It’s time for Hawks to separate from Bowman

MassHavoc

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Perfect time to get rid of him was when we lucked out with the number 3 pick. Right now it would be nice to get rid of him even if it’s not for performance reasons like op brings up. But next gm is left with a roster constructed like playing a damn video game. Wish they would have forced him to resign or threaten to fire him when all these allegations first popped up
Perfect timing would have been when mcgrinch was canned. Cleaned house.
 

greg23

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The issue here Greg is your thinking about the Hawks as a fan, you wear the blindfold, and in reference to black cloud, whenever a subject comes up about the team, the first question is always about the allegation. When Fluery, Johnson and Jones were brought here, the media bombarded Bowman with questions not about his new acquisitions but what happened in 2010. If you don’t see that as an issue I am not sure what can be said.
How can the players be implicate, no one is at this point.

No, the issue is you're being over dramatic about the on ice results which led to a Stanley Cup.

You've said that will always be tainted because of these...allegations (at this point)

Whatever the result is; it has no bearing on what happened on the ice and nobody will look at it that way.

You've also said the "allegations" will cause a dark could to hover over that title....again, not true and dramatic.

Those things can apply to certain individuals who may have done nothing, covered it up, etc......but this isn't an on ice issue that will raise any doubt about what happened on the ice.......so......

NO

Nothing will be tainted
 

Raskolnikov

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Am I supposed to be impressed with any aspect of this franchise right now?

Drafting? Nope.
Systems of play? NOPE.
Signings. Nope.


They better get some competent overhaul in soon. It's going to take a decade to achieve a talent surplus again as it is. And you really need a surplus to push all your chips in.

Getting nothing for a Pious Suter is normal around here. It shouldn't be.
 

Raskolnikov

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I was impressed with their effort this year despite not playing hockey with a properly built and balanced team.

I think a 7 team league is a bit more exciting for a team of rookies though.

We'll see.

These moves reek of desperation and Jones is going to be standing there taking the heat for Bowman when it fails.

Maybe we will be a modicum better for 1 year, but I expect mixed returns and a deadline firesale followed by 3-7 years of bottom feeding.
 

hawkinmontreal

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No, the issue is you're being over dramatic about the on ice results which led to a Stanley Cup.

You've said that will always be tainted because of these...allegations (at this point)

Whatever the result is; it has no bearing on what happened on the ice and nobody will look at it that way.

You've also said the "allegations" will cause a dark could to hover over that title....again, not true and dramatic.

Those things can apply to certain individuals who may have done nothing, covered it up, etc......but this isn't an on ice issue that will raise any doubt about what happened on the ice.......so......

NO

Nothing will be tainted
That’s your opinion and only yours. How on earth can anyone be over dramatic with an issue as serious as this, . I am sorry that a cup championship is more important to you and only you, and once again, your implying, nobody will look at it this way, your wrong, do Your research. As I have said, majority of people don’t give a shit about hockey, but they certainly care about issues such as this.
Hockey USA is involved now, the story just keeps escalating and more media attention is being brought forward. I respect your humble opinion Greg, we will leave it at that.
 
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greg23

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That’s your opinion and only yours. How on earth can anyone be over dramatic with an issue as serious as this, . I am sorry that a cup championship is more important to you and only you, and once again, your implying, nobody will look at it this way, your wrong, do Your research. As I have said, majority of people don’t give a shit about hockey, but they certainly care about issues such as this.
Hockey USA is involved now, the story just keeps escalating and more media attention is being brought forward. I respect your humble opinion Greg, we will leave it at that.


You're mixing two separate issues

Nobody said this isn't a serious issue or a Stanly Cup is more (or less) important......but this issue doesn't effect what took place on the ice; that title won't be cheapened; there won't be an asterisk; there won't be questions of its validity.

Not sure why you make that connection.
 

hawkinmontreal

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You're mixing two separate issues

Nobody said this isn't a serious issue or a Stanly Cup is more (or less) important......but this issue doesn't effect what took place on the ice; that title won't be cheapened; there won't be an asterisk; there won't be questions of its validity.

Not sure why you make that connection.
The issues are one of the same, anything involved in this case involves that 2010 team. You are correct there will be no asterisk attached to the team.
Let me throw this one at you, even though Kaner was innocent and all charges were dropped in his alleged rape case, do hockey fans look at Kaner the same way since that, no they don’t. there are always fans and individuals that relate him to that case, as the same way many fans and individuals will relate this sexual abuse scandal to the 2010 team, that’s all I am saying in a nutshell, that same 2010 team that won the cup. There title will always be legit no debate there, but there on ice triumph will always relate back to what happened off ice. Let the case unfold further and let’s see what transpires.
 

dbldrew

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The issues are one of the same, anything involved in this case involves that 2010 team. You are correct there will be no asterisk attached to the team.
Let me throw this one at you, even though Kaner was innocent and all charges were dropped in his alleged rape case, do hockey fans look at Kaner the same way since that, no they don’t. there are always fans and individuals that relate him to that case, as the same way many fans and individuals will relate this sexual abuse scandal to the 2010 team, that’s all I am saying in a nutshell, that same 2010 team that won the cup. There title will always be legit no debate there, but there on ice triumph will always relate back to what happened off ice. Let the case unfold further and let’s see what transpires.
why would hockey fans look at Kane differently because some crazy chick tried to scam him?
 

