Leslie Frazier

[remydat]

John Harbaugh pulled this off in punt formation a few years ago and it worked to perfection. Allowed his punter like 10-15 seconds before taking a safety. So the idea of intentionally holding for time vs penalty is not unheard of. But I do think you have to assess who you can try it on.

Umm that is not the same thing at all actually. Can you point to an actual DC doing this in an NFL game to NFL receivers? If not why do think that is?

Giants with Manning vs Eagles I wanna say back around 2007 or so. That was 11 seconds.

Actually Cutler and Bears vs Lions in 2015 I wanna say was 2 plays.

I did not ask you to tell me about them. I said to post them like I posed the Falcons game.

The Bears vs Lions game was 3 plays in 21 seconds and the last 2 plays were DPI so it would not have mattered because you get a free play regardless when the other team commits DPI.

 

[onebud34]

The Bears will hire Frazier & then tout the '85 Bears thing. Because that's what the McCaskey's think will sell.

It's not often a coach falls flat on his 1st go round as HC and manages to turn it around on their HC gig.

What we saw of the D as the game progressed is what you'd be getting as a HC. No thanks

 

[Black Rainbow]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1485446633118744579

 

[Black Rainbow]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1485447990793883649

 

[playthrough2001]

It was certainly implied.



This guy is presuming he knows they would run out of time.



This guy is claiming kicking to the end zome is idiotic with 13 seconds left hence why I posted the Bears losing a game after they squibbed with 11 seconds.

What I described isn’t a squib.

 

[didshereallysaythat]

Umm that is not the same thing at all actually. Can you point to an actual DC doing this in an NFL game to NFL receivers? If not why do think that is?

I have seen defensive holding in a situation like that but no idea if it was intentional.

 

[remydat]

NFL teams do it all the time. The Bears did it numerous times this year.

Do what all the time? Perfectly place a kick in the corner at the 5 yard line at the end of the game?

 

[baselman1974]

Bears lost to Falcons in 2008 trying that. Falcons ended up with the ball at 44 and 6 seconds. Got a 26 yard completion with 1 second left.

Bears fans complained about why they squibbed it.

The same bullshit Cover 2 defense. Squib it down the middle of the field. Like kick it on the Ground to 15 yard line. Waste 5-6 Seconds or returner downs it. Every yard counts.

 

[didshereallysaythat]

Remy - all I know is that once the Bills scored with 13 seconds left, I was yelling at my TV for them to kick it short. They didn't do it. Then I was yelling at my TV for them to alteast press Kelce. They didn't do it. Easy completion for 20 yards. Then I was yelling at my TV for them to press Kelce again. Didn't do it and another 20 yards.

Both of these strategies have been implemented before in these types of situations. Yes, intentional holding is extreme. But press coverage on a possession TE like Kelce is not. Forcing a return on a kick off with such little time left is not uncommon either. All I can tell you is what I though they should have done. And all we can say now is what they DID DO... didn't work. End of story.

 

[remydat]

What I described isn’t a squib.

I know you didnt. The point was when the squib failed the Falcons got the ball at 44. A corner kick that goes out of bounds you get at the 40 so the point is there is still a risk that if you fuck it up the other team can get great field position.

How many teams have you seen try this at the end of the game?

 

[remydat]

The same bullshit Cover 2 defense. Squib it down the middle of the field. Like kick it on the Ground to 15 yard line. Waste 5-6 Seconds or returner downs it. Every yard counts.

Right because it is impossible for one of them to get it before it gets to the 15. We have know heard squib it in the air, squib it in the ground, kick it to the 5 in the corner which just goes to show this is just throwing shit on the wall and seeing what sticks. You guys cant even agree on the best method and you have hours to think about it not 40 seconds.

 

[Payton34Sayers40]

The Chiefs secondary was depleted and horrible. Bills wideouts we’re running free without a Chief in sight. The Bills should have opened up the passing game more…. for most of the game Daboll was too conservative.

On the Bills board, their fans are letting Daboll have it. The game should not have been as close as it was.

Les Frazier is also getting lit up.

 

[Les Grossman]

Yet yesterday the Niners won because their defense shut down the "greatest QB ever" and the Bengals won because their defense forced 3 ints.

People are so reactionary.

In the end it's all about the quarterback, and there are great young quarterbacks(Allen, Herbert, Jackson) with defensive/special teams backgrounds.

