- Joined:
- Jul 31, 2010
- Posts:
- 4,967
- Liked Posts:
- 700
@MikeMiss975: My info sez the CUBS put in the waiver claim on Cole Hamels. Would the Phils trade him there now and would Cole accept?
Interesting...
Interesting...
beckdawg
Well-known member
- Joined:
- Oct 31, 2012
- Posts:
- 11,723
- Liked Posts:
- 3,723
I don't think much will come from it. The cubs clearly need pitching and he's likely cheaper(and maybe better) than what they could get in FA. But that doesn't mean they will pay a ton in terms of prospects for it.
- Joined:
- Oct 18, 2010
- Posts:
- 2,077
- Liked Posts:
- 580
- Location:
- The open road
I'd love to add Cole Hamels, but, I'm doubting anything comes out of this. The Phillies aren't just gonna hand him to us with a bow. Cliff Lee maybe, but not Cole Hamels.
sent from Jimmer range using Tapatalk
sent from Jimmer range using Tapatalk
CSF77
Well-known member
- Joined:
- Apr 16, 2013
- Posts:
- 17,960
- Liked Posts:
- 2,775
- Location:
- San Diego
Is this even legit?
CSF77
Well-known member
- Joined:
- Apr 16, 2013
- Posts:
- 17,960
- Liked Posts:
- 2,775
- Location:
- San Diego
PHILADELPHIA -- This is the month when teams put nearly every player on revocable waivers to give them roster and trade flexibility before the Aug. 31 waiver Trade Deadline.
The Phillies are no different. FOXSports.com reported Wednesday that unidentified teams claimed both left-hander Cole Hamels and right fielder Marlon Byrd off waivers, while closer Jonathan Papelbon cleared. It means the Phillies have 48 hours to work out trades with the teams that claimed Hamels and Byrd. If they do not, they are expected to pull back both players back from waivers.
This doesn't mean Hamels is going to be traded. The Phillies have an incredibly steep price for their ace and had no offers before the July 31 non-waiver Trade Deadline. This is a procedural move as much as anything. Plus, Hamels has a limited no-trade clause, so he could block a trade to any team other than the Angels, Braves, Dodgers, Cardinals, Nationals, Padres, Rangers, Red Sox and Yankees.
The Phillies tried to trade Byrd before the July 31 deadline, but felt they received nothing of value in return for him. It remains to be seen if this is a team that truly covets Byrd, or a team that simply wanted to block Byrd from another team.
Papelbon cleared waivers, which means the Phillies have until the rest of the month to trade him to any team in baseball. He cleared because he is owed $13 million next season, plus a potential $13 million more in 2016 with a vesting club option.
Papelbon has a limited no-trade clause, but he said he will happily waive it to close for a contending team.
The Phillies are no different. FOXSports.com reported Wednesday that unidentified teams claimed both left-hander Cole Hamels and right fielder Marlon Byrd off waivers, while closer Jonathan Papelbon cleared. It means the Phillies have 48 hours to work out trades with the teams that claimed Hamels and Byrd. If they do not, they are expected to pull back both players back from waivers.
This doesn't mean Hamels is going to be traded. The Phillies have an incredibly steep price for their ace and had no offers before the July 31 non-waiver Trade Deadline. This is a procedural move as much as anything. Plus, Hamels has a limited no-trade clause, so he could block a trade to any team other than the Angels, Braves, Dodgers, Cardinals, Nationals, Padres, Rangers, Red Sox and Yankees.
The Phillies tried to trade Byrd before the July 31 deadline, but felt they received nothing of value in return for him. It remains to be seen if this is a team that truly covets Byrd, or a team that simply wanted to block Byrd from another team.
Papelbon cleared waivers, which means the Phillies have until the rest of the month to trade him to any team in baseball. He cleared because he is owed $13 million next season, plus a potential $13 million more in 2016 with a vesting club option.
Papelbon has a limited no-trade clause, but he said he will happily waive it to close for a contending team.
JP Hochbaum
Well-known member
- Joined:
- May 22, 2012
- Posts:
- 2,012
- Liked Posts:
- 1,282
the no trade clause and the steep price of a few prospects make this trade unlikely, but it will be very interesting to see what pans out here.
