Yu Darvish on the move?

CSF77

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Upside is Davies adds another July trade chip.

I might end up watching the Pads and Sox this year. That might end up as the WS.
 

Probie2429

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Solid trade. Cubs weren’t good enough nor bad enough. Pick a lane and stick with it. Right now the Cubs need quantity over quality and that’s what they got for Darvish. Considering the prospects are all under 20, their ceilings are unlimited right now. By the time the Cubs should be thinking about being competitive, Darvish will be of no use. I’d think this means Lester will be back on a one year deal as well.

Best case scenario for this season is Bryant stays healthy and bounces back from an awful season. Unloading him at the TDL would be tremendous. At the same time, the Cubs should net themselves a high draft pick.
 

Zvbxrpl

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Darvish was worth much more than they got back.

That's easy (and cheap) to say right now. 2 of the 4 specs are 18 and one is 17 and you wouldn't trade McKenzie Gore for 3 years and bigger $ of a 35-year-old coming off an excellent season if you were San Diego. The kids won't be up anytime soon either.

If this trade yields a return similar to (hell, even in the ballpark with) James Shields/Tatis Jr, wouldn't be surprised when you'd be one of the shitty fans saying you loved it from the start.

The bottom line is this: Darvish coming off a great year doesn't make this team closer to winning another WS.

Ricketts is also a cheap piece of shit. Two things can be true at the same time.
 

Chicagosports89

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That's easy (and cheap) to say right now. 2 of the 4 specs are 18 and one is 17 and you wouldn't trade McKenzie Gore for 3 years and bigger $ of a 35-year-old coming off an excellent season if you were San Diego. The kids won't be up anytime soon either.

If this trade yields a return similar to (hell, even in the ballpark with) James Shields/Tatis Jr, wouldn't be surprised when you'd be one of the shitty fans saying you loved it from the start.

The bottom line is this: Darvish coming off a great year doesn't make this team closer to winning another WS.

Ricketts is also a cheap piece of shit. Two things can be true at the same time.
Add in the fact Darvish has been incredibly inconsistent throughout his career and not exactly an example of perfect health either. His value is being severely overrated by cubs fans.
 

CSF77

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Add in the fact Darvish has been incredibly inconsistent throughout his career and not exactly an example of perfect health either. His value is being severely overrated by cubs fans.


The Pads got his personal catcher for a reason. Yu IMO would have fallen off with another catcher because he has 11 pitches and that is his strength. Caratini knows how to blend it together. They are a team and breaking it up would have been unwise. We saw this with Lester and David.
 

CSF77

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Now regarding the Cubs:

I believe that this might be it until July. I believe that they took Davies because he was a expiring deal. If you look at Jed's early history with the Cubs it was all about buying short term to flip. Right now Baez, Rizzo, Bryant are all coming off poor years but all have potential value in the market towards play off bound teams. Davies was the Padres best starter in the play offs and a strong first half could put him in the same scenerio.

So I do believe that we are seeing a overhaul right now. Jed had a chip with weight and sold it. He will do it again. His goal is to build the next wave and I would expect more high ceiling types in volume vs 1-2 top 100.

I don't agree with it but the Cubs have proven to be able to develop hitting. Pitching is their short coming. So I understand the why part. I just believe that Jed needs to address this short coming or get a GM that has a history of pitching development.
 

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Nope. Sorry glass half full homers....I swear some of you work for the organization. Jed took it hard.
 

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I think the Cubs need to massively retool this team from the ground up.

When Epstein originally took over the MLB was all about launch angle and 2 outcome at bats. SO the team scouted for and built the team around guys that can destroy fastballs. And it worked for two years 2015-2016. But the MLB had a massive transition to pitchers, particularly relievers, who threw fewer fastballs and when they threw fastballs they were high fastballs that our team just can't hit. This was a death nell for the Cubs lineup as they had very few contact hitters who can generate activity besides a walk or homerun.

I am not sure what information Jed has, but I would hope he sees this same shift in pitching and realizes he needs a combination of power and contact through the lineup, no more one trick ponies.

Which brings me to the next point, that with the tam built this way, we aren't going to win anything in the next few years. So why spend money and why keep players around that won't be here when we are good again. Most of us should see this and know what the process is as we experienced it already and it worked well.

Now as for this trade. On the initial front end, the Padres got a steal and it appears the Cubs got fleeced. But.... The type of prospects the Cubs got in return aren't going to show up in top ten or top 100 lists because of how young they are. It is a high risk high reward type trade. When you get 4 of these players odds are 2 of them will be good in the MLB.

