Trevon Diggs at 43

[msadows]

This is going to be a fascinating draft. Pace all by himself.

Prepare for the #conviction.

Trade ups, bad offensive picks, and a 5th round good defensive player that everyone can hang their hat on.

He's allowed to have up to 9 other team members with him.

Pace isn't going to be by himself, he will have his scout team in whatever war room they choose.

This is going to basically be a normal draft. The only difference is you won't get the top prospects at the venue.

 

[dabears70]

The top 10 picks and Shaheen are the bigger problem.

But you listed everyone with a pulse and a roster spot as being a positive for him.

He is a mediocre drafter.

Ohhhh so which of the players i listed were not good picks where they were picked then since you think i added some bad ones in there????

 

[msadows]

Ohhhh so which of the players i listed were not good picks where they were picked then since you think i added some bad ones in there????

He's the bears GM, so he sucks.

Meanwhile the majority of NFL GM's have a worse draft record than pace, but pace is worse because he leads the beloved.

Windy has become a whining crying little bitch.

 

[msadows]

Cohen is no longer a good pick.

Miller is no longer a good pick.

Daniels, Whitehair both suck.

Funny how one season changes everything.

Cunting and raging like a team went 3-13.

 

[PeterMbangala]

Right but the same people that were Pace fans at this exact time last year are now making jokes about how he can't draft or trade or do anything right in the draft. So you're saying people were fans of him as our GM a year ago through 4 drafts but thought he sucked through 4 drafts but still loved him? Hmmmmm sounds pretty fucking stupid to me.

You get how stupid that is right????

Not stupid at all.

I was not super high on Pace after 2018 because I thought he was bad at drafting talent in the first round. I did think on the plus side that he was excellent in the later rounds (E. Jackson, N. Kwiatkowski, A. Amos etc). He had made a killer hire in Fangio and watching that defense was so much fun.

Nagy was full of energy and his lack of play calling acumen was hidden by a great team spirit, a great defense full of characters, Club Dub, and could be partially explained away as Mitch's learning curve.

But Mitch regressing to a barely viable starter while Mahones and Watson light up the league, Fangio leaving, the OL shitting the bed really hurt Pace.

His record in the first round, which was poor in 2018, now reads bust, cut, probably bust, Roquan, nothing, nothing.

Two of his good mid round picks are on other teams because he went all in on Mitch with Mack.

A year and a half is an eternity in life. Think about what we are doing now which we could never have imagined even six months ago.

Changing your mind based on the available evidence is what will keep the death toll to a minimum during COVID-19. It is what science is literally based on. It is also useful in buying groceries, interpersonal relationships and a myriad of other aspects of life including 86) assessing a GM.

 

[PeterMbangala]

To recap, I dont think Pace is a terrible GM at all but I do think his record in the first round is really, really bad. If you can't identify talent with your premium picks then it is hard to be a successful GM. This is obvious to literally everyone I would have thought?

His has two second round picks this year so fingers crossed for more of a Goldman level player than a Shaheen.

 

[dabears70]

To recap, I dont think Pace is a terrible GM at all but I do think his record in the first round is really, really bad. If you can't identify talent with your premium picks then it is hard to be a successful GM. This is obvious to literally everyone I would have thought?

His has two second round picks this year so fingers crossed for more of a Goldman level player than a Shaheen.

He did identify talent. K.White was absolutely talented, L.Floyd was talented and R.Smith is very talented, shit even Mitch was talented in his one year in college which was why every draft expert and GM and scout had him as a 1st round pick and many had him as the best QB in his draft. Are you saying any of those players weren't talented? Now trying to predict what any of them will be making the jump from college to the NFL is impossible to predict 100% but the GM will always get the blame because someone has to and that's the GM's job to make the final decision on draft picks.

 

[msadows]

He did identify talent. K.White was absolutely talented, L.Floyd was talented and R.Smith is very talented, shit even Mitch was talented in his one year in college which was why every draft expert and GM and scout had him as a 1st round pick and many had him as the best QB in his draft. Are you saying any of those players weren't talented? Now trying to predict what any of them will be making the jump from college to the NFL is impossible to predict 100% but the GM will always get the blame because someone has to and that's the GM's job to make the final decision on draft picks.

I had zero issue with the KW pick. It was absolutely the correct pick at that time. Plenty can argue if it was smart to get rid of marshall but he was an aging headcase, even if he was talented the guy was a locker room cancer on a team trying to rebuild its image.

KW was by far the most talented player at the spot we were picking at and nearly every mock had him going to us. Plenty of people thought he was going to be the next julio jones. You can't predict a guy with no injury history is going to be Mr. Glass, it was just unfortunate.

The Leonard Floyd pick, there really wasn't much better at a position of need at that spot. Floyd was by far the best available player at the time of the draft and he's probably still the best of the positions we were thinking about taking.