hawkinmontreal

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why would hockey fans look at Kane differently because some crazy chick tried to scam him?
people dont give a shit about some entitled hockey player, or the fact that some crazy chick tried to scam him. He was involved scam or not, mass majority don’t care his history will always have that on his record.
You know try reading once in a while what people have to say about him, ranging from that issue to the cabbie issue, he is not well respected. There is world outside of Chicago.
 

dbldrew

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people dont give a shit about some entitled hockey player, or the fact that some crazy chick tried to scam him. He was involved scam or not, mass majority don’t care his history will always have that on his record.
You know try reading once in a while what people have to say about him, ranging from that issue to the cabbie issue, he is not well respected. There is world outside of Chicago.
you realize you have just destroyed your original post with this line of thinking. if people still think badly of PK because of a crazy chick then there is no point in trying to get rid of Bowman, sounds like the "Dark Cloud" will always be there regardless of what the Hawks do.. If PK cant clear his name with DNA evidence and the scam being exposed, then the Blackhawks wont be able to "clear" their name either by getting rid of Bowman so why bother trying to appease the unappeasable?
 

hawkinmontreal

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you realize you have just destroyed your original post with this line of thinking. if people still think badly of PK because of a crazy chick then there is no point in trying to get rid of Bowman, sounds like the "Dark Cloud" will always be there regardless of what the Hawks do.. If PK cant clear his name with DNA evidence and the scam being exposed, then the Blackhawks wont be able to "clear" their name either by getting rid of Bowman so why bother trying to appease the unappeasable?
It comes down to this, by keeping Bowman, the Chicago Blackhawks are justifying his actions as GM to sweep away a sexual abuse scandal, rather than dealing with it head on. They should be condoning his actions, this gives the franchise a misrepresentation of where they stand in relation to the alleged victims lawsuit versus the team. No one knows what the fallout will be in the end, but as it stands the Hawks aren't doing much to clean up the mess there GM created. As long as Bowman is at the helm, Rocky is saying we stand by our GM regardless of his actions, even if those actions can result in one's life being ruined due to the fact nothing was done at the time. So no, I did not destroy my original post.
 

blackpep72

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you realize you have just destroyed your original post with this line of thinking. if people still think badly of PK because of a crazy chick then there is no point in trying to get rid of Bowman, sounds like the "Dark Cloud" will always be there regardless of what the Hawks do.. If PK cant clear his name with DNA evidence and the scam being exposed, then the Blackhawks wont be able to "clear" their name either by getting rid of Bowman so why bother trying to appease the unappeasable?
There is also a difference between a player and a GM. All things being equal the GM casts a larger shadow.
 

BEARZOMBIE

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people dont give a shit about some entitled hockey player, or the fact that some crazy chick tried to scam him. He was involved scam or not, mass majority don’t care his history will always have that on his record.
You know try reading once in a while what people have to say about him, ranging from that issue to the cabbie issue, he is not well respected. There is world outside of Chicago.
Not hockey but let’s look at the Watson situation and I’m sure to many it tarnished his career. To me it absolutely didn’t. I don’t think he did anything wrong. Most of the time these players aren’t in the wrong they just aren’t careful enough for these shady ass scams these hood rats come up with. Same when it happened to Kobe. I’m pretty sure many won’t like what I say on that but it’s the truth they are millionaire young men they have targets on their backs.

but bowman is a grown man letting this shit slide to me tarnished his legacy. Which is mostly a legacy stolen from the previous gm. He should be kicked to the curb.
 

hawkinmontreal

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Not hockey but let’s look at the Watson situation and I’m sure to many it tarnished his career. To me it absolutely didn’t. I don’t think he did anything wrong. Most of the time these players aren’t in the wrong they just aren’t careful enough for these shady ass scams these hood rats come up with. Same when it happened to Kobe. I’m pretty sure many won’t like what I say on that but it’s the truth they are millionaire young men they have targets on their backs.

but bowman is a grown man letting this shit slide to me tarnished his legacy. Which is mostly a legacy stolen from the previous gm. He should be kicked to the curb.
Fair enough about Kaner, you are right, maybe I used a poor example, but you 100% correct about Bowman.
 

dbldrew

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It comes down to this, by keeping Bowman, the Chicago Blackhawks are justifying his actions as GM to sweep away a sexual abuse scandal, rather than dealing with it head on. They should be condoning his actions, this gives the franchise a misrepresentation of where they stand in relation to the alleged victims lawsuit versus the team. No one knows what the fallout will be in the end, but as it stands the Hawks aren't doing much to clean up the mess there GM created. As long as Bowman is at the helm, Rocky is saying we stand by our GM regardless of his actions, even if those actions can result in one's life being ruined due to the fact nothing was done at the time. So no, I did not destroy my original post.
I agree but this has nothing to do with your op about the 2010 cup being tainted. and then counter arguing against your own post by pointing out that your idea would not work.

