Harbaugh or Daboll?

JoJoBoxer

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My point is Daboll isn’t the guy to Coach up Justin or be the next head coach of the Bears. Offensive coordinator sure but to run the whole team? I’m not sold on him.
Yeah, I had a large post where I said all that.

Daboll would be doing something he never did before while getting lesser coordinators as his OC and DC.

Harbaugh has already been there done that.
 

Leomaz

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What happens if the Bills get crushed by the next opponent?
 

Canth

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LOL! So have guys like Matt Patricia. How'd that work out for him as a HC????

The rather large difference here is that DaBoll has coached at places other than NE - and for a significant amount of time. Patricia only ever coached for Belichick.
 

TL1961

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You mean besides himzelf and/or Greg Roman?
OK I’ll bite. Somebody tell me why all the love for Greg Roman on CCS and try to reconcile that with the complete lack of silence of national media discussing Greg Roman as a candidate anywhere at all

I think we’re tending to give Greg Roman a lot more credit than he probably deserves while nitpicking some other candidates and I don’t understand it.

Maybe I’m missing it I just don’t remember the Harbaugh Greg Roman Niners being an offensive juggernaut but I haven’t looked it up so if I’m wrong please let me know. Where did they rank offensively in the time that Harbaugh was in San Francisco?
 

Canth

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OK I’ll bite. Somebody tell me why all the love for Greg Roman on CCS and try to reconcile that with the complete lack of silence of national media discussing Greg Roman as a candidate anywhere at all

I think we’re tending to give Greg Roman a lot more credit than he probably deserves while nitpicking some other candidates and I don’t understand it.

Maybe I’m missing it I just don’t remember the Harbaugh Greg Roman Niners being an offensive juggernaut but I haven’t looked it up so if I’m wrong please let me know. Where did they rank offensively in the time that Harbaugh was in San Francisco?

They weren't. They had a top 10 rushing game and a bottom 5 passing attack paired with a Top 3 defense. I posted the numbers somewhere, don't remember which thread now.
 

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The rather large difference here is that DaBoll has coached at places other than NE - and for a significant amount of time. Patricia only ever coached for Belichick.
Except you said that since he was an assistant on 5 NE championship teams that he's seen what it takes to win. So have many other assistants on those NE staffs that have become head coaches and that didn't help them win.
 

mikeyk

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No thanks on Daboll.. I didn't see nearly enough shotgun runs, curl routes or wide receiver screens on third and long in last night's game. Also, not nearly enough discussion about the why's in his postgame comments
 
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TL1961

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I think one key thought many are emphasizing is to not get caught up on any candidate over one game or the most recent thing you've seen, and I would agree with that.

A lot has been said about Daboll and other cacnddates' records prior to the current stop. In Daboll's case, many say "he's only done it with Josh Allen", giving Allen all the credit, and not considering Allen's improvement can be somewhat due to his coach.

Keep in mind, a coach who does not have the players with a high enough level of talent to run all his plays can't call all the plays he would like to. What good does it do to put into a gameplan plays a QB can't make?

I want a coach who can scheme around a weakness, so my QB doesn't get killed taking deep drops with a terrible O line, for example. I want a coach who isn't so stubborn he will keep calling his "pet plays" in spite of the personnel who may not be suited for them.

Some have pointed to Daboll not running enough which to me seems like a legit concern at times. Others post that they want an OC that will "emphasize the run" which makes me think - fairly or not - they are stuck in the 80's. The NFL today is about passing the ball. That doesn't mean the ability to run is not a plus, but any OC or HC who says, in today's NFL "we get off the bus running the ball" needs to be shown the door.

In short, if the Bears are fortunate enough to literally be choosing between Daboll and Harbaugh, we will all be pretty happy.

I think we overstate the offenses under Harbaugh, but he has had team success to be sure, and he has clearly, at the very least, proven to be head coach material, which is always a question mark with coordinators getting promoted.

We can nitpick any coach's success - Harbaugh had Andrew friggin' Luck at Stanford for example, and Daboll has Josh Allen. (Interesting to point out however, a year ago, Josh Allen was being questioned as to whether he could ever be the guy and suddenly he's Brady 2.0!)

If a coach has been successful when he gets the guys who can run his sytem, that is what we should be looking for. Not knocking the because they "only won when they had guys who could run their system".

The Bears need both. No team wins without both. First, get the coach who "can only win with guys who are good", and then get those guys.

There are a lot of coaches who do NOT win with talented personnel. Let's not diss the guys who are succeeding.
 

Canth

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Except you said that since he was an assistant on 5 NE championship teams that he's seen what it takes to win. So have many other assistants on those NE staffs that have become head coaches and that didn't help them win.

I also added in the National Title with Saban. I think it was a different post that I mentioned liking he had coached in other places and for position groups other than QB. It gets mixed together...

After having a night to think about it, I would still be interested to see DaBoll be the guy, but I would not lose sleep if they went a different direction. As I said in the main GM/HC article, I want the GM first and I want that to be the guy that hires the coach.

Neither Harbaugh or DaBoll are going to be successful in Chicago if the roster being built sucks or makes no sense. And they will both be very dependent on who they hire as coordinators.
 

TL1961

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Regarding Harbaugh, for nitpicking sake:

"Harbaugh was first Michigan coach to win 10 games in each of his first two years" is irrelevant. I mean, winning 10 games is good, but whether or not any other UM coach had done so means nothing in regards to Harbaugh's ability.

Is it relevant in pointing out what a difficult accomplishment that is? Well, let's not forget colleges play one more regular season game than they used to, plus potentially a conference championship (this year, for Harbaugh for the first time in BT), then the bowl game - so in some cases, two additional games.
 

TL1961

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Rambling thoughts regarding coaches' backgrounds -

Generally speaking, coaching under a smart, successful coach is a good thing, even if not a guarantee of success for the assistant moving up.

Steve Kerr coached under Phil Jackson and Greg Popovich, and has been highly successful. (with great players) Lots of coaches in college football under Hayden Fry went on to great success.

And not every coach who ever serves on a staff of a great coach will himself end up with a great record.

And no matter how good the coach, having the right personnel will ALWAYS be a key factor in their success. Andy Reid has been successful and suddenly his assistants became hot commodities. Eric Bienemy coaches Mahomes, Hill and Kelce. When he gets a HC gig, he will have a roster without them. And his offense will not be as good as KC's, at least initially. Does that mean he forgot how to coach? Got too much credit in KC? Neither. It's about the personnel.

Coaches aren't magicians.
 

TL1961

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I also added in the National Title with Saban. I think it was a different post that I mentioned liking he had coached in other places and for position groups other than QB. It gets mixed together...

After having a night to think about it, I would still be interested to see DaBoll be the guy, but I would not lose sleep if they went a different direction. As I said in the main GM/HC article, I want the GM first and I want that to be the guy that hires the coach.

Neither Harbaugh or DaBoll are going to be successful in Chicago if the roster being built sucks or makes no sense. And they will both be very dependent on who they hire as coordinators.
Yes, the Bears will need a GM.

Let's discuss coaching candidates with the assumption that a) the Bears will have a GM, and b) the coach will not also be the GM.

Because those are givens.
 

Novoitus

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Why not both? The Bears have been losers for years, why not try something different and hire two head coaches?
Think about it
 

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I've never had more sense of impending doom and foreboding disaster than right now for the Bears next front office and coaches.
 

TL1961

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By the way, for the "Daboll gets away from the run" crowd

Bills were 6th in the NFL in rushing yards, and 15th in attempts.
 

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