The Debbie Downer Playoff Stats: The outlook is not good for the Bulls

knoxville7 · Apr 17, 2015

Scoot26 said:
Usually about 5-10... And they're usually in the Finals or winning the Finals every year.

Current superstars Id say are LeBron, Westbrook, Harden, Curry, Anthony Davis, Chris Paul

When they're not injured, Durant and Anthony are ones too.

Rose was one, for one season.

but not always winning it all. Tim Duncan and his 5 rings

Scoot26 · Apr 17, 2015

knoxville7 said:
but not always winning it all. Tim Duncan and his 5 rings

Tim Duncan was once a Superstar. So there's that. He just got old, but can still ball.

knoxville7 · Apr 17, 2015

Scoot26 said:
Tim Duncan was once a Superstar. So there's that. He just got old, but can still ball.

well, was he a superstar last year? lol just saying you don't have to have a team with one to win it all obviously since just last year it was done

clonetrooper264 · Apr 17, 2015

knoxville7 said:
well, was he a superstar last year? lol just saying you don't have to have a team with one to win it all obviously since just last year it was done

True that. It goes against the grain though. I think it's only happened a handful of times.

clonetrooper264 · Apr 17, 2015

knoxville7 said:
but not always winning it all. Tim Duncan and his 5 rings

I think I saw a stat somewhere that said that every Finals has featured Tim Duncan, Dwyane Wade, or Kobe Bryant since like 1999.

Scoot26 · Apr 17, 2015

clonetrooper264 said:
I think I saw a stat somewhere that said that every Finals has featured Tim Duncan, Dwyane Wade, or Kobe Bryant since like 1999.

If you go back to 1991, every finals has contained Tim Duncan, Dwyane Wade, Kobe Bryant, Michael Jordan and Olajuwon. if you go back to 1980 just add Bird, Magic, and Isiah Thomas to that.

Scoot26 · Apr 17, 2015

clonetrooper264 said:
True that. It goes against the grain though. I think it's only happened a handful of times.

Yeah...

I mean last years Spurs, 2004 Pistons are really the only teams without a true Superstar to win it within the last 30 years.

knoxville7 · Apr 17, 2015

Scoot26 said:
Yeah...

I mean last years Spurs, 2004 Pistons are really the only teams without a true Superstar to win it within the last 30 years.

you can argue the 2008 Celtics didn't have a superstar, but yeah seems about 90% of the time to be the case

Axl Rose · Apr 17, 2015

knoxville7 said:
you can argue the 2008 Celtics didn't have a superstar, but yeah seems about 90% of the time to be the case

Garnett would fit under superstar

knoxville7 · Apr 17, 2015

AirGordon7 said:
Garnett would fit under superstar

ehh not so much at that point of his career. still an all star, but that doesn't qualify for this debate. in 2008 garnett was no longer a top 10 player

Axl Rose · Apr 17, 2015

knoxville7 said:
I hear ya...but for some recent examples...dallas in 2011 was 8th and 8th, bulls are 11th and 11th...I just don't feel that theres much difference between being 7th - 13th in those rankings. sure top 3 - 5 in the rankings actually stands out above most the rest of the league, but its been shown you don't have to be top 5 in one or both to win it all. Miami in 2006 was 7th and 9th.

so while I can see why people might use it as a measuring stick to try and figure out who the top contenders might be, I just cant put too much emphasis on it IMO. but im old school, I like to go by the eye test and what I see more so than what numbers say

2011 Mavs were insanely hot and Dirk was playing legendary...thats a tall order for us to ask to happen

what have you seen from this team based on your eye test that concludes they have a legitimate shot?...are we really putting all our faith in 20 game sample "when healthy" ? and ignore everything else?

they had moments (Rockets game) but for the most part ive been unimpressed and have been for awhile

Axl Rose · Apr 17, 2015

this game back on November 7th vs the Sixers pretty much sums up the whole year

http://www.nba.com/games/20141107/CHIPHI/gameinfo.html

crap defense, bad rebounding and blowing leads/underestimating lesser opponents

this game always stuck with me because it showed allot of weaknesses this team had...i kept expecting them to improve as the year went on but its the playoffs and these things still are issues

RamiTheBullsFan · Apr 18, 2015

Irrelevant stats. Pull up the stats which show the ORating and DRating of the Bulls with their team healthy. The 2014-15 Chicago Bulls were injury-plagued. And they still finished above average in both categories (11/30 in both).

Look at the team which won the title 20 years ago. The 1994-95 Houston Rockets were plagued with injuries, as well. They were 7/27 in offense and 12/27 in defense.

The moral of the story is never say never.

RamiTheBullsFan · Apr 18, 2015

Anyone who was surprised at Golden State's defense this year wasn't paying much attention last year. They were the 4th best defensive team. But only 12th/30 offensively. They were playing a lot of isolation ball under Mark Jackson. The offense improved more than anything under Kerr/Adams.

With that said, I would be pretty surprised if the Warriors got out of the West. The Spurs are better. They have the two best frontline players on either of the two teams (Duncan, Splitter). Leonard is probably the most dominant perimeter defender in the game. And the Spurs have Popovich on the sidelines. Yeah, GS has the splash brother back-court. But they are essentially a jump-shooting team. Built for the regular season. A lot of depth and different types of players. But too many come of the bench. They better hope that Speights, Livingston, Ezeli, Holiday, etc. all show up.

