Thanks Kris Bryant....

gopher72

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I wonder how much money the last two years has cost him
U know Wonky IMHO it’s also cost the Cubs both on the field and on the trading block. I was surprised Theo didn’t deal him as predicted by some after last year when he had high trade value. That value has dropped significantly. I’m pretty sure he’ll be in a Cub uni at the start of next season.
 

CSF77

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he probably would get that type of return. Problem is, the cubs problem was offense. I don’t think going from Contreras to caratini is going to help the offense. If there’s going to be a DH, I prefer keeping them. I think it’s KB and Schwarber that need to go

I agree but from a rebuild Wilson would get a strong return. Most likely #3 behind Darvish and Hendricks right now.

But I really see them retooling vs wrecking house. They have a good core right now that needs adjustment.
 

GregCubsFan

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Hey guys, new to the board. Life long Cubs fan, well since the 80s anyway. I am 41 now. IT was fun watching Theo build this team from a nobody to WS Champs, but since 2016 it's like they just haven't cared. Injuries to Bryant, pitching staff getting older, and unable to produce runs without the long ball has just plagued this franchise last couple of years. Don't get me wrong, making the playoffs every year since 2015 has been great compared to what we used to have to do, but at what point do you think, ok this is trending bad now, we need to maybe start over again?
 

Parade_Rain

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1. Problem clearly was not Maddon.
2. Too many of the same types of batters
3. Need SP
4. Need more offense.

I would do a rebuild...not that you don't keep some of the core, but at the end of the day, Theo was at his best signing project pitching and having Bosio build them for trade value. And also drafting hitting prospects. I'd go back and lower salaries. Hindsight is 20/20, but some of his trades were really silly. ex-DJ Lamahieu has a .305 batting average over his career, hitting .364 for 2020. I get the Torres for Chapman trade, but the Cease, Jiminez trade to the Sox for Quintana didn't work out. If I were Theo, I would see the error of my ways and see that I have too many swing and miss guys and not enough contact hitters. Home Runs are nice. Regular season wins are nice. Winning playoff games is even better. Can't do that with guys who can't hit against the top pitching and feast of 4/5's.
 

Diehardfan

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1. Problem clearly was not Maddon.
2. Too many of the same types of batters
3. Need SP
4. Need more offense.

I would do a rebuild...not that you don't keep some of the core, but at the end of the day, Theo was at his best signing project pitching and having Bosio build them for trade value. And also drafting hitting prospects. I'd go back and lower salaries. Hindsight is 20/20, but some of his trades were really silly. ex-DJ Lamahieu has a .305 batting average over his career, hitting .364 for 2020. I get the Torres for Chapman trade, but the Cease, Jiminez trade to the Sox for Quintana didn't work out. If I were Theo, I would see the error of my ways and see that I have too many swing and miss guys and not enough contact hitters. Home Runs are nice. Regular season wins are nice. Winning playoff games is even better. Can't do that with guys who can't hit against the top pitching and feast of 4/5's.

There was only a handful of us that didn't think Maddon was at fault. A manager tries to put his players in the best position to win games and even he's great at doing that, it doesn't mean a damn thing unless those players perform. If a manager goes against "the book" and it works out, nobody says shit....but if it doesn't work, he gets crucified. Maddon tried some crazy stuff, so did Ross to a lesser extent but there is no damn guarantee that if they did the exact opposite that anything would've changed. I always say....if you are gonna bitch about what a manager does, do it before you know the outcome.

BTW......where have you been, Parade? Hope you and the family dodged around the Covid alright.
 

CSF77

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1. Problem clearly was not Maddon.
2. Too many of the same types of batters
3. Need SP
4. Need more offense.

I would do a rebuild...not that you don't keep some of the core, but at the end of the day, Theo was at his best signing project pitching and having Bosio build them for trade value. And also drafting hitting prospects. I'd go back and lower salaries. Hindsight is 20/20, but some of his trades were really silly. ex-DJ Lamahieu has a .305 batting average over his career, hitting .364 for 2020. I get the Torres for Chapman trade, but the Cease, Jiminez trade to the Sox for Quintana didn't work out. If I were Theo, I would see the error of my ways and see that I have too many swing and miss guys and not enough contact hitters. Home Runs are nice. Regular season wins are nice. Winning playoff games is even better. Can't do that with guys who can't hit against the top pitching and feast of 4/5's.

The rebuild is a option for sure. They are really missing a farm system and a reboot like the white sox is not a bad idea at all.
But the whole Bosio angle is not in place so rent a wreck is not a solid game plan.

