Post Draft Mock Offseason

remydat

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Mustipher, Bars and Ifedi are all older than Daniels. 2 of them wouldn't have seen the field if Daniels didn't get hurt, so I don't know how you can say they give you what he does. Borom hasn't played a snap yet, and probably won't for a long time. I'm not trying to argue that Daniels has distinguished himself here, but his competition is a 5th round rookie, a UDFA undersized C with 5 games of decent play, a UDFA with maybe 2 games of decent play if you squint and add all his partial games together, and a failed 1st round pick with a handful of decent play at RG that would also require 5-10M (since he's getting 4.5 this year) to re-sign this offseason.

If your reasoning is that Daniels isn't good enough, you at least have to admit he has the most upside of those other guys you named because he's younger than all but 1 and was more highly regarded coming out in his draft class than all but Ifedi, who already failed harder than Daniels has.

If your reasoning is that Daniels is going to get too expensive if he performs well, then what's the downside? Isn't good guard play ideal? Good guard play in 2021 + a comp pick is better than a downgrade at guard and a below average 2nd TE also for a year.

It doesn't change the fact that Mustipher played better at center than Daniels and Ifedi graded out similarly while facing tougher overall competition. They give me what he does because Daniels is an average to below average G/C. I don't know how else to say it. He is average to below average. A UDFA performed better than he did at C. It is funny you say Mustipher, Whitehair and Bars are undersized when they are the same size as Daniels at around 305 pounds. I like Borom precisely because he is over 320 pounds and an actual mauler which is what I think we need at RG. Daniels isn't replacing Whitehair at G or C and is smallish for RG so his only shot is beating out Mustipher.

My argument is simple. Hurst does Graham's job for cheaper and stretches the field in a way Kmet and Graham cant. Daniels is a G/C that is basically interchangeable with the other G/C prospects we have particularly when it looks like the Bears want to go bigger at G and he was outplayed at C by an UDFA who is the same size as him.

Whatever potential he has left, I simply do not think is worth it as I doubt he ever reaches it. It really shouldn't take this long for a high draft pick at G to distinguish himself as G is one of the easier positions to transition to in the NFL.

It is fine if you disagree and you hold out more hope for him than I do.
 

vanavyman

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The lack of love for Daniels is disheartening. There is nothing to suggest that he wouldn’t have been great if he hadn’t gotten hurt.

@HawkBear can you believe this shit?
Yes he showed up for camp in the best shape of his life. His peers were shocked from what I read. He was ready to step up and be our best OL. I consider him untouchable. Whitehair fine trade him, but I like them both at OG going forward for the next 3-5 years. Just make the cap work.
 

remydat

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The lack of love for Daniels is disheartening. There is nothing to suggest that he wouldn’t have been great if he hadn’t gotten hurt.

@HawkBear can you believe this shit?

You mean besides the fact he got his ass handed to him by the Bucs (49 grade) and only had one game (Giants) where he graded above 67?

Yes he showed up for camp in the best shape of his life. His peers were shocked from what I read. He was ready to step up and be our best OL. I consider him untouchable. Whitehair fine trade him, but I like them both at OG going forward for the next 3-5 years. Just make the cap work.

Best shape of his career and still sucked. That is disheartening. You can't trade Whitehair as they just restructured him and he would add 12 million to the cap if you moved him. Daniels looks like Tarzan but plays like Jane.
 

vanavyman

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You mean besides the fact he got his ass handed to him by the Bucs (49 grade) and only had one game (Giants) where he graded above 67?



Best shape of his career and still sucked. That is disheartening. You can't trade Whitehair as they just restructured him and he would add 12 million to the cap if you moved him. Daniels looks like Tarzan but plays like Jane.
I hate to hear that. I did not see Daniels much before he was hurt. With our new big wide bodies everyone can be replaced.
 

rawdawg

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It doesn't change the fact that Mustipher played better at center than Daniels and Ifedi graded out similarly while facing tougher overall competition. They give me what he does because Daniels is an average to below average G/C. I don't know how else to say it. He is average to below average. A UDFA performed better than he did at C. It is funny you say Mustipher, Whitehair and Bars are undersized when they are the same size as Daniels at around 305 pounds. I like Borom precisely because he is over 320 pounds and an actual mauler which is what I think we need at RG. Daniels isn't replacing Whitehair at G or C and is smallish for RG so his only shot is beating out Mustipher.

My argument is simple. Hurst does Graham's job for cheaper and stretches the field in a way Kmet and Graham cant. Daniels is a G/C that is basically interchangeable with the other G/C prospects we have particularly when it looks like the Bears want to go bigger at G and he was outplayed at C by an UDFA who is the same size as him.

Whatever potential he has left, I simply do not think is worth it as I doubt he ever reaches it. It really shouldn't take this long for a high draft pick at G to distinguish himself as G is one of the easier positions to transition to in the NFL.

It is fine if you disagree and you hold out more hope for him than I do.
Yeah we disagree on both Daniels and Hurst. LOL. But I get what you are saying.
 

TL1961

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With Fields now in the fold, here is how I would approach the rest of the offseason.

