Great read on Bears

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RustedShut

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PRESSURE POINT - KC JOYNER

There are certain things in life I am positive I will never understand.

After reading multiple books on the subject, I still cannot say that I fully grasp the principles of quantum mechanics. I also have trouble getting my mind around the idea that, although the universe is possibly expanding at a velocity greater than the speed of light and therefore could have expanded at that rate during the "Big Bang," we know for certain that the universe is around 13 billion years old.

As mind-bending as those imponderables are, they pale in comparison to understanding the mindset of Chicago Bears fans.
I came to this conclusion after they ran Rex Grossman out of town. Grossman certainly had his flaws (he was that rare breed of quarterback who could post five bad decisions in a single game), but he did notch a 17-6 record in his first four seasons with the team. He also had more than a few good games in 2005-06 while leading the Bears to their first NFC championship victory in 21 years. In return, these achievements got him the unending enmity of the Bears fans, a quick ticket to the bench and eventually a plane ticket out of the Windy City.
Had the Grossman incident been the only item on this list, it could be simply seen as an anomaly, but Chicago's faithful seem to be doing the same thing to Matt Forte. They say his performance fell off dramatically in his sophomore campaign, but a closer look at the game tape and metrics indicates that Forte's play did not really drop off and that he actually outperformed his more highly touted (and much higher-paid) backfield teammate Chester Taylor.

Let's start with an analysis of Forte's performance. The crux of the argument in favor of his game having dropped off is a decrease in rush yards per attempt (YPA). In 2008-09, Forte tallied a 3.9 YPA mark. In 2009-10, that total fell to 3.6 YPA; that's a drop-off of eight percent.

What is perplexing about using this as the central statistical basis for claiming Forte's downfall is that it doesn't take into account receiving yardage; his YPA in that area jumped from a 7.6 mark in 2008 to 8.3 in 2009-10.

Another way to look at this: add his rushing and receiving yardage totals together to tally his yards from scrimmage. Forte gained 4.5 YPA from scrimmage in 2008-09 and 4.4 in 2009-10. One-tenth of a yard over the course of a 400-touch season would be a mere 40 yards, or a little over two yards per game.

His overall performance from scrimmage did not significantly drop off.
Forte's rushing performance also didn't really drop off over the past two seasons, as based on a study I just completed on the YPA totals of running backs when given good blocking this past season; the study is based on tape analysis of every running play from the 2009-10 campaign.

The specifics of this analysis are quite detailed, but here's the basic breakdown: I credited each blocker with a Point of Attack (POA) "win" if they create a lane for the runner to go through. If they don't create that lane, I'd give them a "loss."

Running plays that have at least one POA loss are notched under the poor-blocking category, while plays with zero POA losses are listed as good-blocking runs.

Here's how bad the Bears' offensive line was: Forte got "good blocking" on 53.5 percent of his runs last season. That was sixth-worst in the league among backs with at least 100 carries; essentially, Forte received some of the worst blocking of any starting RB in the NFL.

If that metric weren't enough to take some of the pressure off of Forte, consider this: In 2008-09, Forte gained 5.6 YPA on running plays with good blocking. His total in this category in 2009-10? 5.6 YPA, or exactly what he gained in his highly touted rookie campaign.

Despite all of this, Forte has not only taken the brunt of the non-Jay Cutler bashing around Chicago, but he has to split carries with Taylor as well.

The frustrating part of this is Taylor did an even worse job in the good-blocking YPA category last year. He gained only 5.2 yards on plays of that nature, or nearly one-half yard less than Forte.

Add all of it up and it equals a situation where Forte could be in the same boat as Grossman. Chicago's fans seemed to have their minds made up about Rex and simply waited to pounce on him once he started struggling. That is one of the reasons the Bears' organization gave up on Grossman.

If the higher-ups at Halas Hall don't take steps to steel their minds against that happening, they could end up seeing Forte pull a Cedric Benson and give another team Pro Bowl-caliber backfield play.

