Can we stop acting like Pagano is the major issue on defense?

Anytime23

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Yea, he did that in the 2000's.

I was discussing 2010 and on. But okay.

Once again, you're giving me shit for things you can look up yourself. Not once did I call BB a bad coach, I called out his recent draft record, which all of NE is doing too.

Since 2010 BB has a very very lackluster draft record. Might be the worst in the league, tbh. Does that take away his accomplishments? No, but it doesn't change the fact he's sucked at drafting.
He coaches the players he drafts. Its 100% his blueprint. At the end of the day, meaningless pro-bowl appearances>Championships in your eyes. Have fun with that. 2000s. 2010s. More success than the Bears have had in the entire SB era. SAD!

No good GMs in the NFL except Ryan Pace er sumthin.

BTW, you're late on the Pagano isn't as bad as everyone says train. Guess who's the conductor? The guy you say is wrong about everything. Ouch. Need a paper bag?
 

mecha

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Yea, he did that in the 2000's.

I was discussing 2010 and on. But okay.

Once again, you're giving me shit for things you can look up yourself. Not once did I call BB a bad coach, I called out his recent draft record, which all of NE is doing too.

Since 2010 BB has a very very lackluster draft record. Might be the worst in the league, tbh. Does that take away his accomplishments? No, but it doesn't change the fact he's sucked at drafting.

the New England Patriots sent about 8 players to the Pro Bowl each year. the Patriots have been the greatest assembly of no-name mooks ever. they've also won 3 more Super Bowls in the 2010s. I'll take Belichick's poor draft record any day with those kind of results.
 

greg23

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Once again, we can't put our db's on an island. We have one special DB, the rest(I'll give JJ a pass since he's a rookie, his passer rating against is still bad) have sucked. Danny T has sucked.

The lack of pressure with our down 4 makes it pretty damn hard to blitz on a regular basis. Sure, I'd love to see him be more aggressive, but I'm fairly certain there is a reason he isn't. As in, we'd get beat like a drum if he did. Pagano was always known for being aggressive and blitzing a ton, my guess is that changed due to the personnel he has.

The guy just rushes the same 4 with no twists or stunts....if you can't get home then have 5 or 6 at the line and rush 4....meaning the ol and qb aren't sure which 4 are coming.

He's bland and basic and his defense plays like it.
 

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You haven't seen a good football defense outside of 2018 in your lifetime, so how would you even know if this one is good or not?
because i can tell they’re not good when they 41, 30, 7, and then 27 points hung on them in a row. it’s not the hard to see.
 

msadows

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the New England Patriots sent about 8 players to the Pro Bowl each year. the Patriots have been the greatest assembly of no-name mooks ever. they've also won 3 more Super Bowls in the 2010s. I'll take Belichick's poor draft record any day with those kind of results.

Once again, this is about this decade. Once again, THIS DECADE.

This is not about BB's draft record in the 2000's, or his accomplishment as a head coach. Jesus, some of you have thick ass skuls.

It's legit facts that his draft record the past decade has blown chunks.
 

msadows

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The guy just rushes the same 4 with no twists or stunts....if you can't get home then have 5 or 6 at the line and rush 4....meaning the ol and qb aren't sure which 4 are coming.

He's bland and basic and his defense plays like it.

I see him doing stunts from time to time. Our dline isn't really built to do them that much tho. We don't really have a 3rd DE. Nichols isn't a nose tackle. We've been pushed around all year on the dline.
 

mecha

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Once again, this is about this decade. Once again, THIS DECADE.

This is not about BB's draft record in the 2000's, or his accomplishment as a head coach. Jesus, some of you have thick ass skuls.

It's legit facts that his draft record the past decade has blown chunks.

I just fucking said the 2010s, you can go look at the wikipedia pages by season for convenience.

I don't have personal beefs with people on CCS because I'm not a dickless pussy with an empty life and believe mock drafts are my contribution to the world. so for clarification I don't dislike you, but you're seriously fucking with us now.
 

bamainatlanta

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That defense was 2nd in pressures, and had the best slot corner in the league.

This defense barely gets to the QB and has the worst slot corner in the league + the worst corner depth.

Thats not even mentioning that eddie jackson/danny T have significantly dropped in level of play.

Skrine isnt the worst slot corner in the league
 

mecha

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sidenote: I like how the guy with the french name got dissed in the nominations thread and decided it was time to lock it.
 

bamainatlanta

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sidenote: I like how the guy with the french name got dissed in the nominations thread and decided it was time to lock it.
Who did that?
 

remydat

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This is classic John MsAddows Kerry. The dude was dick ridding Jackson, the Skrine signing, the Johnson draft pick and defending us choosing DT over Kwia. Now all of a sudden the team lacks talent.

Next year if the D improves with Fangio gone he will start a thread telling everyone they were stupid for thinking the Bears didn't have talent on D and that it was all Pagano.
 

