Why no kicking coaches in the NFL?

[Mdbearz]

https://www.sbnation.com/2017/11/15/16596068/nfl-kickers-coaching-special-teams

A Mega Industry like the NFL, and week after week we see kickers missing field goals, schanking punts or kicking the ball out of bounds on a kick off.

The Bears have struggled to find a good kicker since Robbie left, and they are not alone. Many NFL Teams will change kickers or at the very least have a kicker in for a work out if their kicker on the roster has struggled.

Baltimore Raven actually have a kicking coach on the official staff, and Justin Tucker has been one of the most accurate kickers in the NFL, and I honestly believe that if Tucker was kicking that 53 yarder on Sunday we would be sitting at 4-1.

Could Parkey be the next Justin Tucker if he had a coach that could work with him full time at practice and during the game?

I am no kicker, but as I watched the condensed version of the Game in Miami, I noticed that all of Parkey's kicks were leaking right. And guess were the last kick missed, to the right and not by much. If he would have had a kicking coach that could have reviewed his previous kicks, they could have worked on a correction or simply approached that last kick with a slight adjustment.

 

[Rory Sparrow]

Remember when Phil Emery was hiring kids from the Ivy League to crunch numbers so that the Bears could be the most metric-driven franchise in the NFL? Then later on when those Ivy Leaguers handed Emery the latest metrics, the Bears made Jay Cutler they highest paid player in league history? Seems like overkill in retrospect.

The article is kind of stupid in that it gives examples of Forbath and Hauschka being soccer players who were taught how to kick footballs. That's nice, but let me know when an NFL team plucks a soccer player from Middlebury College and sends him into the game. I'm guessing the thought is that NFL kickers know how to kick a football once they reach the NFL. That's why you have kickers playing for 20 years...there isn't a constant reinvention.

People downplay MLB hitting coaches because the players themselves know almost as much about hitting as, say, Chili Davis, and in the MLB there is regular adjustments/readjustments to how pitchers are throwing to you. NFL kickers have a fairly stable environment...the ball is snapped the same way, it is placed in the same spot, the goalposts aren't moving. If you are going to advocate adding a "kicking coach" for an act that is infrequent and static, then I would say it makes more sense to add specific position coaches such as "Nickleback Coach" and "Left Tackle Coach" and so forth.

 

[Angry Boomer]

Dave Toub is the best Special Teams coach I have ever seen..I dont know if he works with kickers individually... But even in KC, his Special Teams do really well..

 

[Mdbearz]

Remember when Phil Emery was hiring kids from the Ivy League to crunch numbers so that the Bears could be the most metric-driven franchise in the NFL? Then later on when those Ivy Leaguers handed Emery the latest metrics, the Bears made Jay Cutler they highest paid player in league history? Seems like overkill in retrospect.

The article is kind of stupid in that it gives examples of Forbath and Hauschka being soccer players who were taught how to kick footballs. That's nice, but let me know when an NFL team plucks a soccer player from Middlebury College and sends him into the game. I'm guessing the thought is that NFL kickers know how to kick a football once they reach the NFL. That's why you have kickers playing for 20 years...there isn't a constant reinvention.

People downplay MLB hitting coaches because the players themselves know almost as much about hitting as, say, Chili Davis, and in the MLB there is regular adjustments/readjustments to how pitchers are throwing to you. NFL kickers have a fairly stable environment...the ball is snapped the same way, it is placed in the same spot, the goalposts aren't moving. If you are going to advocate adding a "kicking coach" for an act that is infrequent and static, then I would say it makes more sense to add specific position coaches such as "Nickleback Coach" and "Left Tackle Coach" and so forth.

I understand your argument against it, and to be honest the vast majority of NFL teams agree with you. However, when a kicker and his small team (Holder and snapper) are responsible for 1/3 of points scored, do you think that the attention paid to the position is disproportionately imbalanced?

In your example of Nickleback and LT, at least they have assistant coaches that work with those guys in a group setting, with a Defensive backs coach and O-line coach. Again they are not responsible for 1/3 of points scored.

The Raven have a kicking coach, so it is hard to argue with the results, and I am sure that a "kicking coach" is not going to cost an arm and a leg.

 

[Rory Sparrow]

I understand your argument against it, and to be honest the vast majority of NFL teams agree with you. However, when a kicker and his small team (Holder and snapper) are responsible for 1/3 of points scored, do you think that the attention paid to the position is disproportionately imbalanced?