Mitch he fucked up on, bad. There wasn't enough difference in potential/talent/downside to take him over other QB's, and trade up for him.

Smith will probably be a stud if he doesn't go crazy.

 

[The Big Grabowski]

JFC people need to stop acting like our roster is shit. We’ve got a lot of talent. We have holes to fill too. Just like every team.

I don’t get the point of the constant bitching. If you really want to tear it down again, start embracing the reality of what that means.

Get ready to swallow seasons of losses again and a whole lot more despair. I mean you would be putting faith in the organization to pick someone better at GM and HC. That certainly is not a given.

Yes, we had a disappointing 8-8 season that sent everyone’s high hopes crashing down. That’s sports for you. There’s always next season.

If you can’t summon a little optimism heading into the draft, you might want to take a year off because you’re developing an unhealthy relationship to your team.

 

[remydat]

Ohhhh so which of the players i listed were not good picks where they were picked then since you think i added some bad ones in there????

Hold my beer!

First counting the 2019 draft as good picks is a joke. Most of those guys barely played this year so it is homerism at it's finest to count them as good draft picks. Like holy shit how can you claim Denmark is a good draft pick when the didn't play a snap. Some of those guys may turn out to be good but they have done nothing in the NFL outside of Monty who was mediocre at best as a 2019.

So when you remove your inflated 2019 draft, you are left with the following. The bold are actually good picks in that they have actually played well in the NFL for multiple seasons. The yellow are guys that have been decent but not quite lived up to their draft status. Floyd at this point is a bust for pass rusher drafted in top 10. Smith, Daniels, and Miller have shown flashes but none have truly established themselves as consistently good players in the NFL.

The red are guys that basically haven't played enough to claim they are successes right now. Bush and Houston-Carr have been in the league for 4 years and barely seen the field. Wimms has been practically invisible for 2 years. Nichols shows the most promise out of all of them but was injured last year so again not proven as an established player.

So you are severely overrating some of these guys. The list of bonafide established good starters is 7 guys in 4 drafts with only 4 of them actually still with the Bears. That is while basically turning over the roster so out of 53 guys replaced basically. Now some of the 2019 class may emerge and Trubs may miraculously get his shit together but if Trubs doesn't turn into a hit then hit is a very pedestrian hit rate. You again are just including dudes that are question marks or marginal starters.

E.Goldman--2nd
A.Amos--5th
L.Floyd
C.Whitehair--2nd
N.Kwiatkowski--4th
D.Bush--4th
J.Howard--5th
D.Houston Carson--6th
E.Jackson--4th
T.Cohen--4th
R.Smith--1st
J.Daniels--2nd
A.Miller--2nd
B.Nichols--5th
J.Wims--7th

 

[dabears70]

Hold my beer!

First counting the 2019 draft as good picks is a joke. Most of those guys barely played this year so it is homerism at it's finest to count them as good draft picks. Like holy shit how can you claim Denmark is a good draft pick when the didn't play a snap. Some of those guys may turn out to be good but they have done nothing in the NFL outside of Monty who was mediocre at best as a 2019.

So when you remove your inflated 2019 draft, you are left with the following. The bold are actually good picks in that they have actually played well in the NFL for multiple seasons. The yellow are guys that have been decent but not quite lived up to their draft status. Floyd at this point is a bust for pass rusher drafted in top 10. Smith, Daniels, and Miller have shown flashes but none have truly established themselves as consistently good players in the NFL.

The red are guys that basically haven't played enough to claim they are successes right now. Bush and Houston-Carr have been in the league for 4 years and barely seen the field. Wimms has been practically invisible for 2 years. Nichols shows the most promise out of all of them but was injured last year so again not proven as an established player.

So you are severely overrating some of these guys. The list of bonafide established good starters is 7 guys in 4 drafts with only 4 of them actually still with the Bears. That is while basically turning over the roster so out of 53 guys replaced basically. Now some of the 2019 class may emerge and Trubs may miraculously get his shit together but if Trubs doesn't turn into a hit then hit is a very pedestrian hit rate. You again are just including dudes that are question marks or marginal starters.

Not gonna read cause i know how the remy dance goes already.

You can now get the last word remy.

 

[remydat]

Not gonna read cause i know how the remy dance goes already.

You can now get the last word remy.

Here I will give you the short version. Most of the guys you claim as hits are not consistent good starters in the NFL.

 

[bearsfan1977]

Kevin White top 10
Mitch Trubiksy top 10
Adam Shaheen 2nd
Hroniss Grasu 3rd
Jonathan Bullard 3rd
Jeremy Langford 4th
Deiondre Hall 4th
Jordan Morgan 5th
Iggy 4th

Most would put Floyd on this list as you had to spend 14/season to replace him and you cut him before he finished his contract.