1. Extend Arob - New deal 4 years 81m with 16m SB. Base salaries are 8m, 17m, 20m and 20m with first 2 years guaranteed so 41m guaranteed in total. Cap hit for 2021 is 12m saving us 5.8m in cap space. With Fields in the fold give him a reliable No 1 target thru the first 4 years of his contract as he is developing. ARob gets his 20m a year so he can shut up and more importantly 41m in first 2 years of the deal after which he can be could while saving 12m against 2023 cap or 16 million against 2024. Win win for everyone.

2.Cut Graham - I have no idea why he is still around. He is not part of the future with Fields and offers very little outside of the red zone. For those concerned about TE, I have a solution further below. 7m saved

3. Cut/Trade Hicks - He is on the last year of his deal and the money could be put to better use. We can also recoup a late round pick next year which Pace does well with. I am thinking a 5th-6th rounder or so. Hicks is still good when healthy but he hasn't been healthy the last few years and he has also been responsible for a lot of silly penalties. Nichols is also in his last year and I think we need to give him the keys in terms of letting him play Hicks role to see what we have in him. We also have some decent guys to play the other DE spot and Goldman returning at NT. 11.5m saved

4. Cut/Trade Miller - I don't think he is part of the future as too inconsistent and we have several slot options to replace him. I don't see him worth signing to a contract beyond this year so see if you can get a 5th-6th rounder for him. I think the future for the Bears is ARob, Mooney, Newsome, Kmet as the starters with my TE solution below operating in 2 TE sets. 1.5m saved.

These moves get you to about 31 million in cap space. Signing the draft class takes about 5 million so that leaves you 26m in cap space. Now here is where it gets fun.

5. Sign Eric Fisher - 3 years 30 million, 15m SB with base salaries of 3m, 7.5m, 7.5m. A bit of a gamble given the achilles injury but this is a signing that perhaps happens closer to August once we have better medicals. That would give us a line of Fisher, Whitehair, Mustipher Ifedi and Jenkins which would be much improved from last year IMO with guys like Borom, Bars, Simmons, waiting in the wings to provide depth. I have left out Daniels because of the following.

6. Trade Daniels to the Falcons for Hayden Hurst - The Falcons drafted Pitts and then did not pick up the 5th year option for Hurst. So his time with the Falcons is coming to an end. We are unlikely to resign Daniels as if Ifedi is worth 5m, Daniels can probably get 5-10m on the open market in 2022. We also still have Bars, Borom, Simmons, etc. as depth and quite frankly should be drafting OL every year so I think getting a move TE like Hurst to pair with Kmet and replace Graham is worth Daniels. I think long term the best OL is going to be Fisher, Whitehair, Mustipher, Borom and Jenkins.

7. Sign Bashaud Breeland - 3 years 18 million, 9m SB with base salaries of 2m, 3m and 4m - Veteran signing that can provide cover while the young CBs continue to develop.

The above still leaves about 15 million of cap space that can be used during the year or rolled over to the 2022 cap if not used.
Good grief.

We may all be disappointed in Anthony Miller but you don’t cut vets before you know if the WR you drafted in the SIXTH can play.

You don’t trade OL for TE.

Cut the D lineman that makes all the difference? Night and day with Hicks vs without.
 

TL1961

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The Texans weren't an actual good team though. There is something to be said for having a reliable target to help move the chains which is what I view ARob as. You have other guys to help get vertical but when it is 3rd and 5, having a bunch of vertical guys isn't as useful as having a guy that can make the tough catch and get a first down.

We differ on Daniels. Whitehair can't realistically be moved and I view Borom as more of a RG. where does Daniels play in 2022? He isn't worth 5-10m more than Mustopher IMO. He has been an average to below average G/C for 3 years now. As for Hurst, depending on how 2021 goes, I would possibly resign him before I would Daniels as there is no natural replacement for him as the move TE as Kmet is the inline TE.
Hayden Hurst is already on his second team, and that team just declined a chance to keep him cheaply.
 

remydat

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Bc Hicks legit changes the game. Hicks makes that defense so much more dangerous and with Goldman coming back Hicks Goldman and Nichols is nasty as hell.

Are you contending for a SB next year? Are you extending him? If the answer to both those questions is no then you are going to waste 11 million in cap so we can win maybe 1 more game than we would otherwise and then at best get bounced from the playoffs again.

Edwards had 22 pressures in 190 snaps. Hicks had 53 in 534 snaps. If you give Edwards 534 pass rush snaps then he gets 61 pressures. Nichols had 32 pressures in 359 pass rush snaps. So over 534 snaps that is 47 pressures. They also signed Angelo Blackson.

In short, Edwards and Nicholls at DE can replace Hicks production.
 

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Are you contending for a SB next year? Are you extending him? If the answer to both those questions is no then you are going to waste 11 million in cap so we can win maybe 1 more game than we would otherwise and then at best get bounced from the playoffs again.

Edwards had 22 pressures in 190 snaps. Hicks had 53 in 534 snaps. If you give Edwards 534 pass rush snaps then he gets 61 pressures. Nichols had 32 pressures in 359 pass rush snaps. So over 534 snaps that is 47 pressures. They also signed Angelo Blackson.