MikeDitkaPolishSausage

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Except Eddie was fine last year.....he had a 57 passer rating against. It's doubled this year.

Skrine was okay last year, he's terribad this year.

This is a result of a lot of things, #1 being zero pressures, as I mentioned. Outside of the past few weeks this team was terrible getting pressure. We were 3rd worst in the league before that texans game.

The scheme didn't change. What changed is that we have zero pass rush against good teams. What changed is that we have a rookie teams pick on, and our slot corner/FS tandem are both playing like dogshit. What changed is we dont have kwiat anymore and Danny T is playing like he's an old man.
Eddie was “fine” and Skrine was “okay” last year. Those are significant drop offs then what we seen from Fangio. He had our secondary playing phenomenal football. Pagano has had our secondary playing alright football.

So we go from putting a lot of pressure on with Fangio to limited pressure with Pagano.....Hmmmmm?

How can you say the scheme hasn’t changed? Fangios scheme is totally different from Paganos and it shows. So what if a rookie is being picked on. He was standing his ground and playing pretty damn well. Of course he made rookie mistakes though. Losing Kwiat and sticking with Danny T is not that big of a deal. Kwiat is a good player, nothing special.
 

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Yes, he's not as good of a DC as fangio was. Few are, fangio was fantastic for years. Thats not a slight at pagano.

The major difference in this defense has nothing to do with playcalling or scheme, it all has to do with talent. Legit the opposite of our major issues on the offensive side of the ball. People blame pagano for not being aggressive, but don't understand why he can't be. It's all talent, we don't have the linebacker/db talent to blitz on a regular basis against good QB's.

On the dline, we have no real nose tackle. Hicks is getting doubled up a lot more. Nichols, while playing great, isn't a difference maker. The loss of Eddie Goldman shows up hard in the run game.

For linebackers, the only one playing well is roquan. He's having an all pro year, outside of that mack is having the worst year of his career. Granted, his worst year still makes a ton of previous #1 bears edge rushers look like jokes, but you expect more from him based on the cap hit. Quinn is mostly worthless. Seems like he's either hurt or doesn't fit this scheme. Danny T is a complete liability in pass coverage nowadays, and can't shed a block anymore. Thats where the goldman loss hurts the most. Lineman are getting to the second level, and its hurting Danny the most. He's just not athletic enough to get around slow ass linemen anymore.

In the secondary, fuller is having a great year. Lowest completion % of his career. There are no turnovers, however. Why? No pressures. We were bottom five in the NFL in pressures before the last couple weeks, now we are in the mid teens. That's still terrible considering what we have invested in the guys who should be rushing the QB.

Jaylon is fantastic for a rookie, but he has had plenty of mental lapses, which is to be expected. I can't critique him since he shouldn't have been put into this position this early. That Artie burns injury really hurt the secondary.

Outside of that, everyone in this secondary is trash. Legit trash. Skrine is one of the worst slot CB's in the league. Eddie is one of the worst FS's in the league. Gipson is decent, but worse than the last two SS's we had play next to jackson. The young guys are being thrown to the fire.

Overall, you can scapegoat whoever you want, but at the end of the day to me this feels no different from when the cubs tried to blame hitting and pitching coaches for their players inabilities. The issues on defense are all talent based. These guys just suck compared to 2018. Some fell off a cliff, some of them are new players who just suck. Either way, this isn't that talented of a D anymore.
You typed a lot of words. Few make sense. Did you forget the green font?
 

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This is either a troll thread or op is straight up Special person
Why is it either or? Special person troll seems like a distinct possibility to me.
 

Bust

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Bears just have too many weak links in the run defense dept. Aside from missing Goldman, Floyd is far better over Quinn against the run. Bears also have 2 weak safeties who will never fill the hole. Eddie Jackson for one is an ankle diver.

This game comes down to Mitch and the offense.
 

ChiKhan

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Difference is BB drafted poorly. Which is fact.

Pace was hitting home runs on the defensive side. Difference is, goldman sitting out hurts us majorly in the run game. Eddie declining hurts us majorly in the pass game. Skrine being the worst cb in the league hurts us majorly in the pass game. In 2018 we had the best DB's in football, now we have a bunch of scrubs.
I'd argue when Jaylon is healthy him and Fuller are a better duo at corner on the outside then Fuller and Prince. Sure Callahan is better then skrine but why does skrine somehow every game he plays gets matched up 1 on 1 with no help against the opposing teams best receiver with that's a scheme issue. Playing 12 yards deep in the secondary when the offense needs 6 yards for a first is a scheme issue. How do you expect to get pressures when your leaving guys wide open for easy dump offs and their getting 1st downs.


2nd and 17 and the opposing QB makes a 2 yard pass that goes for 15 because everybody is playing so deep is a scheme issue.
 

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