KC Joyner, aka the Football Scientist, is a regular contributor to ESPN Insider. He also can be found on Twitter @kcjoynertfs and at his website. He is also the author of "Blindsided: Why the Left Tackle is Overrated and Other Contrarian Football Thoughts."
 

payton 34ever

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I said this all last year - Forte was HURT last year. It was clear as day if you watched his tentativeness when it came to trying to cut and go off a block. I expect him to have a HUGE season this year with his better health and his ability to catch the ball out of the backfield in a Martz offense.
 

USCChiFan

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I said this all last year - Forte was HURT last year. It was clear as day if you watched his tentativeness when it came to trying to cut and go off a block. I expect him to have a HUGE season this year with his better health and his ability to catch the ball out of the backfield in a Martz offense.
While I agree, the O-Line was horrendous last season. Pace and LT, Williams completely out of place at RT, Kreutz was hurt all season, and Omiyale was a disaster at LG. If Omiyale is better at RT and the O-Line can actually open holes for Forte, then he and Chester Taylor will have solid seasons
 

FQD1911

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i'm the biggest Matt Forte fan out there and have been saying that Matt's season wasn't his fault. like 'SC said, he was hurt & had SHITTY blocking all season. hell, what do you expect the man to do when he has a linebacker/d-lineman in his face when he gets the ball?

but Joyner is wrong a/b CB. dude was a troublemaker in the locker room, didn't try on the field, and was a cancer off the field. i'll take Matty over half the RBs in the league right now (including AP). why? b/c he doesn't run upright, meaning he's going to have a longer career.

also, him splitting carries w/ CT only means his career will be lengthened...whereas by the time CT's contract runs out, Forte will either be near his prime or JUST entering it. i see Matt playing for the Bears for the duration of his career (as it should be).
 

Lefty

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Ok, you go ahead and take Matt Forte and I'll take Purple Jesus. Thanks.
 

FQD1911

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go right ahead. and take the fumbles & non-pass blocking too.
 

Anytime23

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It was obvious since the preseason that the blocking gave Forte no chance. That combined with his knee injury was a recipe for failure.
 

Gustavus Adolphus

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My favorite teams
  1. Chicago White Sox
  1. Chicago Bulls
  1. Chicago Bears
  1. Nebraska Cornhuskers
  2. Villanova Wildcats
What KC Joyner has confirmed is what I've been saying for a very long time: Bears fans are the absolute worst.
 

Lefty

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What KC Joyner has confirmed is what I've been saying for a very long time: Bears fans are the absolute worst.

Yeah, I have come to find there are a LOT of mouth-breathers that come out of the woods when Bears football is being discussed. They make the hardcore anti-stat guys look like good standing members of the Billy Beane Faithful. Case-in-point: Bears fans saying the would gladly take Matt Forte over Adrian Peterson. Also all the Butkus (spelling is probably wrong, but I don't really give a shit) and Ditka love. It all comes together to sometimes make me really ashamed that I list myself a Bears fan.
 

FQD1911

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Yeah, I have come to find there are a LOT of mouth-breathers that come out of the woods when Bears football is being discussed. They make the hardcore anti-stat guys look like good standing members of the Billy Beane Faithful. Case-in-point: Bears fans saying the would gladly take Matt Forte over Adrian Peterson. Also all the Butkus (spelling is probably wrong, but I don't really give a shit) and Ditka love. It all comes together to sometimes make me really ashamed that I list myself a Bears fan.

1) if you're going to talk shit about me, don't do it in a passive-aggressive way...drop your nuts and call my name out
2) LEFTY, it's pretty funny how you're dismissing my comments being that you know nothing of my sports knowledge. i bet you only started watching AP since the Vikings huh? watched his whole career at Oklahoma and he has a running style similar to Darren McFadden (expect he's elusive).

in the history of upright runners, I can only name 2 that had lengthy careers: Eric Dickerson (freak of nature), & Eddie George (and he was injury-plagued). AP is without a doubt the top 2 RBs in the league, but i'm thinking long-term. one day, he's going to get popped really good and be out for a whole year (see junior year at Oklahoma when he broke his collarbone).

another thing: if by you hearing another man's opinion about a sports team makes you question your fanhood of that team, sounds like you're on-the-bubble fan. everyone's entitled to their opinion (just like my opinion of your passive-aggressiveness is some bullshit), but at least be willing to have intelligent discourse about it.*

*fully expecting you to comment on my cursing and talking a/b "intelligent discourse." your move sailor.
 

