49ers, not Bears, trade to #3 to get top QB in draft...

[greg23]

Maybe Lynch is planning on drafting Solomon Thomas and Ruben Foster again

#hereallyfleecedpace

 

[wazzupi]

The other thing to note with Lance vs Jones is that Jones beats teams with his arm rather than his legs. Lance does a lot of one read and then tuck and scramble (which he had a lot of success with in college, but that style doesn't translate well to the NFL as a day 1 starter).

You don't know what you're talking about, also he plays pro style which Mac did little of.

 

[remydat]

Before you completely go full vortex here.....

The original comment by @rawdawg was:

Mac Jones - 17 college starts = pro ready
Trey Lance- 17 college starts = needs to sit for a year

I stand by my take that Mac Jones is more pro ready because of his school and his level of competition/practice.

That DOES NOT mean Lance can't turn out better. You are 1000% correct that underlying talent and ability matters more in the long run.

Jones could easily be the beneficiary of playing with better players though. Whether someone is pro ready is more a function of the offensive system they were in and how well it translates to the NFL in terms of if it allowed them to go thru progressions.

If for example Mac Jones only had to make one read or read half the field or if pretty much most of his WRs were open because he literally played with numerous 1st round WRs then that does not make him pro ready necessarily.

By contrast if Lance played worse competition but then had worse wide receivers forcing him to have to go to his 2nd, 3rd or 4th read more, that would prepare him for the NFL more even though the level of competition was lower.

That is not a vortex. Just basic logic. QBs in the NFL need to fit the ball into tight spots so that is what I would be looking at not level of competition but progressions and how tight coverage was.

 

[NCChiFan]

Lol, the Bears are going to go another year without drafting a quarterback high in the draft, and, instead, torture us by filling the QB room with two journeyman vets and probably a low-end rookie with no upside and act like they've made progress.

There is ZERO excuse for the Bears to get beaten out by any team when it comes to trading up in this draft. Andy Dalton can NOT be an option to start next year. You just can't have that happen.

Well, except that offer was better than anything the Bears could have offered draft value wise. I suppose the Bears could have tossed in a former first in Roquan? What was offered by the 49'rs was ridiculous and could imperil the 49rs for a looooong time. If a team is going to pull that kind of stunt, I would personally prefer it be for an established star like Wilson.

 

[TL1961]

San Francisco just traded up to ensure they get a quarterback they feel is worth the three number ones and everybody here says they were fleeced. ?

 

[NCChiFan]

San Francisco just traded up to ensure they get a quarterback they feel is worth the three number ones and everybody here says they were fleeced. ?

Who knows, everyone is pretty upset the Bears traded up one spot to grab Mitch at #2.

 

[BaBaBlacksheep]

Jones could easily be the beneficiary of playing with better players though. Whether someone is pro ready is more a function of the offensive system they were in and how well it translates to the NFL in terms of if it allowed them to go thru progressions.

If for example Mac Jones only had to make one read or read half the field or if pretty much most of his WRs were open because he literally played with numerous 1st round WRs then that does not make him pro ready necessarily.

By contrast if Lance played worse competition but then had worse wide receivers forcing him to have to go to his 2nd, 3rd or 4th read more, that would prepare him for the NFL more even though the level of competition was lower.

That is not a vortex. Just basic logic. QBs in the NFL need to fit the ball into tight spots so that is what I would be looking at not level of competition but progressions and how tight coverage was.

Not going down the Remy rabbit hole. If you want to argue the guy who played at NDS is more pro ready then have at it.

 

[baselman1974]

I’m glad the Bears didn’t tank. There was no way the Bears could’ve gotten the top 2 picks this year. Bears at worst was a 6 win team.

There was no way the Bears had a chance to get Wilson or Lawerence. After that the QB talent does drop off. Fields is a top 10 pick. Any other year there is no way Mac Jones or Lance are top 10 picks.

I rather the Bears draft Mills or Mond in 2nd than drafting Lance or Jones at 20. The Bears might get the 3rd or 4th best OT like Darrisaw, Cosmi or maybe a Devonte Smith might drop in their laps. OT s and WRs don’t bust as much as a QB. I could live with a 2nd roubd QB bust if Bears get a perennial all pro in 1st.

Also with Mills and Mond, I think talent level is not a far drop off from Fields or Lance., and their talent level are above Jones. Mond or Mills might become a surprise starter like Russell Wilson was.

 

[remydat]

Not going down the Remy rabbit hole. If you want to argue the guy who played at NDS is more pro ready then have at it.

Not my argument at all. Mac may in fact be more pro ready. I don't know as I haven't dug into his actual throws. I am simply saying attending Alabama in and of itself does not automatically make someone more pro ready as if al Mac did was throw to guys largely always open that does not tell us much about his pro prospects.

