The 2020 Personnel Discussion: Offense

[remydat]

Extending players early is always beneficial to the cap. The open market can throw everything out of wack.

No it isnt. You can extend a guy early and then they dont deliver in which case it is wasted money. Would anyone sign Massie now for what he got? Of course not.

Another year is more data and that data could increase or decrease value.

 

[modo]

You claimed I was punishing him. It is not punishment for a guy to fulfill the contract he signed. See Fuller.

You said you would deny any player an extension because the team did not make the playoffs...

I say it would be stupid to punish a player or even shoot your own team in the foot by losing out on salary cap by not extending a worthy player simply because the team didn't make the playoffs.

 

[modo]

No it isnt. You can extend a guy early and then they dont deliver in which case it is wasted money. Would anyone sign Massie now for what he got? Of course not.

Another year is more data and that data could increase or decrease value.

that massie signing helped allow the HHCD signing...

yes it was worth it.

 

[Chicagosports89]

So you have the Bears cutting or letting go their starting S, CB2, ILB, OLB, slot WR, RG plus a high-end backup ILB. LOL good luck actually improving the team with the holes you just blew open on the roster.

To be fair the team has already improved with the RG and slot WR injured. OLB and CB can easily be replaced at the money we wouldn’t be paying for them. S and ILB would have to be addressed, but we’d have some money or draft picks there

 

[WindyCity]

No it isnt. You can extend a guy early and then they dont deliver in which case it is wasted money. Would anyone sign Massie now for what he got? Of course not.

Another year is more data and that data could increase or decrease value.

It is also assuming more risk.

Robinson is a low risk in terms of on field, so why take the financial risk?

 

[modo]

No it isnt. You can extend a guy early and then they dont deliver in which case it is wasted money. Would anyone sign Massie now for what he got? Of course not.

Another year is more data and that data could increase or decrease value.

if just wait for more data every year, you'd never sign anyone....at some point you have to pull the trigger. That trigger will allow a cheaper deal with more space. You'd always wind up competing with 31 other teams for free agents by waiting after their final year

 

[Chicagosports89]

The argument about not resigning guys because of team performance or because said player might not perform in the future might be the most stupid thing I have seen on here in a while.

 

[remydat]

You said you would deny any player an extension because the team did not make the playoffs...

I say it would be stupid to punish a player or even shoot your own team in the foot by losing out on salary cap by not extending a worthy player simply because the team didn't make the playoffs.

And I say again it is not punishment as they are not entitled to an extension. It is fine if you disagree but words have meaning.

I didnt say I would not extend someone simply for not making playoffs. This team underperformed. If we were not good enough to make the playoffs but exceeded their actual talent level then that is fine. But this particularly team failed to live up to their talent level.

As for ARob he is doing what he was paid to do. He performed as expected. He did not exceed expectations so I have no reason to jump at extending him.

In most workplaces you reward people for exceeding expectations not merely meeting them. ARob was paid to be a 1k yard WR. He did not put up 1400 yards or something ridiculous where he needs to be rewarded over and above the 14 milliom he will collect.

 

[remydat]

if just wait for more data every year, you'd never sign anyone....at some point you have to pull the trigger. That trigger will allow a cheaper deal with more space. You'd always wind up competing with 31 other teams for free agents by waiting after their final year

Yeah and I pull the trigger when the contract is up unless the person exceeded expectations.

 

[WindyCity]

And I say again it is not punishment as they are not entitled to an extension. It is fine if you disagree but words have meaning.

I didnt say I would not extend someone simply for not making playoffs. This team underperformed. If we were not good enough to make the playoffs but exceeded their actual talent level then that is fine. But this particularly team failed to live up to their talent level.

As for ARob he is doing what he was paid to do. He performed as expected. He did not exceed expectations so I have no reason to jump at extending him.

In most workplaces you reward people for exceeding expectations not merely meeting them. ARob was paid to be a 1k yard WR. He did not put up 1400 yards or something ridiculous where he needs to be rewarded over and above the 14 milliom he will collect.

You extend them to keep them around for more years.

I would like to see him doing his job [1000k seasons] for 3-4 more years.

