true Ace here for so long and getting kicked to the curb. I understood him wanting to go because he was always put as number 2 after Lester, but I think the one thing that is not changing with Rossy is Lester is still going to be treated like the Ace. He has that bulldog that needs to get thru the locker room, not turn hippie.


Maybe.

I feel that the Cubs lack a pitcher that can match up with the top league aces. Yu and Hendricks when they are on can both shut teams down. But it is the consistency that is lacking.

We will see.
 

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