The whole "1/3 of points scored" argument doesn't really hold water. Using that logic, the NFL should get rid of OL coaches and defensive positional coaches, since they don't really score points. I am assuming the special teams coaches on the 31 NFL teams not named "Ravens" are the ones that coach the kickers. So my example is relevant...if you are going to have one coach work with an individual player (kicker) on an act that is infrequent and static, then it would make more sense to have individual coaches for the individual position players.

Getting back to the article, I found this to be hilarious:

The rise of kicking camps like Kohl’s may be the biggest reason for increasingly accurate kickers in the professional ranks.

“The NFL is making it harder,” Kohl said. “It started with goal posts at the goal line. Then they moved them back 10 yards. Then they narrowed the goal posts. Then they took away the tee. They kept making it harder and harder on these guys, and the percentages are going up and up and up.”

Goal posts were moved back from the goalline in the early 70's. They have not "narrowed the goal posts". Tees were never legal on placekicks in the NFL. Basically everything the guys said about kicking is wrong, and this is who the author is championing as the next NFL kicking coach??!

 

[Mdbearz]

The whole "1/3 of points scored" argument doesn't really hold water. Using that logic, the NFL should get rid of OL coaches and defensive positional coaches, since they don't really score points. I am assuming the special teams coaches on the 31 NFL teams not named "Ravens" are the ones that coach the kickers. So my example is relevant...if you are going to have one coach work with an individual player (kicker) on an act that is infrequent and static, then it would make more sense to have individual coaches for the individual position players.

Getting back to the article, I found this to be hilarious:

The rise of kicking camps like Kohl’s may be the biggest reason for increasingly accurate kickers in the professional ranks.

“The NFL is making it harder,” Kohl said. “It started with goal posts at the goal line. Then they moved them back 10 yards. Then they narrowed the goal posts. Then they took away the tee. They kept making it harder and harder on these guys, and the percentages are going up and up and up.”

Goal posts were moved back from the goalline in the early 70's. They have not "narrowed the goal posts". Tees were never legal on placekicks in the NFL. Basically everything the guys said about kicking is wrong, and this is who the author is championing as the next NFL kicking coach??!

In Baltimore they call the coach that is responsible for kicking as a "Specialist coach" , so you are correct they do not have "kicking coach", but more like an assistant, similar to O-line Coach or Defensive Back coach. I imagine that the Specialist coach is working with the entire Specialist team, typically including snapper, holder (if not the punter), punter and kicker.

Bottom line I would like to see the Bears take the kicking woes seriously, and I think a kicking team specialist could pay dividends, AND it surprises me that only one team in the NFL is doing it, and they are being very successful.

 

[modo]

I understand your argument against it, and to be honest the vast majority of NFL teams agree with you. However, when a kicker and his small team (Holder and snapper) are responsible for 1/3 of points scored, do you think that the attention paid to the position is disproportionately imbalanced?

In your example of Nickleback and LT, at least they have assistant coaches that work with those guys in a group setting, with a Defensive backs coach and O-line coach. Again they are not responsible for 1/3 of points scored.

The Raven have a kicking coach, so it is hard to argue with the results, and I am sure that a "kicking coach" is not going to cost an arm and a leg.

Kickers don't drive the offense up and down the field....that is really where the points are scored....a successful offense gives its team more opportunities to score

 

[Rory Sparrow]

Bottom line I would like to see the Bears take the kicking woes seriously, and I think a kicking team specialist could pay dividends, AND it surprises me that only one team in the NFL is doing it, and they are being very successful.

Perhaps the reason is that the Ravens kicking game wasn't any good from 2009-2012, when they employed their kick team specialist coach but did not have Justin Tucker as their kicker. Tucker was an immediate success in the NFL, so maybe teams look at the Ravens and think that Tucker is the reason why the Ravens are so good at making FGs, not the kick specialist coach.

I'm guessing that if the Bears got Justin Tucker, their kicking game would improve. I'd also guess that if the Bears hired the Ravens kick specialist coach, Cody Parkey would not turn into Justin Tucker...he'd be more like Billy Cundiff.

 

[Camden Cutler]

remember at one point it seemed like kickers were coming off the street hitting 60 yarders...it was as if kickers were literally in a bullpen for whenever a team needed

in the last maybe 3 years they started to suck

 

[Jechang]

hey, if a kicking coach can improve our chances of making field goals by even 1%, why the hell not? It could benefit kickers in the same way a caddie might benefit a pro golfer.

