The 2020 Personnel Discussion: Offense

[10veitout]

Guess I'll ask again: Why would the Falcons let one of their few bright spots of their awful season go in Hooper?

Regime change. Alot of coaches and GMs like to start with a clean slate as far as the cap goes.

I wouldn't recommend letting a young talent like Hooper go though, for sure.

 

[discplayer]

Drafted TEs just take so long to develop. Even this season Hockeson and Fant offered almost nothing as rookies.

Well, to be fair, Windy, they were both drafted by bad teams and into bad/dysfunctional offenses. They might have had much better and more impactful rookie seasons if drafted by better run offenses/organizations.

 

[modo]

sigh.......just saying we'll use X draft choice on a position is not a guarantee....

It depends who is available. If there is a run on OTs and you are left with 4th round graded OT in the second round, you don't select the OT....

I don't understand how this doesn't sink in with fans.

GMs fill holes on their team in free agency. They may not be ideal, but they cover the bases so you can select best available in the draft....

 

[Chris Sojka]

Agree, Windy.

TEs do take a long time to develop, as you said with Hock/Fant. I'd for sure target a FA. Doyle extended three years, so I'd be open to Hooper or Henry, for sure. We don't need an ELITE TE just a GOOD one. Our are mediocre at best, and really, more of a liability right now. I'm done with Shaheen and Burton. I'll let them both go.

OT/OG I like taking one each in the 2nd.

WR I think we have guys that can develop. If Miller can not be an idiot, he can improve to a solid WR2. I also like Wims. ARob is very good. But the drops need to stop. I'm hoping that's just a streak of bad luck for us, and not players that just suck.

Miller is a pure slot guy not a #2 Neither is Gabriel.

 

[wazzupi]

I dont think we

Miller is a pure slot guy not a #2 Neither is Gabriel.

I kinda feel riley Ridley is a slot type too

 

[Rob219_CBMB]

if Bears had to draft today, i'll go
TE, DE/olb, WR, OL, ILB, and finally DB.

 

[WindyCity]

Guess I'll ask again: Why would the Falcons let one of their few bright spots of their awful season go in Hooper?

They are an absolute cap mess right now. They are over the cap for next season with no available roll over and extensions for Jarrett, Jones, Jones the LB,kicking in.

 

[WindyCity]

sigh.......just saying we'll use X draft choice on a position is not a guarantee....

It depends who is available. If there is a run on OTs and you are left with 4th round graded OT in the second round, you don't select the OT....

I don't understand how this doesn't sink in with fans.

GMs fill holes on their team in free agency. They may not be ideal, but they cover the bases so you can select best available in the draft....

No one actually picks BPA, need always factors into it.

The Bears will not have the available cash and the market will not have the available talent in free agency at all spots.

 

[WindyCity]

Well, to be fair, Windy, they were both drafted by bad teams and into bad/dysfunctional offenses. They might have had much better and more impactful rookie seasons if drafted by better run offenses/organizations.

The only rookie TE who has been good right away in recent memory is Gronk. It is a notoriously hard transition.

 

[WindyCity]

I would go into the 2nd round targetting

OT, CB, Edge

In that order. We know those positions don’t last. They don’t have the money to replace them in free agency, and they are serious long term needs.

 

[dennehy]

I would go into the 2nd round targetting

OT, CB, Edge

In that order. We know those positions don’t last. They don’t have the money to replace them in free agency, and they are serious long term needs.

Exactly.

 

[WestCoastBearsFan]

I would go into the 2nd round targetting

OT, CB, Edge

In that order. We know those positions don’t last. They don’t have the money to replace them in free agency, and they are serious long term needs.

I would put edge above CB simply because we still have Prince for next year. Also doesn’t it make more sense to target guard over tackle? While Leno and Massie haven’t been all that, all we have at RG is Coward and Bars... two PS guys.

 

[dennehy]

I would put edge above CB simply because we still have Prince for next year. Also doesn’t it make more sense to target guard over tackle? While Leno and Massie haven’t been all that, all we have at RG is Coward and Bars... two PS guys.

Easier to get a guard in FA, also an easier position to find a competent player. Good OTs are difficult to find in FA.

Prince could be a cap casualty, and the Bears also have Floyd under contract next year (but he could be gone too).

Anyway, I'd put those three positions as the greatest long term need, all roughly the same.

 

[modo]

No one actually picks BPA, need always factors into it.

The Bears will not have the available cash and the market will not have the available talent in free agency at all spots.

Yes needs factor into it, but you don't just declare 6 months before the draft "we'll use a 2nd on an OT"...specifically for the reasons I've stated.

Need does factor into it, but you don't don't use a 2nd on a 4th round graded talent.....the personnel have to be available.

 

[discplayer]

I would go into the 2nd round targetting

OT, CB, Edge

In that order. We know those positions don’t last. They don’t have the money to replace them in free agency, and they are serious long term needs.

I agree w/Windy here, too. OT HAS to be priority #1 in the draft. Too expensive to find even an average tackle in FA.