To act like Pace is an above average drafter is just dishonest

I don’t know Windy. I think it would be interesting to analyze his drafting success/failure against other GMs during that time span. I don’t know what the metric would be for a good pick? Perpetual starter? Valuable backup?
It also depends on where they were drafted. Eddie Jackson, Cohen, Kwiat all good later picks. Some solid second round picks.
The main point people make is the first round. Roquan was a good pick. Floyd was in a weak draft and Pace tried to make a guy into a natural pass rusher who never showed he is a natural pass rusher. I think he can succeed in the right scheme. White I can’t put on Pace. It was just bad fuckin luck. Freak injuries ended his career. Everyone had him pegged in the area where Pace drafted him. I doubt one person on here criticized the pick, much less criticized it because they could prophesise that he would constantly be injured.

Mitch is where he screwed up, and screwed up badly. But again, how has his drafting been compared to other GMs overall? I’m not a huge fan of Pace, and I don’t know the answer, but I think his drafting record may be a little better than he is given credit for.

 

[msadows]

JFC people need to stop acting like our roster is shit. We’ve got a lot of talent. We have holes to fill too. Just like every team.

I don’t get the point of the constant bitching. If you really want to tear it down again, start embracing the reality of what that means.

Get ready to swallow seasons of losses again and a whole lot more despair. I mean you would be putting faith in the organization to pick someone better at GM and HC. That certainly is not a given.

Yes, we had a disappointing 8-8 season that sent everyone’s high hopes crashing down. That’s sports for you. There’s always next season.

If you can’t summon a little optimism heading into the draft, you might want to take a year off because you’re developing an unhealthy relationship to your team.

A lot of these scrubs probably have never went through a dissapointing season.

Just last year the same idiots were struggling to find holes on the team and were screaming superbowl.

Now with largely the same roster(If not better), and after going 8-8, the meatballs are saying its a roster void of talent.

Who's to say the performance those players had in 2018 isn't more akin to their actual level of play and not 2019. It's very rare for a roster to decrease in output almost universally. That goes on coaching, not talent.

I've never seen a fucking fan base be so bipolar.

 

[WindyCity]

He's the bears GM, so he sucks.

Meanwhile the majority of NFL GM's have a worse draft record than pace, but pace is worse because he leads the beloved.

Windy has become a whining crying little bitch.

Judge him on results. Not anecdotal draft grades.

He isn’t good. His results aren’t good, because his roster has major issues.

Accepting mediocrity, a Bears fans birthright.

 

[PeterMbangala]

He did identify talent. K.White was absolutely talented, L.Floyd was talented and R.Smith is very talented, shit even Mitch was talented in his one year in college which was why every draft expert and GM and scout had him as a 1st round pick and many had him as the best QB in his draft. Are you saying any of those players weren't talented? Now trying to predict what any of them will be making the jump from college to the NFL is impossible to predict 100% but the GM will always get the blame because someone has to and that's the GM's job to make the final decision on draft picks.

Pretty much everyone playing College football is "talented".

Identifying talent that translates to the NFL is literally the number one job of a GM. So yes, he will be judged on whether he can do that.

 

[WindyCity]

Cohen is no longer a good pick.

Miller is no longer a good pick.

Daniels, Whitehair both suck.

Funny how one season changes everything.

Cunting and raging like a team went 3-13.

Who said any of those guys weren’t good picks?

Imagine not being pissed off about a massive team wide regression.

 

[dabears70]

Here I will give you the short version. Most of the guys you claim as hits are not consistent good starters in the NFL.

Well if they're drafted in the 4th round or later and they keep making the 53 man roster then they're good picks.

You have to realize that with your knowledge of the game though right? Maybe not..........

 

[dabears70]

Pretty much everyone playing College football is "talented".

Identifying talent that translates to the NFL is literally the number one job of a GM. So yes, he will be judged on whether he can do that.

Right but i'm just making sure everyone realizes that it's impossible for anyone even the GM to 100% predict what players will be at the next level. It falls on the GM because there always has to be a fall guy and in the case of personnel the GM will always be the fall guy. Every single GM that has ever in the lifetime of the NFL been a GM has missed on draft picks from the 1st round to the 7th round and the reason for that is because it's impossible to get them all right.

When Pace is gone then whoever takes his spot is also gonna miss on draft picks at every point in the draft. You ready for the next Emery? I'm not.

 

[WindyCity]

Right but i'm just making sure everyone realizes that it's impossible for anyone even the GM to 100% predict what players will be at the next level. It falls on the GM because there always has to be a fall guy and in the case of personnel the GM will always be the fall guy. Every single GM that has ever in the lifetime of the NFL been a GM has missed on draft picks from the 1st round to the 7th round and the reason for that is because it's impossible to get them all right.

When Pace is gone then whoever takes his spot is also gonna miss on draft picks at every point in the draft. You ready for the next Emery? I'm not.