 

[msadows]

remember at one point it seemed like kickers were coming off the street hitting 60 yarders...it was as if kickers were literally in a bullpen for whenever a team needed

in the last maybe 3 years they started to suck

Um nfl kickers are making 50+ yarders at a higher rate than ever. Its like over 70% on the season.

Bears just cant find a good one. One of pace's biggest mistakes was letting robbie go.

 

[Mdbearz]

Perhaps the reason is that the Ravens kicking game wasn't any good from 2009-2012, when they employed their kick team specialist coach but did not have Justin Tucker as their kicker. Tucker was an immediate success in the NFL, so maybe teams look at the Ravens and think that Tucker is the reason why the Ravens are so good at making FGs, not the kick specialist coach.

I'm guessing that if the Bears got Justin Tucker, their kicking game would improve. I'd also guess that if the Bears hired the Ravens kick specialist coach, Cody Parkey would not turn into Justin Tucker...he'd be more like Billy Cundiff.

I do not know when the Ravens started using a kicking coach, but it would not surprise me if after the chip shot miss that Cundiff had against the Patriots, that the coaching staff looked around for blame and determined that they did not have anyone on staff that could develop a kicker to take Cundiff's place. And that they had no idea if the next guy they got off the street was going to be any more reliable.

Bottom line, is Justin the best kicker in the NFL because he is just that good (not disputing he is talented) or could a small measure of his success be directly related to the organization's proactive approach of bringing in a coach specifically for kicking to help develop and maintain his consistency.

BTW Rory, you obviously know your Ravens history, are you a fan or just a well informed football fan? Because Cundiff is a dirty work around my parts.....

 

[MDB111™]

Nice username... I like mine and all but to pluralize it and throw in the letter z instead of a s is quite honestly genius.
Salute

 

[Mdbearz]

Um nfl kickers are making 50+ yarders at a higher rate than ever. Its like over 70% on the season.

Bears just cant find a good one. One of pace's biggest mistakes was letting robbie go.

I agree the Bears are lacking since Robbie left, but the reality is every position that is on the field has a specialist working with them. DB's, O-line, WR, RBs, Linebackers, D-line. The Special Teams Coordinator does have an assistant coach, but my understanding is that the Ravens might be the only team that has a coach that specializes in kicking.

To think that there is no room on the coaching staff or no money to hire a specialist that focuses on kicking is just nonsense. Yet when a kicker has a game winning opportunity, all we are supposed to do is hope that the kicker is enough of a self starter to be prepared for the chance.

We did not win the game against Miami because our kicker could not make a field goal. While there may have been a ton of other reasons, that does not make that fact any less true. The Bears ownership and coaching staff have failed to prepare the Bears to win, period. And it baffles me that anyone would think that a kicking coach is just not that important directly after we lost a game because of missed field goal.

 

[Mdbearz]

Nice username... I like mine and all but to pluralize it and throw in the letter z instead of a s is quite honestly genius.
Salute

Well, thanks, I used it on the CBMB also, so I thought if it was still available, I might keep it rolling.

I see you are a Caps fan, pretty exciting to watch them finally break through last year!!

 

[MDB111™]

Well, thanks, I used it on the CBMB also, so I thought if it was still available, I might keep it rolling.

I see you are a Caps fan, pretty exciting to watch them finally break through last year!!

It was glorious seeing this region get a title in something...anything! They were starved and the Caps are a great bunch.

 

[iueyedoc]

Isn't verbally abusing them good enough? Not sure any of them deserve to be kicked.

 

[Aztazzoni]

Um nfl kickers are making 50+ yarders at a higher rate than ever. Its like over 70% on the season.

Bears just cant find a good one. One of pace's biggest mistakes was letting robbie go.

You were most likely one of the ones SCREAMING for us to cut him when he sucked for 2 years... Parkey misses a 54 yarder and people lose their minds.. What is he for the season so far??

 

[RiDLer80]

It would be a good investment. Games come down to kickers more frequently than any coach should be comfortable with. Unless you're sure you have an all-timer, or one with ice in his veins, I'd feel like hiring a specialist coach to work with kickers would help ease some worries.

 

[JoJoBoxer]

I am all for kicking coaches, especially the ones like Tucker.

Aim for the package.