Would even say they need to spend one of the mid or late round picks on another OT prospect (who could perhaps play at and bolster OG, too, at worst). The OL has to get better.

 

[PeterMbangala]

Yes needs factor into it, but you don't just declare 6 months before the draft "we'll use a 2nd on an OT"...specifically for the reasons I've stated.

Need does factor into it, but you don't don't use a 2nd on a 4th round graded talent.....the personnel have to be available.

We all know this - just trying to plot out different directions they could go.

I think OT is by far the biggest need on the team assuming they stop the bleeding at TE in free agency. What that means in practice is if you are picking at 50 and have an OT and an OLB that grade out similarly, I am taking the tackle.

It's just been so long since we spend a high value pick there. In the last 25 years, we have only drafted the following tackles in the first 4 rounds....

2011 - Carimi
2008 - Williams
2002 - Columbo
2001 - Gandy (WTF?) in the 3rd round

Four guys in the top 4 rounds since 1995 lol.

The only tackle Pace has drafted since he became GM is Tayo Fabuluje who is no longer in the league.

Massie and Leno have been garbage this year and have been outplayed by Cornelius Lucas. Why gamble that they get back to the mean when their average play is...average.

 

[modo]

We all know this - just trying to plot out different directions they could go.

I think OT is by far the biggest need on the team assuming they stop the bleeding at TE in free agency. What that means in practice is if you are picking at 50 and have an OT and an OLB that grade out similarly, I am taking the tackle.

It's just been so long since we spend a high value pick there. In the last 25 years, we have only drafted the following tackles in the first 4 rounds....

2011 - Carimi
2008 - Williams
2002 - Columbo
2001 - Gandy (WTF?) in the 3rd round

Four guys in the top 4 rounds since 1995 lol.

The only tackle Pace has drafted since he became GM is Tayo Fabuluje who is no longer in the league.

Massie and Leno have been garbage this year and have been outplayed by Cornelius Lucas. Why gamble that they get back to the mean when their average play is...average.

what we did over the last 25 years has little to no bearing on what we should do now. What does matter is what talent is on the roster at the time of the draft and who is available when we draft.

 

[PeterMbangala]

what we did over the last 25 years has little to no bearing on what we should do now. What does matter is what talent is on the roster at the time of the draft and who is available when we draft.

Just thought it was interesting just how little we've invested in the position over the years.

It's absolutely relevant that...

Pace has picked one tackle in the 6th round in 5 years
Comes from a culture that really values the position and routinely drafts 1st round talent
Has seen his first choice tackles shit the bed all year

I'd be amazed if one of those two second rounders doesn't end up being a tackle.

 

[modo]

Just thought it was interesting just how little we've invested in the position over the years.

It's absolutely relevant that...

Pace has picked one tackle in the 6th round in 5 years
Comes from a culture that really values the position and routinely drafts 1st round talent
Has seen his first choice tackles shit the bed all year

I'd be amazed if one of those two second rounders doesn't end up being a tackle.

Again it is all dependent on the things I mentioned...they may be satisfied with who they have on the roster in terms of Coward competing (@WindyCity you were one year late).

If there is a guy in the draft available when the Bears pick that they really like to lock down a tackle position then I believe Pace will draft him.....

But what I see fans do over and over is just assign a draft slot to a position. Its ignorant of how the draft actually works.

 

[rawdawg]

I think because 4/5 of the OL isn't going anywhere, you need to really upgrade that 1 that is. The OL has been pretty bad overall this year, but is rounding into decent shape. I don't think Leno has been as bad as he's been portrayed in this thread. He's actually got a good pass blocking grade, and I don't have the numbers off hand, but I believe the Bears have their best numbers running to the left tackle.

Leno, Daniels, Whitehair, Bars/Coward, Massie is basically what the Bears have now. A good RG would make the OL potentially as good as we thought it was going to be coming into the year. And with QB, most of the WRs, and RBs being the same, this is the best way to improve this offense outside of people simply performing better.

TE- I said in the other thread, Burton will get another shot to be the lead TE. So, a drafted TE taking a year to develop isn't the worst thing. I'd rather get the most talented player possible, then in 2021, you cut Burton and have his money to spend on a potential compliment.

WR- I think you cut Gabriel, but I really think they're going to need to replace his speed. Ironically Marvin Hall would look good on next year's roster next to ARob, Wims, Miller, and Ridley. Patterson isn't a real WR. He's being used appropriately right now. I don't think Hall is on a roster right now.

RB- Ironically again, Kerrith Whyte would look good on next year's roster. They don't really need him this season (unless god forbid, Montgomery gets hurt). He looks damn good for the Steelers. Probably going to add another draft pick very late.

QB- 3 weeks ago, I would have said they needed a new QB. Now, they need a backup who if he does play, won't signify giving up on the season and is capable of catching lightning in a bottle for a few weeks like Tannehill has. Also needs to be relatively cheap. Case Keenum seems to perfectly fit the bill. A lot can change in the last 3 weeks though, so if Mitch can't keep it up, maybe need to use one of the 2nd rounders on a QB.