Time to put the “1 year rebuild” bs to bed

[RiDLer80]

They didn't have what the Bears will have.

And even with that, you have to spend smart still. Jacksonville didn't. If the Bears don't, then we will be in trouble.

As I said before - spread the money around on the 2nd and 3rd wave of free agency on short term deals that are easy to get out of with little cap penalty.

Other than a very small handful of players (like Payne from the Commanders), the Bears shouldn't be players in the first wave of free agency. Quantity matters over quality here, because the point is to use free agency as a way to get placeholders that will allow you to field a competitive team while also buying you time to replace almost all of them in the draft in the next 3 years.

Jacksonville didn't really employ that strategy.

Who are you to say Jax didn't spend smart? Yeah, people said the Kirk deal was dumb but his signing was a big part in Lawrence's leap and the Jag's improvement this season.

Kirk is 16th in receiving yards this season and Lawrence is top yen in passing yards.

Obviously Jacksonville's strategy worked going from worst to first. They may not have done it the way you think it should be done but it worked.

 

[remydat]

I mean agree but these issues can’t be fixed in 1 year.

On the DL - they legitimately don’t have a starter at any position. Many fine rotational pieces you can win with, but if you told me all were replaced I wouldn’t be upset or surprised.

On the OL - the only actual difference maker was Jenkins, and his health has been a question since before he was drafted. You can win with Jones IF he makes big improvements. You can win in the next 1-2 years with whitehair IF the pieces around him are solid and IF he even comes back healthy. You won’t win with mustipher, you won’t win with borom/Reif.

It’s one thing to be missing 2-3 on each line and it’s another to need replacements at every single position.

Bears have cap to sign a few, and with a trade back they can gain capital to add to it. I like fields so I like the long term outlook, but to think this can be turned around in 1 year… poles would have to hit on every FA, have FA’s that want to come here which is a big assumption, and he will have to find 4 starters at these positions in the draft.

Is it really realistic to expect any gm to have this level of success?

The realistic outlook is he gets a few pieces at each position group, improvements are made, and the bears improve next year.

It’s going to take 2 years to actually build a SB contender, and that is IF poles does exceedingly well.

Ngaouke and one of Payne/Jones/Hargrave on the DL. Pocic and McGlincy on the OL. That is doable IMO with a ton of money still left over. In that scenario then I still target DL early in the draft. If I get 2 of Payne/Jones/Hargrave then DL drops down on the lost.

Bears will have options. You heard how defensive players talked about playing against Fields. People will want to play for us.

 

[BearFanJohn]

The market dictates what the FA's will earn, not the Bears. Almost all top tier talent will be an overpay, with a multi year contract. Free angency is better used to add one or two key pieces, not for building a roster.

No kidding. The point is that it is better to have money to pay players than to not have money to pay players. As long as the Bears make good decisions.

 

[run and shoot]

1-7 in one score games. We have played above our talent level and have good coaches IMO. Fix the trenches and this team can be competive if Fields is legit.

"is Fields is legit" He's the reason we had those close games, where many predicted blow-outs. I hope these coaches
are legit and can get the most outta these new draft choices in 2023

He still has a ways to go as a passer.

Overall, he's still developing overall as a young Qb. He's needs good, legit coaching, a legit OL and legit wr's.

Is JF legit as a passer lets take a look........

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1580741718223249409

 

[Canth]

I mean agree but these issues can’t be fixed in 1 year.

On the DL - they legitimately don’t have a starter at any position. Many fine rotational pieces you can win with, but if you told me all were replaced I wouldn’t be upset or surprised.

On the OL - the only actual difference maker was Jenkins, and his health has been a question since before he was drafted. You can win with Jones IF he makes big improvements. You can win in the next 1-2 years with whitehair IF the pieces around him are solid and IF he even comes back healthy. You won’t win with mustipher, you won’t win with borom/Reif.

It’s one thing to be missing 2-3 on each line and it’s another to need replacements at every single position.

Bears have cap to sign a few, and with a trade back they can gain capital to add to it. I like fields so I like the long term outlook, but to think this can be turned around in 1 year… poles would have to hit on every FA, have FA’s that want to come here which is a big assumption, and he will have to find 4 starters at these positions in the draft.