CSF77
Well-known member
- Joined:
- Apr 16, 2013
- Posts:
- 17,960
- Liked Posts:
- 2,775
- Location:
- San Diego
Highest I would go is #3 Addison Russell, #4 Albert Almora, #11 Pierce Johnson, #15 Eloy Jiminez
That would be a haul for the Phills and not affecting next years team. Phills are going south and the Cubs would become legit next year.
That would be a haul for the Phills and not affecting next years team. Phills are going south and the Cubs would become legit next year.
- Joined:
- Apr 16, 2013
- Posts:
- 21,680
- Liked Posts:
- 9,491
I dont think Eloy Jiminez would be involved. They would try to put someone else.
JP Hochbaum
Well-known member
- Joined:
- May 22, 2012
- Posts:
- 2,012
- Liked Posts:
- 1,282
Too high for me, especially considering we should be able to sign someone without trading the farm.
CSF77
Well-known member
- Joined:
- Apr 16, 2013
- Posts:
- 17,960
- Liked Posts:
- 2,775
- Location:
- San Diego
Few reasons why it is not too much.
1. Hammels contract
6 years/$144M (2013-18), plus 2019 club option
signed extension with Philadelphia 7/25/12
$6M signing bonus
13:$19.5M, 14:$22.5M, 15:$22.5M, 16:$22.5M, 17:$22.5M, 18:$22.5M, 19:$20M club option ($6M buyout)
Control til 2019 at a 22.5 mil per avg. That is low end for TOR. Take a wild guess what it is going to cost for Lester per? Try 25 mil per. Max? 30 per year.
It is not even close.
#2. What position does Eloy play? RF who is coming up to play RF soon? Soler. Do we need to go further with this?
#3. SS...ya that debate has been going on. Cubs have 3 legit ones right now and Geyber Torres as a long term...again.
So this is about control bought. This is not a 3 year control that the Pads sold to the Reds for honestly the same price. This is 4 years and a option year for a proven...not non proven TOR like Arrieta.
So is Hammels woth that? Really ask your self that question because looking it over yes he is worth that price. Not to mention it costs nothing towards next years team and that is going to be a factor with Hammels. Are they going to contend? Yes talent is no effected next year. Phills...ya that is a big haul and they are needing to turn over. That trade makes it easier.
#4 is if Theo and Jed were able to put together this talent in 3 year do you really think they will stop?
1. Hammels contract
6 years/$144M (2013-18), plus 2019 club option
signed extension with Philadelphia 7/25/12
$6M signing bonus
13:$19.5M, 14:$22.5M, 15:$22.5M, 16:$22.5M, 17:$22.5M, 18:$22.5M, 19:$20M club option ($6M buyout)
Control til 2019 at a 22.5 mil per avg. That is low end for TOR. Take a wild guess what it is going to cost for Lester per? Try 25 mil per. Max? 30 per year.
It is not even close.
#2. What position does Eloy play? RF who is coming up to play RF soon? Soler. Do we need to go further with this?
#3. SS...ya that debate has been going on. Cubs have 3 legit ones right now and Geyber Torres as a long term...again.
So this is about control bought. This is not a 3 year control that the Pads sold to the Reds for honestly the same price. This is 4 years and a option year for a proven...not non proven TOR like Arrieta.
So is Hammels woth that? Really ask your self that question because looking it over yes he is worth that price. Not to mention it costs nothing towards next years team and that is going to be a factor with Hammels. Are they going to contend? Yes talent is no effected next year. Phills...ya that is a big haul and they are needing to turn over. That trade makes it easier.
#4 is if Theo and Jed were able to put together this talent in 3 year do you really think they will stop?
JP Hochbaum
Well-known member
- Joined:
- May 22, 2012
- Posts:
- 2,012
- Liked Posts:
- 1,282
I think Hoystein is hoping the Phillies are out of town stupid and willing to take a bunch of lower end prospects. (Lake, Olt, Villanueva, Vogelbach and others)
2323
New member
- Joined:
- May 26, 2013
- Posts:
- 2,228
- Liked Posts:
- 439
No way would I do that. That's insanity. Hamels makes enough money that it makes more sense to just sign someone in FA and keep all those prospects.
2323
New member
- Joined:
- May 26, 2013
- Posts:
- 2,228
- Liked Posts:
- 439
Like I said before, if you sign Scherzer/Lester etc in FA, you have the privilege of paying that much for starting pitching AND keeping all of those prospects.
It's too much. Way too much given the alternative.