Coaches aren't coordinators. They're not QB coaches. I'd just as soon hire a experienced defensive coordinator who gets an o.c. who's entire job is to focus on the offense, as opposed to a guy like Leftwich who will be learning how to be a head coach and expected to develop and manage Fields as well.

I mean, that's exactly how we got Nagy. People act like he wasn't regarded as an up and coming offensive mind who developed Mahomes and was raised through the best offense in decades.

Just get a good head coach. Their background is irrelevant.

I’m tending to think it’s really about talent. All these up and coming OC guys are all about their scheme and their system.

like Aikman said this weekend, it comes down to lining up and giving your better talent a chance against lesser talent.

 

[Speed]

The Chiefs secondary was depleted and horrible. Bills wideouts we’re running free without a Chief in sight. The Bills should have opened up the passing game more…. for most of the game Daboll was too conservative.

On the Bills board, their fans are letting Daboll have it. The game should not have been as close as it was.

Les Frazier is also getting lit up.

Reminds me of Shanhan getting lit up for his calls in the Superbowl as Atlanta's coordinator and not running the ball enough. If Daboll's stuff works I'll take some of the bad and hope he learns. He's prolly going to New York anyways so meh.

 

[Yogi]

Huge difference between a squib and kicking it short of the goal line. These kickers are perfectly capable of placing it around the 5 if they want to, and you should absolutely trust your special teams to bleed 5 seconds and stop them well short of the 40 more than you should trust your defense to stop Mahomes, Kelce, and Hill with two plays. At worst, they still only have one play to get into FG range.

Even so, you have to have triple coverage on Kelce and Hill. Mahomes only has eyes for them with that little time left, and even if another guy gets open, he's going to take an extra moment or two to find that guy or force the ball to one of the first two.

 

[jsu34]

LOL, blaming a coach for a portion of playoff game where it seems clear the last qb with ball will score and win seems short sighted.

At least Frazier didn't call a zero blitz which half the back end didn't execute at let Kupp go right past the safety with less than 35 seconds. If you want blame a coach or coaches or second guess, this would be more appropriate.

 

[greg23]

Honestly, why not just intentionally hold Kelce? It’s a 5 yard penalty but they lose the time.

Because they're meatball football people

We.goota hit and wrap up!!!

Put 0...that's right ZERO lineman on the field...rush nobody...press everyone at the line with cover three 15 and 30 yards off....at the snap, hold every receiver, tackle them...by the time mahomes figures out what's happening...3-4-5-6 seconds are off the clock and they gained.....5 yards on defensive holding.

They're down to 1 play from the 30.

But

These meatheads can't think of that...we've got to get pressure, we've to play deep and not give up the TD....knew the chiefs would be in fg or easy hail Mary range in 2 plays (13 second after the kick off and awful defensive alignment)

 

[greg23]

Hill just had a massive return earlier in the game.

I have seen the Bears lose trying to Squib with 11 seconds. I dont recall anyone winning when starting at the 25 and having 13 seconds.

If you can point me to other games where a QB did it in 2 plays and 13 seconds then I can reconsider.

You're an idiot and continue to defend an idiotic point.

You're playing the clock...13 seconds is what your playing against

A kick return.....and hill WAS not on the field.....wastes at least 3-5 seconds and a play....and any time off the clock with mahomes, hill and kelce on the sidings is a win for Buffalo no matter the result.......kick it short and watch them return it to the 40.? Fine.... there's likely 5-6 seconds left in the game meaning KC likely has one offensive play.....if more time is left OR you kicked it in the endzone you can mitigate their plays by committing intentional defensive penalties

And no there is no data on that strategy because the dipshits who make decisions in this leauge are meatheads and follow group think....meathead group think

 

[playthrough2001]

I know you didnt. The point was when the squib failed the Falcons got the ball at 44. A corner kick that goes out of bounds you get at the 40 so the point is there is still a risk that if you fuck it up the other team can get great field position.

How many teams have you seen try this at the end of the game?

Don’t be so dense. The kicker hangs the ball high toward the corner. It’s not like he’s aiming for the pylon. Teams do it all the time when they don’t want to concede the automatic 25.

Frankly, the kick doesn’t need to be toward the corner either but teams do it so it limits the returner’s options and it’s easier to cover.

 

[ThatGuyRyan]

LOL, blaming a coach for a portion of playoff game where it seems clear the last qb with ball will score and win seems short sighted.

At least Frazier didn't call a zero blitz which half the back end didn't execute at let Kupp go right past the safety with less than 35 seconds. If you want blame a coach or coaches or second guess, this would be more appropriate.

Ahhh the Desai special