In short, Edwards and Nicholls at DE can replace Hicks production.
Hicks has more value than his stats and anybody who has played a contact sport would know that.
 

remydat

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Hicks has more value than his stats and anybody who has played a contact sport would know that.

You sort of ignored the point? Are you signing him long term? If not then he isn't part of the future so it is silly to pay him 11 million to play one year where you aren't really a SB contender. Now if you want to argue for extending him be my guest. But if you are saying waste 11 million for a single year of Hicks just for him to move on in 2022 then that makes zero sense.
 

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You sort of ignored the point? Are you signing him long term? If not then he isn't part of the future so it is silly to pay him 11 million to play one year where you aren't really a SB contender. Now if you want to argue for extending him be my guest. But if you are saying waste 11 million for a single year of Hicks just for him to move on in 2022 then that makes zero sense.
no i’m all for cutting him and allocating more money towards helping fields, but saying he can be replaced by a mixture of 2 back ups in Nichols and Edwards is categorically false. there will most definitely be a drop off in the defense but it’s necessary.
 

remydat

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Good grief.

We may all be disappointed in Anthony Miller but you don’t cut vets before you know if the WR you drafted in the SIXTH can play.

You don’t trade OL for TE.

Cut the D lineman that makes all the difference? Night and day with Hicks vs without.

Goodwin and Cohen will take reps in the slot away from Miller IMO before you even get to Newsome. Having said that if you can't trade him then no biggie if you keep him.

You can trade an OL for a TE you think is better. By you logic, you wouldn't trade Daniels for Kelce which is just a dumb argument. You are better off saying you don't think Hurst is worth it rather than just a blanket silly statement like that. I think Daniels is much worse an OL than Hurst is a TE. So I make the trade because I think we can easily replace Daniels production. You don't which is fine.

We are not going to the SB next year so unless you are signing Hicks long term, one year of Hicks is not worth the 11 million I can use to sign a player that will be around when we are ready to compete for the SB.
 

remydat

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no i’m all for cutting him and allocating more money towards helping fields, but saying he can be replaced by a mixture of 2 back ups in Nichols and Edwards is categorically false. there will most definitely be a drop off in the defense but it’s necessary.

It is not categorically false. You have an opinion that it is but as we don't know what a 32 year old Hicks who has had injuries the past 2 years can actually provide relative to 2 guys that are younger and on a per snap basis similar pass rushers then your opinion is just that an opinion. You may end up being right but your categorically false claim is just non-sense.

Last year was his worst grade in his career. Hicks is not the same guy. So you can be like the Pats and move on before a guy falls off the railings or you can hang on to guys well past their decline. Mario Edwards actually was the 2nd highest graded defender on the team with a 90 overall grade.

Hicks came to us as 27 year old guy that took it to the next level with us. Edwards is 27 and had the best year of his career last year. Nicholls is 26and been a steady performer despite playing out of position at times at NT. Let's see if one of them can become the next Hicks rather than cling to the past.
 
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Gustavus Adolphus

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You mean besides the fact he got his ass handed to him by the Bucs (49 grade) and only had one game (Giants) where he graded above 67?
I don’t put much stock in PFF grades for the offensive line. Sorry.
 

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It is not categorically false. You have an opinion that it is but as we don't know what a 32 year old Hicks who has had injuries the past 2 years can actually provide relative to 2 guys that are younger and on a per snap basis similar pass rushers then your opinion is just that an opinion. You may end up being right but your categorically false claim is just non-sense.

Last year was his worst grade in his career. So you can be like the Pats and move on before a guy falls off the railings or you can hang on to guys past the point where it was better to move on. Mario Edwards actually was the 2nd highest graded defender on the team with a 90 overall grade. I would much rather see if he or Nicholls can be the next Hicks for us rather than waste a 11 million and have Hicks taking snaps away from younger guys who could be poised to breakout in the same way Hicks did for us years ago.
again, you cannot simply sum up Hicks’ value by looking at his stat sheet.

he plays with energy and passion that raises the intensity of the entire defensive line. this is what i mean by categorically false. unless somebody else brings the intensity Hicks plays with he can truly be replaced.
 

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Just saw that Eric Fisher is visiting the Colts and Balt signed A.Villanueva yesterday so that leaves R.Okung or 39 year old Jason Peters.

Tevin Jenkins it is.
 

remydat

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I don’t put much stock in PFF grades for the offensive line. Sorry.

You don't have to. If you watched the games, the line was terrible against Tampa and shaky for much of the Lions game. Daniels was a part of that. They were also not great against the Colts either. Daniels was a part of that too. He only faced two really good defenses and the tape shows he wasn't all that good against either of them.
 

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You don't have to. If you watched the games, the line was terrible against Tampa and shaky for much of the Lions game. Daniels was a part of that. They were also not great against the Colts either. Daniels was a part of that too. He only faced two really good defenses and the tape shows he wasn't all that good against either of them.
Cool.

Are we just assuming that it wouldn’t get better?
 

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