CSF77
Well-known member
- Joined:
- Apr 16, 2013
- Posts:
- 17,960
- Liked Posts:
- 2,775
- Location:
- San Diego
Lester should avg 25 mil per and I'd put the odds at 3:1 that he resigns with the Sox. They shed much contract and will have the resource. Jon has said he will resign.
Max is rep by Boras...ya that means mega deal and losing a draft pick....try the 200 mil range....sure that will happen.
This is an opportunity to get a TOR and contend next year. I'm 100% behind it.
Anyways whining about losing talent is lame in general. The farm supports the major league team. The top farm means little if it is not used to support the major league team in one way or another.,
I'm not liking the also ran mentality that the Cubs have been eating.
brett05
867-5309
- Joined:
- Apr 28, 2009
- Posts:
- 27,226
- Liked Posts:
- -1,272
- Location:
- Hell
The issue is Lester ain't coming and Scherzer will need max offer + 20% to come. If Hammels says yes to the Cubs, Chicago Management would be insane not to make the trade.
JP Hochbaum
Well-known member
- Joined:
- May 22, 2012
- Posts:
- 2,012
- Liked Posts:
- 1,282
Straily, Beeler, Jokish, Rusin, Wada, Hendricks, Turner, Doubront, arrieta, Jackson, Wood. That is 11 guy depth for guys who are major league ready.
Why trade for an ACE when you could sign one in the next two years? Are people forgetting Shields? You might also be able to get guys like Peavey, BEckett, and JOsh Johnson on one years deals, not ideal I know.
Why trade for an ACE when you could sign one in the next two years? Are people forgetting Shields? You might also be able to get guys like Peavey, BEckett, and JOsh Johnson on one years deals, not ideal I know.
2323
New member
- Joined:
- May 26, 2013
- Posts:
- 2,228
- Liked Posts:
- 439
Money talks in free agency. If it's a lead pipe lock Lester was going to Boston, he'd already be locked up. There's still the issue of the Red Sox not wanting to give extra years for 30 year old pitchers. Boston is where he had been his whole career. People say this stuff out of sentiment all the time but then do an about face when they see the real money being offered.
Hamels makes in the ball park of what they'd pay any of the big ticket free agents. So, again, it makes little sense to give up all of those prospects when they can get something similar or better and keep the assets.
Not only that but you're likely paying more than what Detroit paid for Price. Hamels is 30. He could go on the decline at any time. Considering the timeline for these guys might actually be 2016, what you're willing to do is a bridge too far.
CSF77
Well-known member
- Joined:
- Apr 16, 2013
- Posts:
- 17,960
- Liked Posts:
- 2,775
- Location:
- San Diego
Outside of Arrieta and Hendricks those arms are other teams trash.
Do you run a discount store?
Do you run a discount store?
CSF77
Well-known member
- Joined:
- Apr 16, 2013
- Posts:
- 17,960
- Liked Posts:
- 2,775
- Location:
- San Diego
Price came with 1 year of control. Hammels has 4...not really the same situation
CSF77
Well-known member
- Joined:
- Apr 16, 2013
- Posts:
- 17,960
- Liked Posts:
- 2,775
- Location:
- San Diego
http://espn.go.com/espnradio/chicago/play?id=11317743
Interview with Hoyer. He leaked that Soler is on the 40 man and Sept is ideal. Said Baez was about him getting 50 games in then the off season to reflect.
It would be stupid to sit and do nothing.
My personal opinion is trade up. That puts the rotation at Hammels, Arrieta, Hendricks, Wood, Jackson.
Then get into the Maeda sweepstakes. They win that then eat Jackson's deal.
Rotation then:
Hammels, Arrieta, Maeda, Wood, Hendricks.
This would be a team that would make teams worried then in the central. Not to mention having Baez, Rizzo, Bryant, Soler every day...ya.
Interview with Hoyer. He leaked that Soler is on the 40 man and Sept is ideal. Said Baez was about him getting 50 games in then the off season to reflect.
It would be stupid to sit and do nothing.
My personal opinion is trade up. That puts the rotation at Hammels, Arrieta, Hendricks, Wood, Jackson.
Then get into the Maeda sweepstakes. They win that then eat Jackson's deal.
Rotation then:
Hammels, Arrieta, Maeda, Wood, Hendricks.
This would be a team that would make teams worried then in the central. Not to mention having Baez, Rizzo, Bryant, Soler every day...ya.