 

[modo]

And I say again it is not punishment as they are not entitled to an extension. It is fine if you disagree but words have meaning.

I didnt say I would not extend someone simply for not making playoffs. This team underperformed. If we were not good enough to make the playoffs but exceeded their actual talent level then that is fine. But this particularly team failed to live up to their talent level.

As for ARob he is doing what he was paid to do. He performed as expected. He did not exceed expectations so I have no reason to jump at extending him.

In most workplaces you reward people for exceeding expectations not merely meeting them. ARob was paid to be a 1k yard WR. He did not put up 1400 yards or something ridiculous where he needs to be rewarded over and above the 14 milliom he will collect.

You are really picking an interesting hill to die on.

 

[remydat]

The argument about not resigning guys because of team performance or because said player might not perform in the future might be the most stupid thing I have seen on here in a while.

No I am not extending someone who did their job in line with what I paid them until their contract is up. Extensions should be for people that outperformed their contract. ARob is not outperforming his contract.

 

[modo]

Yeah and I pull the trigger when the contract is up unless the person exceeded expectations.

you still risk an injury the year after that....in the meantime the contract costs more and you give up cap space the previous year.

 

[WindyCity]

Yeah and I pull the trigger when the contract is up unless the person exceeded expectations.

Then you have lost leverage over the player and have opened the negotiation to the market.

If you do it now, Robinson can only negotiate with you and he has the injury risk of 16 games to weigh when it comes to getting a team friendly deal and structure.

 

[remydat]

You extend them to keep them around for more years.

I would like to see him doing his job [1000k seasons] for 3-4 more years.

Or you can just wait until their contract is up and resign them like Fuller. Was the Bears irrevocably harmed by letting Fuller play out his contract?

 

[modo]

In Remy's world he'd never extend a player early.......unless the team makes the playoffs and that player has been in the top ten statistically for a couple years. Cap space be damned.

 

[WindyCity]

Or you can just wait until their contract is up and resign them like Fuller. Was the Bears irrevocably harmed by letting Fuller play out his contract?

They transition tagged him and could have easily lost out on him if they had not had a ton of cap room to match whatever offer came.

If they transition Robinson they do not have the cap space to match any offer or structure.

Why let another team dictate the contract of a guy you want to keep?

The Bears are in the drivers seat with Robinson in 2020, in 2021 he is in the drivers seat.

 

[remydat]

you still risk an injury the year after that....in the meantime the contract costs more and you give up cap space the previous year.

Or the person underperforms and you dont end up blowing money on Massie. If a guy is outperforming his contract then extending him is less risk because even if performance dips it is likely to still met expectations. If you extending guys who just meeting expectstions then a dip means they now may be underperforming.

 

[remydat]

In Remy's world he'd never extend a player early.......unless the team makes the playoffs and that player has been in the top ten statistically for a couple years. Cap space be damned.

In the real world bonuses and the like are a combination of meeting company goals and exceeding expectations individually. Difference between successful companies and teams like the Pats and terrible companies and teams like the Bears.

How many guys get extensions with the Pats? Hint it isnt guys just meeting expectations.

For most of NFL history it was the top guys that got extensions. Now a lot of bad GMs and owners started handing out extensions like they are candy.

Yall extending guys that cant even make a Pro Bowl when damn near everyone makes it these days with all the alternates.

I will take the Fuller route all day over extending guys Leno or Massie. Yall crying now about how we stuck with Leno and Massie and yet still advocating making the same mistake with ARob. He is a good player and had a good year just like Massie and Leno did before being extending. But he nor them are doing anything truly exceptional to warrant taking the risk earlier than we have to.

 

[WindyCity]

Or the person underperforms and yoybdont end up blowing money on Massie. If a guy is outperforming his contract then extending him is less risk because even if performance dips it is likely to still met expectations. If you extending guys who just meeting expectstions then a dip means they now may be underperforming.

Or they continue to perform at a high level and you get them at a better cap number.

Massie was a bigger risk because he has been more volatile in his career. Goldman, Hicks, even Leno have played at the level they were extended at.