I think the Clippers would beat the Warriors in a playoff series, too. I think they are hungrier. I think they have the better coach. I think it would be a repeat of last year. Griffin is an all-around scoring machine. Their only downfall is that DeAndre Jordan can't play in crunch time because of his free throwing.

knoxville7 · Apr 18, 2015

AirGordon7 said:
2011 Mavs were insanely hot and Dirk was playing legendary...thats a tall order for us to ask to happen

what have you seen from this team based on your eye test that concludes they have a legitimate shot?...are we really putting all our faith in 20 game sample "when healthy" ? and ignore everything else?

they had moments (Rockets game) but for the most part ive been unimpressed and have been for awhile

well, simply put...when this team has everyone available to play, they are really tough to beat. if you want to put emphasis on how they played against the bottom feeders of the NBA you go ahead, I wont. this bulls team doesn't get excited to play the sixers of the league....they get up for big games against big time teams. bulls have gone thru the reg season and grinded out the #1 seed before, that didn't interest them this year IMO. IMO they had one thing on their mind and that's playoff time. you wont have to worry about them playing the bottom feeders anyways, its playoff time baby!

Scoot26 · Apr 18, 2015

RamiTheBullsFan said:
Irrelevant stats. Pull up the stats which show the ORating and DRating of the Bulls with their team healthy. The 2014-15 Chicago Bulls were injury-plagued. And they still finished above average in both categories (11/30 in both).

Look at the team which won the title 20 years ago. The 1994-95 Houston Rockets were plagued with injuries, as well. They were 7/27 in offense and 12/27 in defense.

The moral of the story is never say never.

lol, they're not irrelevant at all. IF they were, I would have never posted this.

It shows a general trend in what happens the super majority of the time. If the Bulls accomplished just getting to the Finals this year, it would be a rarity for a team.

As I addressed, they likely took a hit because they were injured. That said, the team hasn't been healthy all season really, so who's to say they're suddenly going to survive 20+ games in the playoffs?

And showing their stats while healthy is cherry picking. I can cherry pick stats that show Cleveland being the #1 O and #1 D in the league this year too.

As far as the 1994-95 Rockets...Not anywhere near as injured as these Bulls. They also made an in-season trade for Hall-of-Famer Clyde Drexler. Their main player was Olajuwon, a Superstar. AND they had won the year before. The Bulls have nothing on that team.

And as I said, this is not 100% proof. Anything can happen and I'm not never saying never, I'm just saying the outlook is not good and the odds are very against the Bulls.

Scoot26 · Apr 18, 2015

RamiTheBullsFan said:
Anyone who was surprised at Golden State's defense this year wasn't paying much attention last year. They were the 4th best defensive team. But only 12th/30 offensively. They were playing a lot of isolation ball under Mark Jackson. The offense improved more than anything under Kerr/Adams.

With that said, I would be pretty surprised if the Warriors got out of the West. The Spurs are better. They have the two best frontline players on either of the two teams (Duncan, Splitter). Leonard is probably the most dominant perimeter defender in the game. And the Spurs have Popovich on the sidelines. Yeah, GS has the splash brother back-court. But they are essentially a jump-shooting team. Built for the regular season. A lot of depth and different types of players. But too many come of the bench. They better hope that Speights, Livingston, Ezeli, Holiday, etc. all show up.

I think the Clippers would beat the Warriors in a playoff series, too. I think they are hungrier. I think they have the better coach. I think it would be a repeat of last year. Griffin is an all-around scoring machine. Their only downfall is that DeAndre Jordan can't play in crunch time because of his free throwing.

To me the Spurs are the only threat to the Warriors. I don't think theyre built for the regular season only though. I also don't think the Clippers could beat the Warriors. The Clippers are a great offensive team, but they're 16th in D-Rating. The Warriors can match their O and play great defense. Soo that doesn't play into LAC's hands.

The thing against GS historically is they didnt win a playoff series last year and they have a rookie head coach.

Axl Rose · Apr 18, 2015

knoxville7 said:
well, simply put...when this team has everyone available to play, they are really tough to beat. if you want to put emphasis on how they played against the bottom feeders of the NBA you go ahead, I wont. this bulls team doesn't get excited to play the sixers of the league....they get up for big games against big time teams. bulls have gone thru the reg season and grinded out the #1 seed before, that didn't interest them this year IMO. IMO they had one thing on their mind and that's playoff time. you wont have to worry about them playing the bottom feeders anyways, its playoff time baby!

i really hope they do have a another gear for the playoffs

although im not sure the defensive woes and bad rebounding are just based on slack

Gasol is just terrible and Noah/Taj haven't looked the same this year

even Jimmy doesn't focus much on defense anymore with his improvement on offense

knoxville7 · Apr 18, 2015

AirGordon7 said:
i really hope they do have a another gear for the playoffs

although im not sure the defensive woes and bad rebounding are just based on slack

Gasol is just terrible and Noah/Taj haven't looked the same this year

even Jimmy doesn't focus much on defense anymore with his improvement on offense

Well I guess you have to ask yourself this...
Did Noah, taj, and jimmy all get worse on defense in one years time? Or, did they just grow tired of the 82 game grind? I have a hard time believing all 3 guys got worse defensively in that short of time span. Every team plays at a higher level in the playoffs

Axl Rose · Apr 18, 2015

knoxville7 said:
Well I guess you have to ask yourself this...
Did Noah, taj, and jimmy all get worse on defense in one years time? Or, did they just grow tired of the 82 game grind? I have a hard time believing all 3 guys got worse defensively in that short of time span. Every team plays at a higher level in the playoffs

its not really far fetched if you think about injuries to Noah/Taj and Jimmy being more focused on offense

ive also believe Gasol is about 50% of the problem on defense..if not more

The Debbie Downer Playoff Stats: The outlook is not good for the Bulls

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