Lefty

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1) if you're going to talk shit about me, don't do it in a passive-aggressive way...drop your nuts and call my name out

I thought I already had called you out on that previously; but in any case, the statement that got your panties in a twist was more directed at all the Bears fans that say they would take Forte over Purple Jesus and his ilk (as you are not the only person I've heard say that). Calm down.

2) LEFTY, it's pretty funny how you're dismissing my comments being that you know nothing of my sports knowledge.

Oh but I can guess. And for the most part I've been fairly accurate in my discerning of peoples' sports knowledge. But hey, everybody deserves a chance, right?

i bet you only started watching AP since the Vikings huh?

Wrong, but my answering this question does not mean I am vindicating it as a barometer for someone's specific knowledge about a specific player. This must be a prelude to a "dah, I've watched dis guy since da da-da da-da and let me tell you something..." quip.

watched his whole career at Oklahoma

Called it.

and he has a running style similar to Darren McFadden (expect he's elusive).

Well, it appears, to me anyways, that elusiveness is a pretty big quality teams do/should look for in back. Obviously there are other things they take into account and assign more weight to (as well they should), but elusiveness is also a pretty big selling point for most teams.

So to say that "dah, he's like Player X but elusive" is akin to saying "he's like this guy but better in a pretty important category for players at his position".

in the history of upright runners, I can only name 2 that had lengthy careers: Eric Dickerson (freak of nature), & Eddie George (and he was injury-plagued).

So YOU can only name two guys? Son of a bitch. I'm out. :rolleyes:

AP is without a doubt the top 2 RBs in the league, but i'm thinking long-term. one day, he's going to get popped really good and be out for a whole year (see junior year at Oklahoma when he broke his collarbone).

Ok, but now you're changing the parameters in which your statement was made. Before, you said you would take Forte over AP straight up, with no indication of your eye being on long-term value. If you want to talk long-term that's fine, and you can definitely make a compelling case in that context, but as it stands now you're just backpedaling from your original ludicrous statement.

another thing: if by you hearing another man's completely ridiculous and asinine notions about a sports team makes you question your fanhood of that team, sounds like you're a pretty intelligent fan who doesn't have the time nor the inclination to deal with the constant bombardments from a Special person fan base, myself included.

I fixed it for you.

everyone's entitled to their opinion (just like my opinion of your passive-aggressiveness is some bullshit), but at least be willing to have intelligent discourse about it.*

*fully expecting you to comment on my cursing and talking a/b "intelligent discourse." your move sailor.

Follow me around the boards for a bit, you'll see that I am one of the few on this board that is all about intelligent discourse.
 
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FQD1911

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I thought I already had called you out on that previously; but in any case, the statement that got your panties in a twist was more directed at all the Bears fans that say they would take Forte over Purple Jesus and his ilk (as you are not the only person I've heard say that). Calm down.

o so you're an AP lover? gotcha...glad that's cleared up. and i am calm sir. see the smiling face :)

Oh but I can guess. And for the most part I've been fairly accurate in my discerning of peoples' sports knowledge. But hey, everybody deserves a chance, right?

you have huh? so we could call you Nostradamus huh?

Wrong, but my answering this question does not mean I am vindicating it as a barometer for someone's specific knowledge about a specific player. This must be a prelude to a "dah, I've watched dis guy since da da-da da-da and let me tell you something..." quip.

score 2 for Nostra!

Called it.

Nostradamus strikes again!!!! :crazydance:

Well, it appears, to me anyways, that elusiveness is a pretty big quality teams do/should look for in back. Obviously there are other things they take into account and assign more weight to (as well they should), but elusiveness is also a pretty big selling point for most teams.

if you look at Matt's rookie season, he's shown that he's elusive. but if i had to pick who's the more elusive back, it would be AP.