Is it really realistic to expect any gm to have this level of success?

The realistic outlook is he gets a few pieces at each position group, improvements are made, and the bears improve next year.

It’s going to take 2 years to actually build a SB contender, and that is IF poles does exceedingly well.

I generally agree on the idea that's it probably more like 2 years to have a SB contender. However, I do think it's possible for the team to be a playoff contender next year with a good offseason. And quite honestly, a part of that 2 year window would be helped by a trade down that includes a 1st next year.

 

[remydat]

Overall, he's still developing overall as a young Qb. He's needs good, legit coaching, a legit OL and legit wr's.

Is JF legit as a passer lets take a look........

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1580741718223249409

Being legit as a passer is more than one throw. It is consistency. We already know the WRs, OL and Coaching had to improve as well.

 

[pablovi]

You keep saying 2-3 years and it's like you're not even watching whats happening in the league. The bottom 4 seeds in this years playoffs currently are: Ravens (10-6), Patriots (8-8), Giants (9-6), Seahawks (8-8). We played 3 of the 4 this year, beat 2, and were basically within 1 score of the other. That doesn't sound like 2-3 years to me.

They need an entire new Defense. An entire new Oline, and a new receiver core. You don’t build all that in a single off-season. It’s takes 2-3 at the best, and that’s with a +80% yield.

 

[run and shoot]

Being legit as a passer is more than one throw. It is consistency. We already know the WRs, OL and Coaching had to improve as well.

that's not the only pass. It just an example of what JF can do with minimal pass pro. And he was creamed on that pass play. Creamed ! Plus....JF was keeping us in games with his passing and running for TD's.

I'll never question his legitimacy as a passer given what he has to work on offense and play calling. I also don't question JF's leadership as a Qb either.

P.S.
Yes...."WRs, OL and Coaching has to improve". I'd like to see them match JF's intensity

 

[gmoney1994]

Halfway thru the season there were still many people here expecting the bears to be competitive next year, with a chance at the playoffs.

Even with $130 mil in FA, you’ll still only be able to upgrade a handful of positions. And poles drafting so far looks questionable at best.

I have to imagine, by now, you finally realize this team is multiple offseasons from even being middle of the pack, right?

The Bears only need 5-6 positions filled with studs and then they should be a play off team. IMO

Center, Left Guard, Right Tackle,WR, 3 tech, and an Edge

These can be bought and drafted with high picks

 

[remydat]

that's not the only pass. It just an example of what JF can do with minimal pass pro. And he was creamed on that pass play. Creamed ! Plus....JF was keeping us in games with his passing and running for TD's.

I'll never question his legitimacy as a passer given what he has to work on offense and play calling. I also don't question JF's leadership as a Qb either.

P.S.
Yes...."WRs, OL and Coaching has to improve". I'd like to see them match JF's intensity

Glad for you that you dont question it. I do. Good thing we are 2 different people.

 

[SugarWalls]

Ngaouke and one of Payne/Jones/Hargrave on the DL. Pocic and McGlincy on the OL. That is doable IMO with a ton of money still left over. In that scenario then I still target DL early in the draft. If I get 2 of Payne/Jones/Hargrave then DL drops down on the lost.

Bears will have options. You heard how defensive players talked about playing against Fields. People will want to play for us.

Lmao yes bears should easily be able to get 4 of the best FA options without massive overpay and still have tons to spend ???

 

[run and shoot]

Glad for you that you dont question it. I do. Good thing we are 2 different people.

P.S.
Yes....like u said>>>>"WRs, OL and Coaching has to improve". I'd like to see them match JF's intensity

 

[run and shoot]

JF's intensity !!

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1580741718223249409

 

[bufordht]

The drama queens on this board ?.

 

[remydat]

Lmao yes bears should easily be able to get 4 of the best FA options without massive overpay and still have tons to spend ???

We have twice as much cap room as every other team. And yes you overpay for FAs. Welcome to the the NFL.

 

[SugarWalls]

We have twice as much cap room as every other team. And yes you overpay for FAs. Welcome to the the NFL.