1. Maddon loved to line up tinker. He was not strong with the staff.
2. That is true. They lacked contact hitters like Nico. I believe that they started to address with drafting Nico.
3. They need 2 to compete. Yu, Hendricks and Alzolay is a solid core.
4. They need the O to hit. The line up went into a collective funk at the same time. That is a coaching issue. If it was 1 or 2 then it would be case by case.

Like I said. What I believe happens. They extend Baez and Rizzo and trade Schwaber and Bryant. They will have to start the process of refilling the system with short term. Theo even said that 1 year players are attractive to contenders as they are geared for that season with out the long term commitment. So this most likely will happen.

The rotation could end up internal. Alzolay replaces Q and Mills replaces Chatwood. That is a 20+ mil savings to the rotation. Lester at 5 mil is a huge savings from the 25 mil that they were on the hook for.

So I believe that they will start the process next year but it will not be a reboot. It will be a retool to get rid of short term and get the staff cheaper. In general with 3 starters vets. 2 in adjustment is fine. They will have Marquez near ready to replace Lester and going into 2022 you might end up replacing Mills. But that will be when they are ready to compete again.

If I am investing it would be in DJ LeMahieu . He is worth the investment. He brings a solid hitting approach that should translate to runs.

LF Ozuna should be the top F/A and one of the top F/A period. I would avoid this.
George Springer will be right up with him and both would be looking a a major offer.

I would resign Cameron Maybin . They need a RH bat and to avoid a long term commitment. Another option would be Marwin Gonzalez who Theo let go in rule V.

It would be funny to see both him and DJ returning as the 2 that Theo let go with out evaluating them properly.
 

Parade_Rain

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There was only a handful of us that didn't think Maddon was at fault. A manager tries to put his players in the best position to win games and even he's great at doing that, it doesn't mean a damn thing unless those players perform. If a manager goes against "the book" and it works out, nobody says shit....but if it doesn't work, he gets crucified. Maddon tried some crazy stuff, so did Ross to a lesser extent but there is no damn guarantee that if they did the exact opposite that anything would've changed. I always say....if you are gonna bitch about what a manager does, do it before you know the outcome.

BTW......where have you been, Parade? Hope you and the family dodged around the Covid alright.
Right on. I've been busy coaching! Not enough time to post up, but I do miss the discussions we have had on this forum. Will pay more attention in the off-season. We have dodged around covid even though I have coached two different teams from July 1 through now. Eat right, take a good daily multivitamin in liquid format that includes zinc, take extra vitamin D supplements. So far so good!
 

Parade_Rain

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The rebuild is a option for sure. They are really missing a farm system and a reboot like the white sox is not a bad idea at all.
But the whole Bosio angle is not in place so rent a wreck is not a solid game plan.

1. Maddon loved to line up tinker. He was not strong with the staff.
2. That is true. They lacked contact hitters like Nico. I believe that they started to address with drafting Nico.
3. They need 2 to compete. Yu, Hendricks and Alzolay is a solid core.
4. They need the O to hit. The line up went into a collective funk at the same time. That is a coaching issue. If it was 1 or 2 then it would be case by case.

Like I said. What I believe happens. They extend Baez and Rizzo and trade Schwaber and Bryant. They will have to start the process of refilling the system with short term. Theo even said that 1 year players are attractive to contenders as they are geared for that season with out the long term commitment. So this most likely will happen.

The rotation could end up internal. Alzolay replaces Q and Mills replaces Chatwood. That is a 20+ mil savings to the rotation. Lester at 5 mil is a huge savings from the 25 mil that they were on the hook for.

So I believe that they will start the process next year but it will not be a reboot. It will be a retool to get rid of short term and get the staff cheaper. In general with 3 starters vets. 2 in adjustment is fine. They will have Marquez near ready to replace Lester and going into 2022 you might end up replacing Mills. But that will be when they are ready to compete again.

If I am investing it would be in DJ LeMahieu . He is worth the investment. He brings a solid hitting approach that should translate to runs.

LF Ozuna should be the top F/A and one of the top F/A period. I would avoid this.
George Springer will be right up with him and both would be looking a a major offer.

I would resign Cameron Maybin . They need a RH bat and to avoid a long term commitment. Another option would be Marwin Gonzalez who Theo let go in rule V.

It would be funny to see both him and DJ returning as the 2 that Theo let go with out evaluating them properly.
Is Bosio the only pitching coach who has been good at reclamation projects? I don't buy that one, but I can see a "retool" approach. I want nothing of Lester pitching though. He's spent, IMHO.
 

CSF77

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Is Bosio the only pitching coach who has been good at reclamation projects? I don't buy that one, but I can see a "retool" approach. I want nothing of Lester pitching though. He's spent, IMHO.

fair assessment on both.
 

KBIB

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KB hasn't been the same since he got hit in the head.

Change my mind
 

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