 

[remydat]

San Francisco just traded up to ensure they get a quarterback they feel is worth the three number ones and everybody here says they were fleeced. ?

It is an overpay relative to previous QB trades of the past few years. Don't think the Watson, Mahomes, Wentz, or Goff trades involved swapping 1st rounders plus giving up 2 additional 1st rounders.

 

[baselman1974]

San Francisco just traded up to ensure they get a quarterback they feel is worth the three number ones and everybody here says they were fleeced. ?

A team shouldn’t trade 3 1sts for the 3rd best QB in this draft. That team should get best QB or 2nd best in this draft. Lawerence have comps like Peyton Manning, and Wilson have comps like Mahomes. Theses two QBs are not likely to bust. Maybe not perennial ALL-Pros, but I don’t see them become complete busts.

 

[nc0gnet0]

It sure is! These trades today are really amazing basically assuring QB's go 1-2-3.
Atlanta is now in the cat birds seat for that 4th QB most likely between Car and Den.
Then, Pace trades 20, 52 and 2022 1st for 6 and takes Jones.

And then the Lions take Penei Sewell @ 7 in my dream scenario.

 

[Bort]

Guess who made more 1-read throws between Lance and Jones? Guess who made more tight window throws between the two? And that style translated fine for Kyler Murray and Cam Newton.

I don't have to guess. I've watched hours of film on both of them. Lance made more 1-read throws, and Jones made more tight window throws.

Lance is the better athlete with the stronger arm, but Jones is the more accurate, polished passer.

And I don't think the Murray and Newton comps make any sense. Newton was a much more polished passer than Lance, and Murray is a freak of nature athletically even by NFL standards.

 

[rawdawg]

Not my argument at all. Mac may in fact be more pro ready. I don't know as I haven't dug into his actual throws. I am simply saying attending Alabama in and of itself does not automatically make someone more pro ready as if al Mac did was throw to guys largely always open that does not tell us much about his pro prospects.

Exactly my point.

 

[rawdawg]

I don't have to guess. I've watched hours of film on both of them. Lance made more 1-read throws, and Jones made more tight window throws.

Lance is the better athlete with the stronger arm, but Jones is the more accurate, polished passer.

And I don't think the Murray and Newton comps make any sense. Newton was a much more polished passer than Lance, and Murray is a freak of nature athletically even by NFL standards.

None of this is factual.

 

[MDB111™]

Don’t worry. The Jets will find a way to fuck him up.

I feel that way about the Bears.

 

[Bears4Ever_34]

Are you serious? The 49ers just gave up 3 first rounders to move up 9 spots and arguably draft the 3rd best QB in the draft.

That like going to the car lot with your buddy and telling him, "you had ZERO excuse to not buy that 1998 Toyota Corolla for 8k. You needed a car you idiot".

Well, except that offer was better than anything the Bears could have offered draft value wise. I suppose the Bears could have tossed in a former first in Roquan? What was offered by the 49'rs was ridiculous and could imperil the 49rs for a looooong time. If a team is going to pull that kind of stunt, I would personally prefer it be for an established star like Wilson.

The only way not trading up to draft a quarterback makes any sense for the Bears is if they had made the decision to tank next year and trade all of their good players for extra draft capital to use in a rebuild. They already blew that chance when they let Kyle Fuller walk for nothing, so now they're stuck in no man's land: Trying to compete with what's left of their aging defense and a mediocre-at-best quarterback who isn't any better than the guy they had last year.

I just want them to pick a lane. Either take the big swing to acquire the quarterback right now and try to compete, or get rid of everybody and truly start over. Instead, it looks like they are well on their way to being one of those teams that's bad but not bad enough to get someone truly special, and it's driving me nuts.

 

[Wild_x_Card]

I don't have to guess. I've watched hours of film on both of them. Lance made more 1-read throws, and Jones made more tight window throws.

Lance is the better athlete with the stronger arm, but Jones is the more accurate, polished passer.

And I don't think the Murray and Newton comps make any sense. Newton was a much more polished passer than Lance, and Murray is a freak of nature athletically even by NFL standards.

Newton absolutely was not a more polished passer. In fact Cam Newton very well might have been the rawest QB talent in terms of polish to have legitimate success since Brett Farve. Newton was a borderline hot mess as a passer in college but an all world athlete. They completely had to rework his throwing mechanics and go through the ABCs of progression with him in Carolina. So much so that he struggled with accuracy and mechanics well into his career.

 

[Wild_x_Card]

That's not really a nock on Cam either. Both systems he was in at the college level were very rudimentary in terms of what they asked if their QBs. He never got a real shot at honing his craft at that level. He had other intangibles you couldn't teach. His intelligence is top of the food chain.

 

[playthrough2001]

You can see it on film. Zach Wilson has absurd arm. He reminds me a lot of Brett Favre.

I think he’s the best QB in this class. Lawrence might be the most over hyped QB ever.