Point I was trying to make is this isn't madden. Those moves sound amazing on paper. Thinking it is realistic to sign the top C,RT, and 2 of the top DL FA's seems a bit over the top imo.

A realistic scenario is the bears win on 2 of those. Sure they over pay, but you don't want to overpay for 4 FA's and mess up the cap ala Pace.

 

[remydat]

Point I was trying to make is this isn't madden. Those moves sound amazing on paper. Thinking it is realistic to sign the top C,RT, and 2 of the top DL FA's seems a bit over the top imo.

A realistic scenario is the bears win on 2 of those. Sure they over pay, but you don't want to overpay for 4 FA's and mess up the cap ala Pace.

But you arent going to mess up the cap because we have a ton of it.

Bears also in last year of 3 year cycle and have to spend a fuck ton of money to hit 90% minimum of 3 year cycle.

It is cash spend not cap spend so they have $194m and $142m cash spend in 2021 and 2022 ($336 in total). Cap was $182.5m, $208.2m and $218.2m ie $608m. 90% of 608. is 547m so that is $211m they have to spend in cash this year. That would include signing bonuses. Right now thry have 67.5m in cash spend for 2023.

So they have to spend about 150m in this offseason or any money not spent will just go to existing players. So if they spent say 120m, the 30m left over would just be given to the existing players on the 53 man roster which makes no sense to do.

 

[shoez90]

You lost me at Gordon and Jones Jr. Gordon was a early 2nd rd pick and had a stretch of 3 games where he played good. Every single other game he struggled (and that's putting it nicely). Jones Jr was a 3rd rd WR. He has 79 yards receiving this year... and fumbles once out of every 4 times he touches the ball. He's had a few good kick returns. Anyone happy with the Jones Jr pick right now is absolutely delusional.

The reason we didnt have a first rd pick was because the previous "stupid" regime traded up to get Fields. Which might end up being the best draft pick this team has had in OVER three decades.

Poles has been very organized and open in his approach. So?

I'm willing to give this class some time. But since Poles has yet to add any proven game changers yet, it's going to be at least another full season before bears are competitive.

So what was wrong with my post then lol? I said some of his picks have potential, rare is the rookie who is great from day one. All of them will benefit with more reps and time together. I'm not calling them probowlers but that doesn't make them busts either. We can work with them another season and this off season and still add plenty of picks worth of talent around them or make them depth players. But I have watched almost every snap of the two hottest supposed can't miss talents and I just don't see it like you guys do. Not to mention we are not that close to competing that one or two will tip the scales.

 

[CaliBearFan]

Haven't read the entire thread to see if anyone has answered this yet, but the Jaguars are poised to do just that this year. If they win tonight, they go from being dead last actually 2 years in a row into winning their division. They also had a ton of cap room last offseason that helped make that happen.

That's all true.

Is that the norm? The statement which I found delusional was that "the Worst team can Usually" make it to the playoffs the following year with a good off-season.

Had that ever happened without them also obtaining a "franchise" QB ?
Are they easy to find?

 

[Canth]

That's all true.

Is that the norm? The statement which I found delusional was that "the Worst team can Usually" make it to the playoffs the following year with a good off-season.

Had that ever happened without them also obtaining a "franchise" QB ?
Are they easy to find?

I wouldn't call it usual by any means. The one tweet I saw and shared said a team going from last in their division to wining their division has happened for a team in 18 of the last 20 seasons. Hell, the Bears did that from 2017 to 2018. So, it can happen but I mean, we are talking about historically it happening around 12% of the time. So, it's hardly a given or 'normal'.

I would say the just mentioned Bears from 2017 to 2018 did it without a 'franchise' QB. Instead, they had a championship caliber defense and a just barely good enough offense. They were helped by the rest of the division sucking either due to injury or talent.

However, everything in the NFL is made easier by having a 'franchise' QB. I am just hoping that Fields continues to develop into one.

Don't get me wrong, there are a ton of things that have to go right for the Bears to turn it around that quickly again. They have to hit on many multiple free agents and draft picks. And even if they do hit on all of those, they have to stay relatively healthy as they will likely not have much depth if/when they lose any starter for a significant length of time. I do think though that the NFC North is going to wide open in 2023 which also helps give the Bears a chance.