You made 2 points here, one is the 2010 cup run is tainted and they need to get rid of Bowman to fix that.
And your other point was PK legacy was also tainted even though there was overwhelming evidence he did nothing wrong.

So your PK point ruins your OP idea. If PK still has a tainted legacy even after DNA evidence cleared him and her scam was exposed. then there is no hope of removing the taint of the 2010 season by getting rid of Bowman, the example you gave ruins your op idea..

And for the record I'm not advocating keeping Bowman, I also happen to completely disagree on your take on PK and his legacy..
 

hawkinmontreal

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I agree but this has nothing to do with your op about the 2010 cup being tainted. and then counter arguing against your own post by pointing out that your idea would not work.

You made 2 points here, one is the 2010 cup run is tainted and they need to get rid of Bowman to fix that.
And your other point was PK legacy was also tainted even though there was overwhelming evidence he did nothing wrong.

So your PK point ruins your OP idea. If PK still has a tainted legacy even after DNA evidence cleared him and her scam was exposed. then there is no hope of removing the taint of the 2010 season by getting rid of Bowman, the example you gave ruins your op idea..

And for the record I'm not advocating keeping Bowman, I also happen to completely disagree on your take on PK and his legacy..
I never said anything about PK legacy, I said there was a stigma attached to his name due to the alleged rape, people don't forget as they never forget his cabbie experience either. He will.alwaya be one of the greatest American born hockey players to ever lace em up, however his off-ice stories will always be with him. What is that so difficult for you to understand?
You just can't wrapp your head around the idea that off ice issues are associated with on ice issues.
Getting rid of Bowman, does clear the taint, rhe team would be disassociating themselves from the person who put the team in the position they are currently in. No one will argue that OJ Simpson wasn't a great RB, but the man is a piece of garbage, and everyone knows that, why because of his off field activities. The same relates to Kane, his past troubles will always stay with him, as rhe 2010 team will always be connected to JohnDoe and his alleged abuse scandal.
 

KBIB

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My opinion you have to put Blowman in moth balls until this is all released publicly.

If the Blackhawks were smart, they would keep Stan away from any open live mic until the process is over. The lawyer is doing everything possible to drag the Hawks and Rick Westhead is doing a ridiculous job keeping this story current and should be commended in not letting it die. , which I’m sure the NHL wishes would happen.

All in all, it’s going to come down to what the lawyer team the Hawks paid for finds in their investigation, what they actually release in to the public, and most important, what effect it has on season tickets. The odds this case gets thrown out are better then it actually going to trial. If they didn’t pump Stans breaks before all the moves he made, they’re not gonna get rid of him now.
 

dbldrew

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I never said anything about PK legacy, I said there was a stigma attached to his name due to the alleged rape, people don't forget as they never forget his cabbie experience either. He will.alwaya be one of the greatest American born hockey players to ever lace em up, however his off-ice stories will always be with him. What is that so difficult for you to understand?
You just can't wrapp your head around the idea that off ice issues are associated with on ice issues.
Getting rid of Bowman, does clear the taint, rhe team would be disassociating themselves from the person who put the team in the position they are currently in. No one will argue that OJ Simpson wasn't a great RB, but the man is a piece of garbage, and everyone knows that, why because of his off field activities. The same relates to Kane, his past troubles will always stay with him, as rhe 2010 team will always be connected to JohnDoe and his alleged abuse scandal.
once again your all over the place here and contradicting yourself.

You clam you never said anything about PK legacy and the very next sentence said there was a stigma due to the rape allegation.. what the hell do you think a stigma from a rape accusation does to someone's legacy? lol

then you said "You just can't wrapp your head around the idea that off ice issues are associated with on ice issues." so if you are saying that his off ice issues are associated with his on ice, then wouldnt that also be a tarnish on his on ice legacy? again you have contradicted yourself..

And you are seriously going to try and compare him to OJ? lol my god..
 

hawkinmontreal

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once again your all over the place here and contradicting yourself.

You clam you never said anything about PK legacy and the very next sentence said there was a stigma due to the rape allegation.. what the hell do you think a stigma from a rape accusation does to someone's legacy? lol

then you said "You just can't wrapp your head around the idea that off ice issues are associated with on ice issues." so if you are saying that his off ice issues are associated with his on ice, then wouldnt that also be a tarnish on his on ice legacy? again you have contradicted yourself..

And you are seriously going to try and compare him to OJ? lol my god..
We are just going to agree to disagree, We both have opinions on the matter, I mentioned to BearZombie that maybe Pat Kane was a bad example, however in terms of Bowman I will stand by what I have said.
Just my last thought on this whole Kaner example, OJ was just an example of how a troubled life has changed how individuals perceive you, they are no way alike by any extent, but when you hear the NFL at times bring his name up, they certainly dont downplay his on field achievements, as why I said Kane’s achievements on ice will never be looked down upon.
 

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