That being said, they Cubs have invested heavily in player development (with facilities and coaching), particularly for players obtained from the international draft. And this makes sense as the ability to 'hit' on these picks are much higher than in the MLB draft.

So let's be real, this is a sell move, but it is not like it was in 2011-2014 as we have a better farm system to get through the 2-3 retooling we need. We also have a stellar 2022 free agent class and a 2021 year that could be effected by the pandemic still so why invest in this year? Might as well free up money to pay big into free agency next year and re-up players like Happ and Contreras or whoever performs consistently this year.
 

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Add in the fact Darvish has been incredibly inconsistent throughout his career and not exactly an example of perfect health either. His value is being severely overrated by cubs fans.

Darvish has demonstrated that he can be the best pitcher in baseball as well as one of the most disappointing. Selling high was clearly the best move for the Cubs considering where they are in the competitive landscape.
 

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Something I hadn't exactly considered until sleeping but I did have the thought that maybe part of the money saving aspect also plays into whatever they do with Bryant. Like everyone seems to be under the impression that in order to get true impact in a trade of Bryant the cubs will have to eat money. Obviously we don't know what kind of offers are out there for Bryant right now but an interesting idea would be to use some of the money they are saving to increase value in a trade of bryant.
 

RacerX

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Acknowledging and demonstrating the obvious need for a rebuild: A+
Selling a player at his peak market value: A+
The return on the trade: fuck do I know

This is the appropriate risk-profile for the FO to assume, bravo. Wish the Blackhawks and Bulls do the same.
 

Chicagosports89

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Acknowledging and demonstrating the obvious need for a rebuild: A+
Selling a player at his peak market value: A+
The return on the trade: fuck do I know

This is the appropriate risk-profile for the FO to assume, bravo. Wish the Blackhawks and Bulls do the same.
I think the bulls will at some point, but don't know that they will get much in return for what they have.
 

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Add in the fact Darvish has been incredibly inconsistent throughout his career and not exactly an example of perfect health either. His value is being severely overrated by cubs fans.
Is Keith Law a Cubs fan?
 

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wrong. Darvish is worth exactly what they got. If they could of gotten more for him, don’t you think they would of? This is what a mid 30’s pitcher is worth in today’s game
A better GM would have gotten more. This particular "mid-30's pitcher" should have won the Cy Young. He isn't just a typical P. He's still quite capable of being the #1.
 

knoxville7

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A better GM would have gotten more. This particular "mid-30's pitcher" should have won the Cy Young. He isn't just a typical P. He's still quite capable of being the #1.

that’s just pure speculation on your part to say a “better gm would of gotten more.” You don’t know that.
And yes, Yu is capable of being a #1 still. But for how much longer? He’s 34 years old. Jon Lester is 36, and we saw how much of a drop off he has experienced from age 34 to 36. And that’s just one example of aging pitchers. If you think Yu commanded some top prospect(s), well you’re just viewing it thru homer glasses

my point at the start was Snell brings more in a trade than Yu because of the age difference. You seem to think Yu should of gotten as much of a return as snell did, which is ludicrous. No GM in their right mind would give as much up for Yu as they would snell.
 

JP Hochbaum

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that’s just pure speculation on your part to say a “better gm would of gotten more.” You don’t know that.
And yes, Yu is capable of being a #1 still. But for how much longer? He’s 34 years old. Jon Lester is 36, and we saw how much of a drop off he has experienced from age 34 to 36. And that’s just one example of aging pitchers. If you think Yu commanded some top prospect(s), well you’re just viewing it thru homer glasses

my point at the start was Snell brings more in a trade than Yu because of the age difference. You seem to think Yu should of gotten as much of a return as snell did, which is ludicrous. No GM in their right mind would give as much up for Yu as they would snell.
This exactly. People don't trade for past perfomances but for reasonable expected future performances. Right handers especially fall apart rather quickly.
 

knoxville7

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This exactly. People don't trade for past perfomances but for reasonable expected future performances. Right handers especially fall apart rather quickly.

exactly. Throw in the fact Yu will get paid handsomely for the next few years for what is to be expected declining performance as time goes on, and it’s actually pretty good the cubs got the haul they got. Who knows if any of these kids will turn out, but that’s the nature of prospects

it’s the same baseball nerds that spout fwar as gospel that hate this trade, yet Yu’s fwar for the remainder of his contract will be lower than his career rate. It’s funny
 

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