So to say that "dah, he's like Player X but elusive" is akin to saying "he's like this guy but better in a pretty important category for players at his position".

pretty sure if you asked an NFL scout which would you rather have: an elusive back or a back w/ minimal fumbilitis, he'll go w/ the latter.

So YOU can only name two guys? Son of a bitch. I'm out. :rolleyes:

*taking note that :rolleyes: means you couldn't think of anybody* next time just say "i can't think of anyone else" :)

Ok, but now you're changing the parameters in which your statement was made. Before, you said you would take Forte over AP straight up, with no indication of your eye being on long-term value. If you want to talk long-term that's fine, and you can definitely make a compelling case in that context, but as it stands now you're just backpedaling from your original ludicrous statement.

umm...how so? you made a statement talking down to my assertion w/o asking the parameters of where i was going with that (when in fact i did take into account abilities long-term). your assumption = your fault. (and next time, if you're unclear...ask a question. i assume you've been doing it since grade school right)

I fixed it for you.

so not only are you Nostradamus, you're an editor also? damn...yet another renaissance man on the Earth!!!! hey can you invent things too?

Follow me around the boards for a bit, you'll see that I am one of the few on this board that is all about intelligent discourse.

on following you around the boards: i'll have my people call your people.

*o and when you get some time, ask the Man upstairs why you're calling an NFL player "Purple Jesus;" pretty sure that will be a great conversation.*
 
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ClydeLee

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If you actually look at the list of "upright" runners and find their careers they actually aren't frequently injury prone or suffering of short careers as most people always try to say. That's always fought up people bringing up the ones without actual talent who think it proves their point. Chris Brown was never very good nor would of been injury or not.

Being at a message board, talking to a fan, or being around a fan doesn't make you any more or less of a fan nor have to take your time because it's a personal choice to participate into that conversation and can be entirely separate to consider someone a fan.
 

ClydeLee

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Also, since when was AP JUST more elisuive than Forte? I missed the games in the last two seasons or even prior when Forte had the power and leg strength to power through piles and walk over numerous tacklers or the upper body ability to shed tacklers. I like Forte but he is a average at best pure runner, his top ability is from his receiving and blocking skill.
 

FQD1911

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@Clyde i can respect that.
 

Lefty

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o so you're an AP lover? gotcha...glad that's cleared up. and i am calm sir. see the smiling face :)



you have huh? so we could call you Nostradamus huh?



score 2 for Nostra!



Nostradamus strikes again!!!! :crazydance:



if you look at Matt's rookie season, he's shown that he's elusive. but if i had to pick who's the more elusive back, it would be AP.



pretty sure if you asked an NFL scout which would you rather have: an elusive back or a back w/ minimal fumbilitis, he'll go w/ the latter.



*taking note that :rolleyes: means you couldn't think of anybody* next time just say "i can't think of anyone else" :)



umm...how so? you made a statement talking down to my assertion w/o asking the parameters of where i was going with that (when in fact i did take into account abilities long-term). your assumption = your fault. (and next time, if you're unclear...ask a question. i assume you've been doing it since grade school right)



so not only are you Nostradamus, you're an editor also? damn...yet another renaissance man on the Earth!!!! hey can you invent things too?



on following you around the boards: i'll have my people call your people.

*o and when you get some time, ask the Man upstairs why you're calling an NFL player "Purple Jesus;" pretty sure that will be a great conversation.*

warfgif.gif


I keep telling rush "don't recruit by simply spamming message boards, that's how you get retards posting on your shit". Apparently he has yet to heed my advice.
 

FQD1911

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lol you're a clown lefty. case closed.
 

Lefty

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Good one, buddy. You sure showed me. Have fun blowing your load to pictures of Dick Butkus and fantasizing about getting your shit pushed in by Mike Ditka on the Halas Hall practice field.
 

MRN

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Cliff notes?

From what I see he is trying to argue that Forte is better than AP or something?
 
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